Acer laptop black screen

[Slowpoke47]

Acer laptop E1-731-4699 dual booting W7 (99% abandoned) and Mint Mate 19.2.  Today, screen will not light up- HD(I think) & fan on, usual lights on also.  All was fine yesterday.

History is that this happened once before some months back, I then assumed the screen itself had died, and installed a replacement; however, in the course of the service the original screen awoke and has been 100% ever since.  The vendor was generous enough to accept the return of the replacement and up until today, as stated, the original worked as expected.

Today I checked the connector on the back of the screen ($%#@& tiny screws!) and it is well seated and taped.  This machine came with the latest BIOS according to the Acer site.

Before I hand it over to a repair shop, credentials unknown, I’m asking here for some thoughts on how to proceed.  All comments appreciated!

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[PKCano]

Gonna ask a dumb question.
Am I right in assuming you have already toggled the keyboard key combination that switches between internal and external monitors?

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

There are no dumb questions when I’m involved.  But I did try both  Fn+F5, which switches to a remote screen, and Fn+F6, which turns the display on/off.

We do have the Acer cookbook downloaded on another computer, so I could confirm the combos.  But this machine came with W7 OS and now, with the Mint dual boot, Mint takes over by default unless W7 is chosen.  I wonder whether the combos are the same for Mint and W7?

Edit- just now shut it down via the power button, and saw a split-second of “less black”  which might mean that this is not a hardware problem.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

• This reply was modified 1 month, 3 weeks ago by Slowpoke47.

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[Alex5723]

Another dumb question : did you check screen brightness ?

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Yes, no effect.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Elly]

Do you have an extra external monitor that you could attach, to see that it works? If it worked, you could change between W7 and Mint and see if it is an operating system issue, or hardware… especially given that bit of light you saw.

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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doriel, Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

I believe I should be seeing the BIOS bootup sequence with the Acer logo.  This sequence runs before the choice of OS is offered.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Paul T]

Slowpoke47 wrote:

History is that this happened once before some months back

Here is the original thread.

Laptop will not boot up

cheers, Paul

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Just reviewed that thread in which several people, you included, took the time to post detailed suggestions and info.  The black screen symptom is exactly the same now.  There doesn’t seem to be a point in going thru the rigamarole of trying the external monitor, especially when that ploy last time didn’t really identify the specific problem.  I’m going to bring it to a repair shop, outline the history, and see if I can pay for a diagnosis.  It may be time to replace it.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[anonymous]

? says:

good idea! the greek squad may be able to fix it quick…

my old lcd acer had a short in the lead at the base of the screen that blew a fuse on the mainboard near the plug to the screen. i used an ohm meter to find the open connection put a dab of solder on it and went back to work. also have had broken wires near the hinges in the harness that goes from the board to the monitor.

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[Paul T]

Is it time for a new laptop? (Isn’t it always time…)

cheers, Paul

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[Slowpoke47]

Well, if it comes to that, it will bring a tear to my eye.  I am not an exemplary consumer due to a combination of cheapness and tradition.  For example, my preferred ride is 28 years old and has a clutch pedal.

Just now connected the desktop screen to the laptop with the same results as several months ago- screen lights up as expected, but without the tray, so no access to the menu.  But finagling from a right-click on the desktop got me online.

As mentioned, next move is to look for a diagnosis from the only computer shop in town.  No idea of their competence, but they’ve been around for many years, so that might be a plus.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Microfix]

Might be worth a try to get a diagnosis from the local repair outlet.(report/diagnostics without repair and only upon customer go-ahead) then weigh it up.
I hate throwing old tech away and would rather TRY than give up on it IMO.
The satisfaction of accomplishment far outweighs simply ‘buying another replacement device’
Worst comes to worst, salvage parts you know do work from the device and look for a second-hand older device. There’s no point buying a ferarri when a toyota will get you there, especially with linux distro’s unless you are a top-end gamer of course.
fingers crossed for you!

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created IT- AE

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Microfix wrote:

Might be worth a try to get a diagnosis from the local repair outlet.(report/diagnostics without repair and only upon customer go-ahead) then weigh it up. I hate throwing old tech away and would rather TRY than give up on it IMO. The satisfaction of accomplishment far outweighs simply ‘buying another replacement device’

Couldn’t have said it better than that.  The throwaway society we live in these days, a product of marketing (natch!) is antithetical to my own tendencies, not just for tech equipment, but everything else as well.

Microfix wrote:

unless you are a top-end gamer

  We are not gamers, top end or otherwise.  My to-do list on any given day is overly optimistic time-wise as it is- just call me Slowpoke.

Dropped off the laptop at the sole local shop this morning.  On hearing my tale of woe, the shop owner urged me to buy a new one- told me “laptop lifespan is 3-5 years” and this one just had its 5th birthday.  But I’m paying $50 for a diagnosis which I expect to see early next week and I’ll go from there.

 

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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Microfix

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[Microfix]

Good show @Slowpoke47! I’m sure you’ll let us know the outcome.
As for newer laptops lasting 3-5 years, sheesh!
I have one that’s STILL going strong into it’s 12th year from new.
Probably slightly over engineered now, with an SSD(5W) instead of the shipped HDD(20W)having less stress on internal motherboard components..which helps.
They obviously don’t make them like they used to

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created IT- AE

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Slowpoke47

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[cmptrgy]

Post #2315287 “On hearing my tale of woe, the shop owner urged me to buy a new one- told me “laptop lifespan is 3-5 years” and this one just had its 5th birthday.”

I’ve lost count on how many times I’ve heard that where I volunteer. I have a laptop & a desktop each one from 2012 and they run Windows 10 Pro excellently now-a-days. In case you’d like to know, as a simple user I focus on monthly security and maintenance check-ups during the week prior to Patch Tuesday. The folks I help enjoy finding out what needs to be addressed, even those who are technically challenged.

It might make sense to buy a new laptop as time & “frustration” can take its toll on us in some situations,
If you do buy a new laptop, consider posting anything on your mind related to how you want to set-up the new laptop the way you wish to do so. For example, will you want your primary log-in account to be a Microsoft or local administrator account?

HP EliteBook 8540w laptop Windows 10 Pro (x64)

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Slowpoke47, Microfix

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[Slowpoke47]

You may notice by my signature that we run Linux Mint, having abandoned MS when they officially threw W7 under the bus.  In contrast to the steady stream of W10 update and other problems posted here, Mint just runs without incident, updates smoothly and easily when needed, and has no telemetry, as does W10.  As a bonus, Mint is all-around faster.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[DrBonzo]

I agree completely about Mint. My daily driver is 19.2. I buy refurbished laptops preferably running Win 7 or 8.1 and then install Mint. You can also sometimes find a refurbished laptop with no OS for pennies on the dollar.

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[Alex5723]

Have you run any hardware/display diagnostics app ?

Try RWEverything (Free)

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[PaulK]

So, he is to peck away blindly at the keyboard, and read black text on a black background?

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Slowpoke47, Microfix

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[Microfix]

ROTFL..as well as posting links to somewhat dubious sites.

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created IT- AE

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Slowpoke47

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[DrBonzo]

@slowpoke – For $200-$300 you can get a nice laptop from Dell Refurbished (to whom I have no affiliation) 50% off any one item through today.

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Thanks for the alternative suggestion, but “refurbished” is sorta nebulous when considering something as complicated as a computer and I could eventually be back in the same boat.  For example, the cable that connects to the monitor flexes each time the lid is opened or closed, and I can easily picture a conductor breaking at the stress point.  In fact, that may be the issue with the Acer.  If it isn’t worth repairing, I’ll buy new.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[DrBonzo]

That’s why I buy from a reputable site. I’ve bought 2 and they are almost indistinguishable from brand new and have held up very well – no problems. Just my 2 cents worth.

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[Bill C.]

I concur with DrBonzo. Look at refurbished, off-lease “business class” laptops

I have bought a number of refurbished “business class” laptops from Microcenter. I have bought Lenovos and Dells. The business class vs. consumer grade, brings easier repair (for corporate IT folks doing HDD/SSD replacements, memory upgradeability, and wired networks and other output ports) as well as often including a DVD player for giving presentations or loading your software (or movies or CDs). Replacing a HDD or SSD is opening a hatch on the bottom and taking one out and sliding the new one in without removing keyboards, bezels, or other components. They usually also have a metal chassis with sturdy hinges and plug jacks, and easily replaceable batteries.

Since you use Linux Mint, the mainstream “business class” also have tried and proven components and just work well with Linux. I used to use Ubuntu, but have now moved to Mint 18 on one and 19.3 on another (and Mint 20 on a small netbook). With the Lenovo and its HDD caddy setup, removal is real easy and if I ever need to, I can pop the original Win7Pro HDD back in.

I always budget for a new SSD (real cheap now) and more memory. The refurbs typically come with 90 or 180 day replacement warrantees. I have yet to pay over $400 (for Intel i7 or i5 CPUs), and my oldest is going on 7 years. All looked brand new when I got them.

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[Slowpoke47]

Forgot to mention- when I was at the computer shop, I did get a faint whiff of condescension, meaning my laptop was not worth his talents.  But the prospect of a $50 “bribe” brought him around.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[cyberSAR]

In all fairness, if your machine is a pentium with 4gb of memory I don’t blame a shop advising you to look at a new machine. What do they charge, $80-$100/hr for service? Let’s say the LCD is bad. Is it worth spending $200 or more on that machine or adding a bit more to get something newer and more powerful?

I will generally evaluate a machine for free or low-cost until I have to crack it open. Then if I repair it I have to stand behind my repair. Oh, I changed the LCD and a month later memory module or HDD goes bad. Do you want a warranty job? Is it now worth the cost of the initial repair PLUS the new one?

Don’t get me wrong, I have 15-year old laptops still running and in service. I’ll fix them if they are mine or a relative’s if I have free or cheap parts. Anything more it is scrapped. I’m also happy to give a client free advice on doing the repairs themselves, but I won’t spend 4-hrs of my day on the phone for free. I have bills to pay too.

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SkipH, Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Thanks for your input- we don’t need tons of memory in this machine and there are no files stored on it.  It has just the suite of programs that are included with the Mint OS.  All this is because the only thing we use it for is Internet access, mainly as a portable television, via wifi.

Files and programs for computer operations are on a desktop.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Slowpoke47]

An update on this saga- the computer shop diagnosed the problem as a faulty display cable; however, it was a default diagnosis, meaning they could find nothing else wrong.  At the owner’s suggestion, his shop will replace the cable and if that’s not the answer, he’ll eat the cable, but I’ll pay for the labor (he says 2 hr.) minus the diagnostic fee.  That sounded fair to me, and what’s more, his former condescending attitude was gone.

I had previously reached the same default conclusion, and my plan was to test the individual conductors in that cable for continuity.  I was not able to locate a new cable, but the shop apparently has additional sources.  I gave them the go-ahead.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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DrBonzo

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[Slowpoke47]

The story continues- today I had a call from the repair shop to tell me that his source for the replacement cable had cancelled the order due to lack of availability.  Shop says he has another source, that order went out today.

Not having that machine is just a minor inconvenience, so we’ll wait.  While I had the shop owner on the phone, I asked why the cable replacement was a default, or “guess” diagnosis, although it had been my theory as well.  In my electronics repair experience, when I suspect a damaged conductor, I confirm it one way or the other with a continuity tester or an ohmmeter.  In this case, I didn’t do that myself for fear of inflicting collateral damage when opening the case.  Turns out, the shop didn’t do that either- looks like all they have done so far is to check the connector on the back of the display.

Further developments when available.  Meanwhile, Merry Christmas to all my AskWoody compatriots!

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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Microfix

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[Ascaris]

Slowpoke47 wrote:

While I had the shop owner on the phone, I asked why the cable replacement was a default, or “guess” diagnosis, although it had been my theory as well. In my electronics repair experience, when I suspect a damaged conductor, I confirm it one way or the other with a continuity tester or an ohmmeter.

It would be quite difficult to do that with a flex cable. That’s why I suggested replacing it too when this first happened rather than trying to ohm it out, which ordinarily would have been my first thought as well.

It’s probably a 30-pin connector, and the connector on each end is different, so you’d have to map the connectors on each end to one another, and figure out a way to get a good connection on each end for the multimeter. Ideally, you’d have the opposite gendered connector of the same type on each end, but that’s already getting into the weeds, so to speak, and I don’t know that these are available. The connector on the LCD end is standard, but it may not be on the other (motherboard) end. And you’d have to test it up to 30 times (not all of the pins are necessarily connected), and even then, it would be with the cable in a different position than it was in when it was installed in the laptop.

The unit has worked, then not worked, then worked again after screen replacements (that also serve to “jostle” the flex cable), so it’s probably now still not completely dead, but instead may have the copper strands broken within the insulation in one or more of the wires, which could make a connection when the cable is in some positions, but not others. That could make it appear to work when being ohmed out on the bench, but not in the real installed position (with the source of the greatest stress on the cable, probably around where it bends most sharply to enter the hinge cover, intact).

As for the 3-5 year lifespan of laptops… well, sure, if you tell every owner who comes through the door with a broken 3+ year old laptop to replace it, that kind of establishes that age as the lifespan! But his is a repair shop for laptops, so it does seem a little odd that he’d be advising against repairing a laptop. Hopefully the part will be found.

I’ve thus far been lucky enough to always be able to get parts for my laptops, as they’ve worked out to be common units that have a ton of them out there, which means more chances for parts to find their way into the secondary market.

Acer does sell parts (through a distributor), though they may not have any for a 5 year old unit. If the repair guy calls Acer, they may be able to help. I did that when I lost the rubber foot on the bottom of my Swift… Acer directed me to the company that handles their parts sales, and they had the bottom cover available (the feet were not a separate item). I found it cheaper to get one on eBay for a third of the price (used, but in pristine condition), but at least Acer made an effort to make the parts available. Unlike some Cupertino-based companies named after fruit that do everything they can to thwart aftermarket repairs…

 

Group "L" (KDE Neon Linux 5.20.5 User Edition)

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Many thanks for your detailed response.  My theoretical musings re testing the cable led me to the same conclusion that you have described, and I do realize that my theory here is difficult if not impossible to translate into action.  While my (parsimonious) nature recoils at throwing parts at a problem hoping for a win, in this case the failure is amply circumscribed and the cable has in all probability failed.

As an old geezer myself, I well remember the days before the massive shift to Chinese manufacture.  Both the initial quality and useful life of all sorts of manufactured goods have deteriorated substantially from then to now, and the prescribed remedy is to buy a new one.  Can’t begin to list the products I have bought from formerly uplevel manufacturers, now sourced from China, that have disappointed.  Sad but true.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Slowpoke47]

The solution for this problem has apparently reached a dead end.  The repair shop tells me it has tried three vendors who showed the display cable in inventory but each in turn cancelled the order- if a vendor in fact had this part, you would expect they would prefer to sell it rather than keep it on the shelf.

So, as it stands this is now an Acer paperweight, young at 5 years of age.  Would like some feedback from the tech-savvy members here- what would you do next?

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Microfix]

Did you ask the repair shop for the item/ part number?
That would certainly help, sourcing out a replacement (DIY searching/ purchasing online) and give it to the repair shop to fix it 😉

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created IT- AE

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

When I left the computer with the shop, I offered to give them the part # (the gold standard for fixing anything), which I had previously determined.  The owner thanked me but preferred to look it up himself.  No offense taken, he likely wanted to be sure the # was correct.

I had previously searched the # myself, but had no luck except for used cables on ebay- in this case, a used cable is a major roll of the dice- any other machine that was scrapped for parts could not possibly have had a cushier life than ours- we babied it from day 1.

As of today, couldn’t find the cable new or used.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[geekdom]

Can you locate the correct part number and any general-purpose, generic part numbers? It’s a fairly tedious process reading across specs and determining Part No. XYZ-01234 is now Part No. ABC-43210-S.

Beta Work {Got backup and coffee}
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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

This is an Acer Aspire E1-731-4699. Screen is LED

s/n NXMGAAA004442007167200

SNID 44200181472

Video cable p/n 50.RYNN5.004                                                                               alt p/n VA70C_LVDS_CABLE

These are the specs I searched, today and about 1 1/2 months ago.

 

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[geekdom]

Try here:
https://store.acer.com/en-us/catalogsearch/result/?q=display+cable

Try here:
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=display+cable+acer+50.RYNN5.004&ref=nb_sb_noss

Beta Work {Got backup and coffee}
offline▸ Win10Pro 2004.19041.572 x64 i3-3220 RAM8GB HDD Firefox83.0b3 WindowsDefender TRV=1909 WuMgr
offline▸ Win10Pro 20H2.19042.685 x86 Atom N270 RAM2GB HDD WindowsDefender WuMgr GuineaPigVariant
online▸ Win10Pro 2004.19041.746 x64 i5-9400 RAM16GB HDD Firefox85.0 WindowsDefender TRV=2004 WuMgr

• This reply was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by geekdom.
• This reply was modified 1 week, 2 days ago by geekdom.

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Thanks for your assistance.  I did try both of those sources myself using the two part #s.  I cruised around the Acer site looking for help but Acer is seemingly not interested in out-of-warranty assistance.

I did find at least one vendor that showed a picture of the cable, but noted “out of stock”  and no comment on whether it would become available in the future.  From the pictures on your Acer link I can see that none of the items shown look like the one I need.

The Amazon search you linked shows a multitude of cables, but I didn’t see a visual match there either, and the search results were returned using the correct part #.

One question that comes to mind is, other than configuration, is there a difference between cables for LCD and LED applications?

Another question- while I have extensive repair experience on anything from cars and heavy equipment to non-computer electronics, and an assortment of tools including various test equipment and a pencil soldering iron, is it feasible to attempt this repair myself if I find a cable?  I have replaced the screen on this laptop (no big deal) but have never disassembled the case.  The shop owner wants nothing to do with it, referred to it as a “charity case” and wants it gone from his shop.

I may go back to the vendor(s) who show the cable as out of stock and call them.

 

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[anonymous]

? says:

“charity,” has a biblical ring to it, no?

i used guides from youtube to get to the bottom of acer extensa 4420 to change cmos, sucessfully, take a look at these to see if you want to undertake the “open the case,” project…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfT1ntv-uiw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyjLfwdjzcU

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Slowpoke47

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[anonymous]

? says:

maybe try E-Bay?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-LCD-LED-Video-Cable-for-Acer-Aspire-E1-521-E1-531-E1-571-V3-571/112145328411?hash=item1a1c61e91b:g:xy4AAOSwYIxX46tr

cable seems to fit several similar acer models…

or buy a “for parts,” laptop shares part number with:

Acer TravelMate P273-M, P273-MG.New Acer Aspire E1-731 E1-771 V3-731 V3-771 Laptop Lcd Led Cable 50.RYNN5.004

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

Used only offered on ebay.  Seems to me that, assuming this cable has failed, the most likely spot for an intermittent short would be at the lid hinge point, where the cable flexes whenever the lid opens or closes.  This would also be true for a used cable, and doesn’t bode well for longevity, especially with the previous life of the donor unknown.

These are some links that I found for new cables.  It does seem that LCD and LED are interchangeable.  I’ll likely try calling some of these vendors for more info.  Sprechen sie Deutsche, anyone?

Acer 50. RYNN5.004 Notebook Spare Part – Component Cable for Laptop, A at Amazon.com

Acer LVDS Cable, 50.RYNN5.004 – EET

Acer 50.RYNN5.004 notebook reserve-onderdeel Kabel | RedShell

New Gateway NE71B NV76R Lcd Led Cable 50.RYNN5.004

50.RYNN5.004 Acer Cable LVDS Cable | | Zandparts | Zandparts

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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geekdom

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[anonymous]

Screens for laptops are readily available, inexpensive and not difficult to replace if you have a lot of patience dealing with snaps and adhesives.

Can you boot into BIOS/Setup screen (hold F2 while turning on or whatever is appropriate)?  If so, the screen’s OK.

Mint users here notwithstanding, it has rather primitive graphics support, nuveau and bumblebee are ancient utilities, may or may not work  if selected.  Black screens are not uncommon, been there.  Possibly you have an incompatible combo of graphics drivers.  I don’t use Mint, only did for a few days but there are settings to enable and disable different graphics utilities.  Same can be done from the command line.

So, if you can get into Setup, it’s probably the OS.  Linux isn’t immune to weird update effects.  Mint developers decided last year they would pull away from Ubuntu’s “oppression,” a bizarre goal for a small team.  Try reinstalling Mint.

JMO but I’ve tried over a dozen distros, all on a 10 year old laptop (since Linux is supposed to run on “anything,” hah!) and finally settled on KDE neon (based on Ubuntu, as is Mint.)  You get low memory usage, excellent touchpad smoothness (poor on Mint) and the beautiful Plasma desktop, which is almost the same as Windows and Cinnamon.

Most Linux distros with a high user base are as easy to use and, mostly, to install as Mint so try some others.

Ubuntu’s probably the best supported, I used it for quite a while but the gnome desktop and lack of features without a huge number of extensions will probably drive you crazy.

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[Slowpoke47]

Update- of those sites (in English) that listed the cable, although out of stock, I couldn’t raise anyone via telephone.

Just sent an email to this site, they are in Sweden.  https://www.zandparts.com/en/gateway-50-rynn5-004

Edit- site came back instantly with an auto-generated response including a reference #.  A long shot, maybe, but WTH?

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[geekdom]

Make sure any site you order from is legitimate before you plunk down plastic.

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Slowpoke47

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[Slowpoke47]

For sure, true for any online purchase.  I normally go through PayPal, in part because they can assist in resolving disputes.

In any case, buying the cable from this source, in Sweden, seems like a long shot.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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[Slowpoke47]

Cable just ordered from above mentioned Swedish site.  After an email thread with their customer service rep, I feel reassured that this site is legit and, in any case, if there is a problem, PayPal will intervene on my behalf.  The ordering process was no different than any other using PayPal.  Rep tells me delivery will take about three weeks.

While searching this part # I had quite a few hits from various countries in Europe, and while I am not really multilingual, it did seem that at least some of them could supply the part.  (Fortunately, the Swedish site offers the option of English translation.)  After exchanging emails with the rep, and seeing that other European sites sell this cable, could be that there is a central repository of some sort from which the vendors draw.

Looks like cost including overseas shipping is about $37, of which $27 is shipping cost- a calculated roll of the dice (since it is a default diagnosis) that could get this 5-year-old 17″ screen laptop back in use.  A new replacement would be around $500.

Linux Mint Mate 19.2

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Microfix, geekdom

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[anonymous]

? says:

good news! they make good cars the Swedes. keep fighting the “plannned obsolescence.”

i buy “parts,” acer laptops from ebay. the individual part is usually more expensive than the whole machine. this acer model (originally Vista) has “weak,” hinges, and when they malfunction it breaks the lcd cable and the top shell along the way…

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