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  • Patch Lady – Results of the consumer survey

    Posted on July 23rd, 2018 at 23:17 Susan Bradley Comment on the AskWoody Lounge

    Once again the caveat that I’m not a professional survey creator, this isn’t a scientific survey, rather I wanted to make sure you, the consumer of Windows, had a voice.

    Users of Windows that aren’t in business are getting less and less.  More and more home users use their phone or a tablet and no longer have a windows device at home.  The questions to the consumer survey were similar to the consultant survey.

    In question 1 I was asking about overall satisfaction with Windows 7 to Windows 10.  As you can see, again a majority of folks are not satisfied.  Written responses to the survey for question 1 can be read here.

    Question 2 I was asking specifically about the satisfaction with Windows 10.  Once again the majority are not satisfied with Windows 10.  Written responses can be read here.

    For question 3, the majority of you said that feature updates are not useful to you.  Only about 10% indicated that they were somewhat useful or extremely useful.  The written responses to Question 3 can be read here.

    Question 4 asked how often you wanted feature releases and the majority of you want it once every two years or once every year.  Only 12% of you said the current two times a year is fine.  The written responses for Question 4 can be read here.

    Question 5 was asking you if Windows 10 was meeting your needs.  As you can see from the results, the majority of you said that it was meeting your needs.  Written responses can be found here.

    The final question was an open ended question what you would change about Windows 10.  You can read the responses here.

    The full survey results of all of the questions are here.

    What do both of these results tell me?  The consumer apps that are put on the professional sku annoy consultants.  The consumers want it more like 7.  More control over updates.  More control over settings.  In Microsoft’s zeal to ensure that we all are kept up to date, they built an operating system that is driving consumers to ipads and androids in its lack of giving consumers control over their devices.  If you want to control patching like Windows 10 does, one HAS to control the ecosystem of applications, hardware, vendors — which is exactly what Microsoft doesn’t do.  And even when they do, in the case of Surface devices, they showcase that we’re still years away from the application ecosystem we need to have total stability in updating.

    So we have a long way to go.  And we need changes.  I often joke that I tilt at windmills.  But this isn’t an imaginary enemy.  This is a real need that we need to fix.

    Once again I thank you all for taking the time and communicating your thoughts.  You have greatly helped me to understand your views.

    My next step will be to write up a more pointed letter to be sent to various leaders and those in charge of Windows 10 to ensure you are heard at Microsoft.

     

    If that helped, take a second to support AskWoody on Patreon

    Home Forums Patch Lady – Results of the consumer survey

    This topic contains 28 replies, has 16 voices, and was last updated by

     JLamede 7 months, 4 weeks ago.

    • Author
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    • #205432 Reply

      Susan Bradley
      AskWoody MVP

      Once again the caveat that I’m not a professional survey creator, this isn’t a scientific survey, rather I wanted to make sure you, the consumer of Wi
      [See the full post at: Patch Lady – Results of the consumer survey]

      Susan Bradley Patch Lady

      Total of 21 users thanked author for this post. Here are last 20 listed.
    • #205452 Reply

      Fred
      AskWoody Lounger

      Thanks Miss SUSAN,

      clear anough to point out that the common user is not amused!

    • #205454 Reply

      Chronocidal Guy
      AskWoody Lounger

      Thank you so much for taking the time to compile these results.  I only hope and pray that someone somewhere at Microsoft is listening to these cries.

      While I use Windows on my office PCs, my primary use at home is for gaming, and what seems to me as the loudest blaring warning alarm about Windows 10 is the configuration management debacle Microsoft has introduced.  If Microsoft cannot even ensure that their updates will run on their own home-grown hardware, how in heaven do they expect to produce an OS that is fit for running the millions of custom built gaming machines built out of whatever parts people can scrounge up?

      It feels to me like Microsoft is trying to push the industry to play catch up.  It feels like they yank the rug out from under software and hardware vendors by rebuilding Windows from the ground up every six months, and then blame the resulting havoc on the vendors for not keeping up with their pace.  Clearly it’s not working that way, and it seems like someone must be delusional for thinking this is a viable way to advance the industry.

    • #205469 Reply

      woody
      Da Boss

      Ground-breaking work. Humbling.

      4 users thanked author for this post.
    • #205470 Reply

      Noel Carboni
      AskWoody_MVP

      Impressive – thank you Susan – but not terribly surprising.

      they built an operating system that is driving consumers to ipads and androids

      Here’s a “bake your noodle” take-away thought:

      What if Microsoft actually WANTS this outcome?

      Imagine that you were the most successful operating system maker on the planet, yet even the most optimistic projections showed that there would be less and less money in doing that in the next 5 to 10 years. If you have more than a few brain cells connected together, would you continue to fund your development staff full steam ahead until the company just failed? Or…

      So how DO you get OUT of a business you were so successful in? You can’t really just stop, cold turkey, right? Wall Street wouldn’t like that very much.

      One way would be to make it SOUND like you’re keeping it going, without really putting serious effort into serious new features. Stop advancing the state of the art, and while you’re at it make it incrementally more irritating and expensive to use. Someone else will surely develop the other major operating system in the world into something consumers then businesses will ultimately want…

      All you have to do is make enough money from inertia to keep the lights on in the Windows division for a decade or so…

      We see what you did there, Microsoft.

      -Noel

      8 users thanked author for this post.
      • #205474 Reply

        wdburt1
        AskWoody Plus

        Part of me agrees with this theory, but the greater part finds an explanation in Microsoft’s  cynical pandering to the stock market and trade press; short-term tactics posing as long-term strategies; management’s readiness to believe their own press releases; and the incompetence and stupidity that take root when a company has gone on too long as a dominant player.

        In the financial press there has been no coverage, so far as I know, of the issues covered in Susan’s survey.  Think about that disconnect.

         

        4 users thanked author for this post.
      • #205506 Reply

        OscarCP
        AskWoody Plus

        Noel Carboni, Assuming you are right (as you might well be), then one might wonder what OS are they actually using now, or are planning to move to, up there at Redmond?

      • #205510 Reply

        anonymous

        Microsoft and its major investors/shareholders have a vested interest to keep the stock price on the move, no matter if long or short… And bad news are good for the business as well.

        Susan, you did a good job! => https://redmondmag.com/articles/2018/07/23/microsoft-pulls-july-net-patches.aspx

      • #205575 Reply

        anonymous

        So, send your share prices plummeting, dump the problem and all is well? What would shareholders think of that?

      • #206515 Reply

        JLamede
        AskWoody Lounger

        I think Noel Carboni’s very much on the right path, but I still have a nagging suspicion that this is Microsoft’s stubborn attempt to introduce a form of control on its users. After all, I have to disable WU every morning after boot-up nowadays, so WS isn’t giving up!

        But over and beyond all this, I think we all owe Susan Bradley an enormous debt of gratitude for her very hard work. Without her, we’d all be up a creek, no question!

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #205479 Reply

      anonymous

      How many want to take a bet that MS will ignore this and just keeping making bad and worse changes? One more step closer to switch to IPAD & MACs and dropping Windows forever after this month problems.

    • #205487 Reply

      anonymous

      Susan

      All your work seems to point towards the fact that Windows should have been offered on a modular basis from day one.   I bet MS will not even read your research let alone act on it such is their arrogance.

      Paul

    • #205498 Reply

      AlexEiffel
      AskWoody_MVP

      I’m curious to see if we took all the open ended questions and made statistics about how many times each element has been mentioned. That’s a huge job.

      Looking at correlations between some things demanded would probably show different profiles of users. Some that like things simple as in no bloat and no changes, others that have different priorities, telemetry worries scattered around other profiles… work for a statistician.

      I wonder if Microsoft do such marketing efforts and chase a certain market they see or if they just think a marketing strategy without looking at what different users want, but rather where they think they can position themselves vs the competition and then they just try it.

      My guess is they have Apple envy, associating the success of the early phones to rapid development cycle and the frequent introduction of features and models to look innovative. They are not only late to the party, but the party is gone. Apple got it last year that innovation sells up to a point, but quality and stability can be a deal breaker and that is why they admitted they made a mistake with IOS11 and they committed to make things better for IOS12 on the stability front and at the expense of new features. The thing is, phones and tablets are already much less exciting than they were, actual models are good enough to many, so quality and durability might become more and more important than before, just like the PC. They won’t turn the PC market into the phone market of 5 years ago. You need to adapt to the market, not try to change the market. You can also try to identify an emerging new market, but I doubt that is what Microsoft has been doing.

       

       

      5 users thanked author for this post.
      • #205614 Reply

        lurks about
        AskWoody Lounger

        There was a time when a new feature genuinely solved a real problem. For example, early word processing programs did not have any spell checking. Spell checking was a feature people really wanted and understood its value. Now there are no new features of that type for an OS. And many of the new features can be easily done as as standalone system. But underlying adding new features, users have always wanted a degree of stability and control.

        3 users thanked author for this post.
    • #205504 Reply

      JohnW
      AskWoody Plus

      Rather than conspiracy theories and evil schemes on Microsoft’s part, I choose to believe the current Windows situation is just due to a massive disconnect on the part of MS senior management.

      3 users thanked author for this post.
      • #205507 Reply

        OscarCP
        AskWoody Plus

        No need for evil schemes: it’s enough for the top mangers to keep their eyes nailed to their own bottom line every three months, and then draw their own conclusions as to how to keep it profitable. Conclusions that might or might not be right, longer term, but that’s what they’ll go with. And not just at MS.

        Then there are also the grandiose schemes that some overconfident captains of industry at times come up with and quite sincerely believe in, particularly in the computing and communications business; schemes that, eventually, fall flat in the real world.

        2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #205512 Reply

      CADesertRat
      AskWoody Plus

      Personally, I don’t think the MS management gives a c**p about consumer PC’s anymore. They have moved to cloud/azure and systems for business. All of their actions & statements show me that they have given up on us lowly consumers. MS has had massive lay-offs of the very people that test the WU’s before release. MS has even made statements to the effect that they are more interested in the cloud than personal PC’s.

      Anyway, Thanks Susan, for the opportunity to vent in the survey no matter what the outcome is. 🙂

      Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
      Grp. A with 2 Win 7 Pro, also 2 Win 10 Pro currently 1803 (1 Desktop, 1 Laptop).

      2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #205524 Reply

      anonymous

      Survey results negative for Microsoft posted on Microsoft One Drive. You did this just for the irony, eh’

      • #205926 Reply

        Susan Bradley
        AskWoody MVP

        Not exactly… I was making sure that all private info was cleared out of the results and the surveymonkey allowed a xls formatting.  I was thinking it was a bit ironic at the time…

        Susan Bradley Patch Lady

    • #205598 Reply

      anonymous

      How would you like a job title like this …
      “Corporate VP of Modern Life and Devices”

      It exists at Microsoft. Last month Microsoft appointed Yusuf Mehdi as “Corporate VP of Modern Life and Devices”. WaaS is not going to make this guy’s job easy. If the results from Susan’s survey were to ever reach his desk, he would understand why.

      https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/07/20/microsoft_still_hankers_after_lifestyle_influencers_but_the_cupboard_looks_bare/

      “… But Microsoft is sorely lacking the services and clever and useful ideas that people might actually use on a daily basis, no matter where they work. Any ideas? It looks like Redmond could use some.

      2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #205599 Reply

      anonymous

      Although I am in agreement with the results, the survey is perhaps biased as it was aimed at users of this forum where people often come when they are dissatisfied. Satisfied consumers probably never come here and would not have been included in the poll.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #205615 Reply

        lurks about
        AskWoody Lounger

        The survey is not scientific if any really are. But I have talked to proles who detest W10 and are considering switching to something else. People who have never heard of askwoody.com or ghacks.net. So there is quite a bit of dissatisfaction but will it reach a tipping point is hard to determine. I would read the surveys as saying MS has serious problems with W10 even if the results are skewed.

        2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #205723 Reply

        Elly
        AskWoody MVP

        Just having so many dissatisfied customers says something, all by itself.

        In my circle of family and friends, the ‘dissatisfied’ customers, not at AskWoody, have had their computers broken by updating. They don’t particularly know enough to attribute it to updating and W10… and if not helped to reinstall a functioning older OS, their machines are just plain broke… and they end up buying new ones, only to have the process repeated. These are not the same as satisfied, happy customers… as much as it may make Microsoft and hardware manufacturers happy. People will be primed to leave to better alternatives (anything that doesn’t BSOD or otherwise break their computers, is a low, low, bar).

        Win 7 Home, 64 bit, Group B

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #205652 Reply

      Nibbled To Death By Ducks
      AskWoody Lounger

      Suasan,

      You’re a jewel.

      The only surprise I got from a quick glance at the results was that “”Most consultants are satisfied with Win 10 meeting their needs.” Maybe it means they’re constantly on call to fix the thing…

      Remember the old “Consultant’s Song”? (To the tune of “The Volga Boatman“)

      “On the one hand,

      On the other hand,

      We get paid either waaay,

      We get paid either waaay…”

      🙂

      Exploding-PC-1

      Win7 Pro SP1 64-bit, Dell Latitude E6330, Intel CORE i5 "Ivy Bridge", Group "A/B [negative] :)", Multiple Air-Gapped backup drives in different locations, "Don't check for updates-Full Manual Mode."
      --
      "The more kinks you put in the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the pipes!" -Scotty

      Attachments:
      You must be logged in to view attached files.
    • #205668 Reply

      anonymous

      If Microsoft does want this outcome, then they are ignoring far too many people.. a big problem would be those that frequently game via Steam, Battlenet, etc. A lot of games are only made for Windows OS (few are made for Mac and less for Linux), so they wouldn’t really be able to hop to mobile, let alone another computing platform. It’s kinda driving the whole PC gaming community into the ground if they really have that mindset.

      By the time a better OS rolls out, I don’t think many games would be rewritten to run on it if programmers don’t even bother with strong support outside of Windows. And if they do, it’ll take a long time for anything stable and worthwhile 🙁

    • #205674 Reply

      anonymous

      Brutally honest…

    • #205729 Reply

      Elly
      AskWoody MVP

      Thank you, @susan Bradley.

      For me, it is helpful to find that I’m not alone, that others are having similar experiences. I’m not hopeful regarding Microsoft, as they seem committed to forcing their way onto Home users for Beta testing (which is entirely different from providing actually increased privacy, security and new and improved features).

      It is reassuring to me that someone, so knowledgeable, and who is very pro-patching, is taking time to listen to end users. Hopefully the patterns are clear…

      My concern is that increasing Microsoft’s awareness will trigger additional marketing/advertising to obfuscate what the problems are, rather than acknowledging and addressing them… not the tactics of an ethical business, but typical of short-term profit chasing, and a denial of responsibility for negative consequences pushed off onto others.

      Microsoft could easily get Windows 7 users to migrate to W10… have a one click, complete privacy option, respect settings, offer a long term stable option, don’t advertise on my OS, and allow finer control of updating so the really bad patches being pushed out could be avoided. There is nothing on W10 worth giving those up for…

      I really do love my Windows 7…

      Win 7 Home, 64 bit, Group B

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #205910 Reply

      SteveTree
      AskWoody Lounger

      This is a place people come to discuss computer issues so it would be hard to claim the result is unexpected.

      Having done the survey, what next. Does the data die or do you try to push to results where it may end up doing some good?

      Group A (but Telemetry disabled Tasks and Registry)
      Win 7 64 Pro desktop
      Win 10 32 Home portable

    • #206021 Reply

      anonymous

      Susan, thanks for a great piece of work, interesting and useful for me and I think could be even more for Microsoft.

      One note re the text: the info that the survey is related to windows “patching” is missing in the intro text and also in the questions.

    Please follow the -Lounge Rules- no personal attacks, no swearing, and politics/religion are relegated to the Rants forum.

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