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  • Back-up problem

    Posted on Slowpoke47 Comment on the AskWoody Lounge

    Home Forums AskWoody support Windows Windows 7 Questions: Windows 7 Back-up problem

    Topic Resolution: Resolved

    This topic contains 124 replies, has 16 voices, and was last updated by

     Microfix 2 months, 2 weeks ago.

    • Author
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    • #312768 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Running W7 HP 64 bit on Dell desktop.  Started having trouble with automatic weekly backups to a Seagate external drive about 3 weeks ago after years of no-drama backups.  The automatic function now fails and attempting manual backup through the Seagate app or the Windows Backup procedure also fails.  All Seagate scan procedures (from Seagate tech support) show the drive as being good to go.  Uninstalled and reinstalled the software (both up-to-date) in case a glitch had come up, made no difference.  Also, now I get a pop-up from MS Autoplay that never appeared before, this fails also (see attachments).

      There is plenty of room on the drive.

      Could there be an update from MS that is causing a problem?  Should I go the System Restore route?  Any suggestions appreciated!

      Slowpoke (group B)

      <h6>Attachments:</h6>

        <li id=”d4p-bbp-attachment_312729″ class=”d4p-bbp-attachment d4p-bbp-attachment-jpg bbp-atthumb bbp-inline”>


        <p class=”wp-caption-text”>Autoplay-pop-up.jpg</p>

        <li id=”d4p-bbp-attachment_312730″ class=”d4p-bbp-attachment d4p-bbp-attachment-jpg bbp-atthumb bbp-inline”>


        <p class=”wp-caption-text”>Screnshot-1-16-19.jpg</p>

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #312778 Reply

      geekdom
      AskWoody Plus

      From your picture, it looks like you are running plain-vanilla Windows backup that came with your system. If the backup fails, the event viewer will log an error.

      What is the error number and information?

      Group G{ot backup} Win7Pro · x64 · SP1 · i3-3220 · TestBeta
      • #312811 Reply

        Slowpoke47
        AskWoody Plus

        Thanks for responding.  I couldn’t find anything current in the events log.  But, the backups also failed when going thru the Seagate software, which I tried first.

        Installed updates that seem to be about the time problems arose are:

        Adobe Acrobat Reader 19.010.20069

        KB4459934, KB4466536, KB4459942, KB4471318, KB4483187

        I’m considering uninstalling these one at a time to see with each uninstall I can get update to run.

        Slowpoke (group B)

        • #312821 Reply

          PKCano
          Da Boss

          Recommend you start with the Monthly Rollup. That’s the big one.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #312827 Reply

            Slowpoke47
            AskWoody Plus

            Thank you.  How can I find out which one that is?

            Slowpoke (group B)

            • #312830 Reply

              Microfix
              Da Boss

              it will be listed in AKB2000003 for group B

              | W8.1 Pro x64 | Linux x64 Hybrids | W7 Pro x86 | XP Pro O/L
    • #312829 Reply

      PKCano
      Da Boss

      KB4471318 is the December Rollup. After the reboot, give it 20-30 minutes after login before you try anything.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #312861 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      KB4471318 is the December Rollup. After the reboot, give it 20-30 minutes after login before you try anything.

      Thanks, I’ll start there.  And thanks for the tip re waiting.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #312931 Reply

      GoneToPlaid
      AskWoody Plus

      The Autoplay thing was added when you ran Windows Backup. You mentioned that your issues started around 3 weeks ago. In addition to installing any Windows Updates, did you also install any driver updates which Microsoft presented via Windows Update? I never install any hardware driver updates which MS presents through Windows Update, since doing so has caused problems on several occasions. I always get driver updates straight from the hardware manufacturer’s web site.

      Let’s also check that your backup hard drive really is good to go. Please download CrystalDiskInfo 8.0: https://crystalmark.info/en/software/crystaldiskinfo/

      Unzip the file to a temporary folder and then run either DiskInfo32.exe or DiskInfo64.exe, depending on whether your Windows is 32-bit or is 64-bit. Please report whether or not CrystalDiskInfo displays a yellow “Caution” for your backup hard drive.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #312962 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      The Autoplay thing was added when you ran Windows Backup. You mentioned that your issues started around 3 weeks ago. In addition to installing any Windows Updates, did you also install any driver updates which Microsoft presented via Windows Update? I never install any hardware driver updates which MS presents through Windows Update, since doing so has caused problems on several occasions. I always get driver updates straight from the hardware manufacturer’s web site. Let’s also check that your backup hard drive really is good to go. Please download CrystalDiskInfo 8.0: https://crystalmark.info/en/software/crystaldiskinfo/

      Unzip the file to a temporary folder and then run either DiskInfo32.exe or DiskInfo64.exe, depending on whether your Windows is 32-bit or is 64-bit. Please report whether or not CrystalDiskInfo displays a yellow “Caution” for your backup hard drive.

      Thanks for the response.  That link returns an error message.

      Mod. edit: URL fixed.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #313067 Reply

      anonymous

      Has anyone ever actually restored a Windows Backup Image?

      I really needed it years ago in Win 8.1 and it wouldn’t work. Fortunately Reflect will restore an image created on Windows Backup; what an amazing program.

      I checked online and what I read was that you can create a backup image in windows, but it is near impossible to restore it.

      • #313169 Reply

        mledman
        AskWoody Plus

        I’ve restored a windows backup image to a new SSD.  Went fine no drama.

        Mark

      • #313242 Reply

        Joulia.S
        AskWoody Plus

        I have, a couple of years ago i restored the system with the Windows backup image

        and it all worked perfectly,no problems at all.

        Windows 7,Home Premium 64 bit - Lenovo laptop
        Group A - Intel (R)Core i7 Processors -

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #313248 Reply

          anonymous

          That is good to hear. It was around the time of Win 8 change to 8.1, so maybe things have improved or I was part of group that did something wrong.

    • #314162 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Thread starter here- b/u problem with W7 system and Seagate external drive still a mystery.  After years of no-drama backups, now backup attempt shows red icon in tray, b/u failed.  B/u log on Notepad (see attached) shows b/u successful but most line items show “skipped.”  Notepad-backup-log
      Drive passed several tests and scans with flying colors, it’s working correctly.  At one point, saw pop-up with message saying not enough room on drive for backup, so formatted the drive to clear it.  Deleted and reinstalled the drive software (both current versions) with no change.  Did System Restore dating to before this problem started, about a month ago, still no joy.

      Disc usage shows 8 GB used on drive after the latest backup attempt showing backup failed. Not sure what is actually going on here or what to do.  Seems like the OS and the drive are not on speaking terms.  Suggestions?

      Slowpoke (group B)

      Attachments:
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      • #314274 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        Hi Slowpoke,

        Tell me about the backup drive. Is it an external drive? Are you connecting it via USB3?

        Separately, I see that your backup log file is reporting files which were not backed up because the file attributes are not supported. That is quite strange.

        Your screen capture additionally shows the following:

        — Total files protected: 8055
        — Unable to backup 1 file(s)

        Yet clearly, many files were skipped during the backup because the files had unsupported system and hidden file attributes.

        What program generated the screen capture which you posted? Is this from Seagate’s backup program?

        Have you tried downloading, installing, and trying to backup your computer using the free version of Macrium Reflect?

        Best regards,

        –GTP

         

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #314279 Reply

          satrow
          AskWoody MVP

          Lack of Admin rights?

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #314282 Reply

            GoneToPlaid
            AskWoody Plus

            That there is a really good guess! Yet if this is the case, what changed such that Slowpoke suddenly started having issues when performing backups? I am kind of suspecting that Slowpoke may have a malware issue?

            • This reply was modified 3 months ago by
               GoneToPlaid.
            1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #314290 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Hi Slowpoke, Tell me about the backup drive. Is it an external drive? Are you connecting it via USB3? Separately, I see that your backup log file is reporting files which were not backed up because the file attributes are not supported. That is quite strange. Your screen capture additionally shows the following: — Total files protected: 8055 — Unable to backup 1 file(s) Yet clearly, many files were skipped during the backup because the files had unsupported system and hidden file attributes. What program generated the screen capture which you posted? Is this from Seagate’s backup program? Have you tried downloading, installing, and trying to backup your computer using the free version of Macrium Reflect? Best regards, –GTP

      I’ve used the same Seagate FreeAgent Go external drive connected to the same port with the same USB cable for years without drama for automatic weekly backups. I don’t know just what  “unsupported system and hidden file attributes” means, but the files are the same as before.

      Clicking on the Seagate icon in the tray produces a pop-up menu, one of the options is “view backup log” which generates the above posted results on Notepad.  The whole of that log shows every line item skipped, but, as you noted, also says 8055 files protected.  As I recall, previously that log never said anything about files skipped.  Start>Computer shows 8 GB used.  During my efforts to deal with this problem, at one point I got a message that the Seagate did not have room for a new backup, so I formatted it, leaving it blank, and confirmed that.  So, this failed backup has done something that used 8 GB of the external drive.

      Another oddball change is that suddenly, when I attempt to start a backup, Windows Autoplay pops up and wants me to set up a backup plan through the OS, which never happened before- everything went through the Seagate software.

      Not familiar with Macrium Reflect.  Is that software that would back up to the Seagate drive?

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #314598 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        Macrium Reflect will back up to anything you choose. As far as the AutoPlay popup, you can go into Control Panel >> AutoPlay, and uncheck “Use AutoPlay for all media and devices”, or scroll down the list and select to “Take no action” for anything related to Windows Backup. Personally, I never use AutoPlay as it is a potential security risk.

        2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #314291 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Lack of Admin rights?

      Don’t think so- just tried other functions that require admin rights and they are readily available.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314293 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      That there is a really good guess! Yet if this is the case, what changed such that Slowpoke suddenly started having issues when performing backups? I am kind of suspecting that Slowpoke may have a malware issue?

      Admin rights intact.  Do you have any suggestions as to what to do next? (By the way, I use Emsisoft anti-malware)

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314299 Reply

      Microfix
      Da Boss

      Just a thought, has any services been disabled inadvertantly that prevent the backup procedure?

      | W8.1 Pro x64 | Linux x64 Hybrids | W7 Pro x86 | XP Pro O/L
      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #314305 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Just a thought, has any services been disabled inadvertantly that prevent the backup procedure?

      How can I determine if this is so?

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #314306 Reply

        Microfix
        Da Boss

        Click Start> Run and type in services.msc and hit [Enter]
        Then look for ‘Windows Backup Service’ in the list.
        If it is not started, try starting it.

        | W8.1 Pro x64 | Linux x64 Hybrids | W7 Pro x86 | XP Pro O/L
        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #314311 Reply

          Slowpoke47
          AskWoody Plus

          Click Start> Run and type in services.msc and hit [Enter] Then look for ‘Windows Backup Service’ in the list. If it is not started, try starting it.

          Thank you, I’ll do that.  But as stated, MS is suddenly trying to get me to set up backup using the OS, this never came up before.

          Meanwhile, I just ran a malware scan with the Emsisoft app and it came back clean.  Is it possible that the Emsisoft is causing the issue?

          Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314315 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Click Start> Run and type in services.msc and hit [Enter] Then look for ‘Windows Backup Service’ in the list. If it is not started, try starting it.

      Follow-up- Yes Windows Backup is in the list.  This brings me to the same screen that wants me to set up backups through the OS.  I think this is the wrong direction to go in.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #314316 Reply

        Microfix
        Da Boss

        my bad, I meant to type ‘seagate backup service’ or something similar in services 🙂
        make sure it’s set to automatic (as you have it scheduled)
        You cold also check your ‘task scheduler’ to see if it’s been disabled there too.

        | W8.1 Pro x64 | Linux x64 Hybrids | W7 Pro x86 | XP Pro O/L
        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #314317 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      my bad, I meant to type ‘seagate backup service’ or something similar in services 🙂 make sure it’s set to automatic (as you have it scheduled) You cold also check your ‘task scheduler’ to see if it’s been disabled there too.

      I have already checked the automatic setting.  The backups do start when scheduled, and then report back as “failed.”  But something must be happening- the last “failed” backup used 8 GB on the backup drive.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314324 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      my bad, I meant to type ‘seagate backup service’ or something similar in services 🙂 make sure it’s set to automatic (as you have it scheduled) You cold also check your ‘task scheduler’ to see if it’s been disabled there too.

      Just checked for the Seagate entry in services and all is well there.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314330 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      This problem came up, as far as I can tell, out of nowhere.  As mentioned, no changes were made to software or hardware previous to this problem’s arising.  I have investigated in every direction I or others here and elsewhere can come up with, to no advantage.

      Although the Seagate drive tests as functional, in computer years it is a dinosaur and Seagate doesn’t want anything to do with it support-wise, they’re for selling me their backup service.

      Perhaps it is no longer a drive at all, but in truth a paperweight.  Perhaps its self-scan and the other scans that pronounced it healthy are pulling my leg.  Perhaps… it’s time for a new drive.

      Tomorrow at 8 AM is the next scheduled backup.  I’ll see what happens then.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • This reply was modified 3 months ago by
         Slowpoke47.
      • #314640 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        Have you tried manually copying files/folders over to that Seagate drive? The result may yield some useful information.

         

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #314380 Reply

      PaulK
      AskWoody Lounger

      Comments:
      1. Files named Thumbs.db contain the thumbnails for the (photos) in that containing folder. If missing, the thumbnails and Thumbs.db are regenerated when the folder photos are next viewed. They are not critical, they are just space-takers.

      2. Attributes. (Ref. #314290.) There are several attributes, or characteristics, associated with each object (folder, file, etc.). You can see two of them (Read-only, Hidden) when you right-click on a (folder or file) > Properties. Another attribute is System. Typically objects that have both the Hidden and System attributes set are items that Windows really doesn’t want someone else to change. One can inspect the set of attributes for an object by: Opening a Command prompt, navigate to the folder or file of interest, [ attrib * ], or name a specific entity.

      3. Is there any setting or discussion in the Seagate program that pertains to file attributes?

      4. Both KB4471318 (December) and KB4480970 (January) address the following issues: “Security updates to … Windows Storage and Filesystems, …” I’ve not been able to find the particulars on this arena. Perhaps this is moot anyway.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #314471 Reply

        Slowpoke47
        AskWoody Plus

        Comments: 1. Files named Thumbs.db contain the thumbnails for the (photos) in that containing folder. If missing, the thumbnails and Thumbs.db are regenerated when the folder photos are next viewed. They are not critical, they are just space-takers. 2. Attributes. (Ref. #314290.) There are several attributes, or characteristics, associated with each object (folder, file, etc.). You can see two of them (Read-only, Hidden) when you right-click on a (folder or file) > Properties. Another attribute is System. Typically objects that have both the Hidden and System attributes set are items that Windows really doesn’t want someone else to change. One can inspect the set of attributes for an object by: Opening a Command prompt, navigate to the folder or file of interest, [ attrib * ], or name a specific entity. 3. Is there any setting or discussion in the Seagate program that pertains to file attributes? 4. Both KB4471318 (December) and KB4480970 (January) address the following issues: “Security updates to … Windows Storage and Filesystems, …” I’ve not been able to find the particulars on this arena. Perhaps this is moot anyway.

        Thank you for responding.  I’m afraid much of your post is beyond my degree of technical understanding.  My computer “skills” have come by blundering along, reading what can find that I can understand, and with help from those such as yourself who offer guidance.  I can say that there is nothing in the Seagate program or manual that mentions attributes.

        Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314408 Reply

      Paul T
      AskWoody MVP

      That doesn’t look like a failing backup to me, more like a successful one with skipped files.
      From your initial post it seems the Registry isn’t being backed up, so you are only getting a data backup, not an image.

      Change to one of the free backup products and create regular image backups and separate, more frequent, data backups. Don’t forget to create a boot device from your backup software so you can recover from a disaster.

      cheers, Paul

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #314478 Reply

        Slowpoke47
        AskWoody Plus

        That doesn’t look like a failing backup to me, more like a successful one with skipped files. From your initial post it seems the Registry isn’t being backed up, so you are only getting a data backup, not an image. Change to one of the free backup products and create regular image backups and separate, more frequent, data backups. Don’t forget to create a boot device from your backup software so you can recover from a disaster. cheers, Paul

        Some data is definitely going to the Seagate drive, today’s scheduled 8 AM backup ran for a minute or so, then returned the by-now familiar red “failed” message, but there is another 8GB of data on the external drive.

        This screenshot shows which files are supposed to be backing up- if I understand this correctly, it backs up personal files only.  Should I be backing up C and/or D as well?  Once again, I’m baffled because all was working properly (AFAIK) up until recent weeks, no idea what changed.

        Seagate-screenshot
        I have a dialog going with Emsisoft (my malware program) and they are checking the Emsisoft logs I sent to see if there is any conflict with the Seagate software.  Something must have happened to stir up this problem, and I wondered whether an Emsisoft update could be the culprit.

        Slowpoke (group B)

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    • #314486 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      To all who responded, my grateful thanks.  Would appreciate some advice on general backup strategy-

      1.  Which files should I be backing up weekly- personal?  OS? Discs C and/or D?

      2.  What is “image backup” vs. “data backup”?

      3.  Is it necessary to clear (format) the backup drive when “full”?  In several previous years’ backups, this has never come up, this is a 500 GB drive.  I thought the new backup overwrote the older one, apparently not true.

      4.  Any other guidance on backing up appreciated!

      Hi Slowpoke, Tell me about the backup drive. Is it an external drive? Are you connecting it via USB3? Separately, I see that your backup log file is reporting files which were not backed up because the file attributes are not supported. That is quite strange. Your screen capture additionally shows the following: — Total files protected: 8055 — Unable to backup 1 file(s) Yet clearly, many files were skipped during the backup because the files had unsupported system and hidden file attributes. What program generated the screen capture which you posted? Is this from Seagate’s backup program? Have you tried downloading, installing, and trying to backup your computer using the free version of Macrium Reflect? Best regards, –GTP

      Just reread this post.  GoneToPlaid, do you know if the Macrium Reflect software you suggested can be used to run this Seagate external drive?  Would I then remove the Seagate software?

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • This reply was modified 3 months ago by
         Slowpoke47.
      • #314521 Reply

        geekdom
        AskWoody Plus

        3. Is it necessary to clear (format) the backup drive when “full”? In several previous years’ backups, this has never come up, this is a 500 GB drive. I thought the new backup overwrote the older one, apparently not true.

        Yes, if there is insufficient room on your backup drive, you must clear off old backups to make room for new backups — otherwise the new backup will fail.

        You do not need to reformat nor clear the backup drive, but you may want to delete some early, unnecessary backups. What I would suggest, if you want a complete backup history, is to purchase a new backup external hard drive. and store the old hard drive in a safe place.

        Group G{ot backup} Win7Pro · x64 · SP1 · i3-3220 · TestBeta
        • This reply was modified 3 months ago by
           geekdom.
        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #314565 Reply

        RetiredGeek
        AskWoody MVP

        1. Which files should I be backing up weekly- personal? OS? Discs C and/or D?

        I’d suggest that you backup your OS at least monthly and before major feature upgrades.
        Documents folder needs more regular attention depending on your habits (how often your data changes).
        I have a scheduled backup that kicks off automatically every day at 18:15 (while the news is on).

        2. What is “image backup” vs. “data backup”?

        An image backup takes an exact copy of a drive or partition bit for bit. A data backup just backs up your data files only. Relating to question 1 you use Image Backups for your OS and Programs and obviously a data backup for your personal files.

        3. Is it necessary to clear (format) the backup drive when “full”? In several previous years’ backups, this has never come up, this is a 500 GB drive. I thought the new backup overwrote the older one, apparently not true.

        With Macrium Reflect you can setup your backups to keep a certian number of generations then it will start deleting the oldest automatically. You can also set a free space minimum and if that is not available it will delete the oldest backup.

        May the Forces of good computing be with you!

        RG

        PowerShell & VBA Rule!
        Computer Specs

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #314603 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        Hi Slowpoke,

        Let’s first try to figure out what started causing your issues. I am suspecting the January and December updates. In another post, I suggest uninstalling them to see if your backup issues go away.

        Best regards,

        –GTP

         

    • #314539 Reply

      PKCano
      Da Boss

      From what you have said and from your screenshot, I can make some observations.

      You backup appears to be User data – your user folder and the Public folder where shared data is sometimes stored. Whether is is a file/folder copy, or an image of the folders, I cannot tell without seeing the contents of the backups.

      The 8GB size of the backup tells me it is not the whole C: drive you are backing up. The Windows install alone is larger than that.

      Each backup is discrete. If you run backups to the same external drive, it will eventually fill up. 1+1+1 = 3. So you have a choice to prevent this. You can delete the older backup folders (not all, just enough to give free space for, say, 10 backups at least) then keep an eye on the free space to give that kind of buffer. OR, you can format the drive as you did and lose all the previous backups.

      If you want an image of the whole drive, which will include the OS, programs and your data, you may have to choose the “My Drives” button instead of the “Backup” button. You probably don’t need to change your backup software in any case.

      I am not familiar with the software that you are using, but I imagine there are Help files within the software,  a “User’s Manual” that came with the software, or at least a Manual on the Seagate website. If all else fails, read the instructions.  🙂

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #314570 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      From what you have said and from your screenshot, I can make some observations. You backup appears to be User data – your user folder and the Public folder where shared data is sometimes stored. Whether is is a file/folder copy, or an image of the folders, I cannot tell without seeing the contents of the backups. The 8GB size of the backup tells me it is not the whole C: drive you are backing up. The Windows install alone is larger than that. Each backup is discrete. If you run backups to the same external drive, it will eventually fill up. 1+1+1 = 3. So you have a choice to prevent this. You can delete the older backup folders (not all, just enough to give free space for, say, 10 backups at least) then keep an eye on the free space to give that kind of buffer. OR, you can format the drive as you did and lose all the previous backups. If you want an image of the whole drive, which will include the OS, programs and your data, you may have to choose the “My Drives” button instead of the “Backup” button. You probably don’t need to change your backup software in any case. I am not familiar with the software that you are using, but I imagine there are Help files within the software, a “User’s Manual” that came with the software, or at least a Manual on the Seagate website. If all else fails, read the instructions. 🙂

      Thanks for posting.  Yes, I thought the backups were too small for anything but personal files, and of course, that Seagate screenshot confirms that.

      What is the difference between a copy and an image?  Which do I back up with?

      And- should I be backing up anything on C or D?

      As far as the User Manual, I have it saved but it’s not a ton of help as it covers multiple drive models, and when I started backing up I knew even less than I do now.  Some of the references don’t seem to apply to the drive I have even though it is named in the manual.

      Help links not overly helpful either.

      I don’t know how to delete part of the data on the drive, but is there a reason to keep anything older than the most recent backup, assuming that backup is comprehensive?  As stated, I’ve used this drive since starting backups, several years ago, and didn’t realize I needed to monitor disc usage.  At 500 GB, could be that every backup I ever did was still there before reformatting.

      Thanks for your patience.  I feel just like my screen name.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314600 Reply

      GoneToPlaid
      AskWoody Plus

      Comments: 1. Files named Thumbs.db contain the thumbnails for the (photos) in that containing folder. If missing, the thumbnails and Thumbs.db are regenerated when the folder photos are next viewed. They are not critical, they are just space-takers. 2. Attributes. (Ref. #314290.) There are several attributes, or characteristics, associated with each object (folder, file, etc.). You can see two of them (Read-only, Hidden) when you right-click on a (folder or file) > Properties. Another attribute is System. Typically objects that have both the Hidden and System attributes set are items that Windows really doesn’t want someone else to change. One can inspect the set of attributes for an object by: Opening a Command prompt, navigate to the folder or file of interest, [ attrib * ], or name a specific entity. 3. Is there any setting or discussion in the Seagate program that pertains to file attributes? 4. Both KB4471318 (December) and KB4480970 (January) address the following issues: “Security updates to … Windows Storage and Filesystems, …” I’ve not been able to find the particulars on this arena. Perhaps this is moot anyway.

      Thank you for responding. I’m afraid much of your post is beyond my degree of technical understanding. My computer “skills” have come by blundering along, reading what can find that I can understand, and with help from those such as yourself who offer guidance. I can say that there is nothing in the Seagate program or manual that mentions attributes.

      The upshot of what PaulK is saying in his #4 comment is that the December and January updates (if installed) may be what is causing your issues. I don’t have any backup issues, yet I am updated only through November 2018.

      In between the lines, PaulK might be suggesting that you uninstall the January updates, and then uninstall the December updates, to see if your backup issues go away. I think that this is a good idea to test.

       

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    • #314611 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Macrium Reflect will back up to anything you choose. As far as the AutoPlay popup, you can go into Control Panel >> AutoPlay, and uncheck “Use AutoPlay for all media and devices”, or scroll down the list and select to “Take no action” for anything related to Windows Backup. Personally, I never use AutoPlay as it is a potential security risk.

      The listings I have under Autoplay are Audio CD. DVD movie,Software and games, Pictures, and various other flavors of CDs, DVDs, etc.  There is a heading “Devices” but nothing shown there.  In any case, I’ve followed your example and unchecked the automatic function.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314613 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Comments: 1. Files named Thumbs.db contain the thumbnails for the (photos) in that containing folder. If missing, the thumbnails and Thumbs.db are regenerated when the folder photos are next viewed. They are not critical, they are just space-takers. 2. Attributes. (Ref. #314290.) There are several attributes, or characteristics, associated with each object (folder, file, etc.). You can see two of them (Read-only, Hidden) when you right-click on a (folder or file) > Properties. Another attribute is System. Typically objects that have both the Hidden and System attributes set are items that Windows really doesn’t want someone else to change. One can inspect the set of attributes for an object by: Opening a Command prompt, navigate to the folder or file of interest, [ attrib * ], or name a specific entity. 3. Is there any setting or discussion in the Seagate program that pertains to file attributes? 4. Both KB4471318 (December) and KB4480970 (January) address the following issues: “Security updates to … Windows Storage and Filesystems, …” I’ve not been able to find the particulars on this arena. Perhaps this is moot anyway.

      Thank you for responding. I’m afraid much of your post is beyond my degree of technical understanding. My computer “skills” have come by blundering along, reading what can find that I can understand, and with help from those such as yourself who offer guidance. I can say that there is nothing in the Seagate program or manual that mentions attributes.

      The upshot of what PaulK is saying in his #4 comment is that the December and January updates (if installed) may be what is causing your issues. I don’t have any backup issues, yet I am updated only through November 2018. In between the lines, PaulK might be suggesting that you uninstall the January updates, and then uninstall the December updates, to see if your backup issues go away. I think that this is a good idea to test.

      That was one of my first moves. I’ve been trying to determine some sort of timing-related catalyst for the start of the problem.  When that didn’t work, I went as far back as System Restore would permit, which was early Jan.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #314626 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        Instead of the System Restore, actually uninstall any updates which you installed in January and December. Windows Update can show you your installation history. Note the update KB numbers which you installed in January and in December.

        Then go to Control Panel >> Programs and Features >> View installed updates, and then uninstall the KB numbers which you noted.

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    • #314666 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Instead of the System Restore, actually uninstall any updates which you installed in January and December. Windows Update can show you your installation history. Note the update KB numbers which you installed in January and in December. Then go to Control Panel >> Programs and Features >> View installed updates, and then uninstall the KB numbers which you noted.

      Yes, That’s just what I did, and also uninstalled the other updates that I had installed (once getting a green light here) since the beginning of Dec.  Kept a list, so I can reinstall them if and when it looks appropriate, even if one at a time to see if there are consequences.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #314827 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Have you tried manually copying files/folders over to that Seagate drive? The result may yield some useful information.

      Not sure how to do that, but each failed backup attempt puts another 8 GB on the drive, so we know the drive is working.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #314924 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        That’s very strange. The contents of those 8GB, do they match anything of what you’re trying to back up? If so, then you might also try to open some of the contents of the 8GB to see if they are proper files or just garbage.

        To manually copy files or folders to the Seagate drive, one way is to open two instances (windows) of Windows Explorer, one of them showing Computer in the right panel and the other one open to a folder containing some sample files that you want to copy over to the Seagate. You can select (highlight) one or more files or sub-folders, then hold the right mouse button as you drag the mouse pointer to the Seagate’s name in the other Explorer window. (To select multiple files at the same time, click on one and then press the Shift key followed by one of the left-right-up-down arrow keys while keeping the Shift key pressed; the selected files will get a light blue background.) Explorer will ask if you want to “copy here” or “move here” and you want to choose Copy.

        Try doing this with a large selection of data files (pictures, videos, etc.), and see if the manual copy is successful, while keeping an eye for odd circumstances such as that additional 8GB space inexplicably used up. If and when the copying process finishes, you can try opening a random selection of the copies to make sure that the copies are correct.

        The whole test should take not more than a minute or two. Let us know how it goes.

         

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    • #315072 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      That’s very strange. The contents of those 8GB, do they match anything of what you’re trying to back up? If so, then you might also try to open some of the contents of the 8GB to see if they are proper files or just garbage. To manually copy files or folders to the Seagate drive, one way is to open two instances (windows) of Windows Explorer, one of them showing Computer in the right panel and the other one open to a folder containing some sample files that you want to copy over to the Seagate. You can select (highlight) one or more files or sub-folders, then hold the right mouse button as you drag the mouse pointer to the Seagate’s name in the other Explorer window. (To select multiple files at the same time, click on one and then press the Shift key followed by one of the left-right-up-down arrow keys while keeping the Shift key pressed; the selected files will get a light blue background.) Explorer will ask if you want to “copy here” or “move here” and you want to choose Copy. Try doing this with a large selection of data files (pictures, videos, etc.), and see if the manual copy is successful, while keeping an eye for odd circumstances such as that additional 8GB space inexplicably used up. If and when the copying process finishes, you can try opening a random selection of the copies to make sure that the copies are correct. The whole test should take not more than a minute or two. Let us know how it goes.

      Today paused the anti-malware program (Emsisoft) to see if an update to their software might have incompatibility issues, ran a manual backup, same result- so that cause is eliminated.  Looked at some of the backed-up data and it’s junk.  I think my next move should be to try the Macrium Reflect software- nothing to lose, and I’ll find out if the drive is truly ok.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #315163 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        @slowpoke47, when you say that some of the backed-up data is junk, is that the data that you backed up manually or the data that was backed up with Windows Backup? Or maybe both?

        I’ve had very good results with Macrium Reflect, it’s saved  my data bacon more than once.

        Here’s a few more ideas to try:

        1) Try doing a Disk Cleanup on the Seagate external drive (from the General tab in the drive’s Properties), followed by Error-checking (from the Tools tab; you may need to reboot your computer before the check can run). Now perform your normal backup procedure. Does it work any better?

        2) Also, did you get a chance to carry out @gonetoplaid‘s suggestion in this previous post? You can just select the standard edition; the manual, if you need it, is at the bottom of the web page.

        3) Another thing. Please download the trial version of HD Tune and run the Benchmark, Health, and Error Scan on the Seagate (they don’t take very long, although the Error Scan is more protracted) and tell us what happened. I want us to be sure that this is not a hardware problem; if it’s an older drive and especially if it’s seen heavy use, it’s not out of the question that it could simply be going bad.

        4) And finally (and forgive me if this has already been suggested but I missed it), if possible try doing your backup the same way you’ve normally been doing it, but on a new or different external drive. If a different external drive isn’t available, you may be able to run the test backup right on your Windows C: drive. Does the operation complete successfully?

        Good luck!

         

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           Cybertooth.
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    • #315362 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      @slowpoke47, when you say that some of the backed-up data is junk, is that the data that you backed up manually or the data that was backed up with Windows Backup? Or maybe both? I’ve had very good results with Macrium Reflect, it’s saved my data bacon more than once. Here’s a few more ideas to try: 1) Try doing a Disk Cleanup on the Seagate external drive (from the General tab in the drive’s Properties), followed by Error-checking (from the Tools tab; you may need to reboot your computer before the check can run). Now perform your normal backup procedure. Does it work any better? 2) Also, did you get a chance to carry out @gonetoplaid‘s suggestion in this previous post? You can just select the standard edition; the manual, if you need it, is at the bottom of the web page. 3) Another thing. Please download the trial version of HD Tune and run the Benchmark, Health, and Error Scan on the Seagate (they don’t take very long, although the Error Scan is more protracted) and tell us what happened. I want us to be sure that this is not a hardware problem; if it’s an older drive and especially if it’s seen heavy use, it’s not out of the question that it could simply be going bad. 4) And finally (and forgive me if this has already been suggested but I missed it), if possible try doing your backup the same way you’ve normally been doing it, but on a new or different external drive. If a different external drive isn’t available, you may be able to run the test backup right on your Windows C: drive. Does the operation complete successfully? Good luck!

      1.  To answer your post, from the top- I haven’t put anything on the ext. drive as of yet.  The junk is from the backup.

      2.  Re the Crystalmark- I got as far as this pop-up and don’t know where to go next.

      Crystal-mark-screenshot
      Is Macrium Reflect backup software?  Can I just ignore or uninstall the Seagate software and use this instead after clearing the Seagate drive?

       

      3.  The HDtune program shows 26.4 MB/sec average rate.  The health function shows a blank screen.  The error scan shows all green.

      My thought at this point is, the drive itself has passed every test.  I have had trouble with the Seagate software previously.  Looks to me that different software using this drive would be the next logical step.

       

       

      Slowpoke (group B)

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      • #315389 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        OK, thanks for running CrystalDiskMark and HD Tune, we’re making some progress.

        For point (1) in your reply, do try to copy some random selection of files over to the external drive. That will tell us if the drive can work properly independently of Seagate’s software.

        For point (2), make sure that the Seagate drive is connected to your PC. Then at the top right where the C: drive is highlighted in blue, click on the arrow and select the drive letter for the Seagate. Next, click on the green “All” button over on the left, let the benchmark run ’til it’s done, and give us the results (a screenshot like you did above is great). You should end up with eight sets of numbers (four each for read and write tests).

        For point (3), I’m assuming that the 26.4MB/s result is for the Seagate drive and not for your C: drive. That sounds a little slow, but not inordinately so. If the result is not for the Seagate, just repeat the test with the Seagate selected. It’s probably OK that the Health tab didn’t give you any results; it could mean that there hasn’t been enough data to assemble a report. Or it could be a sign of trouble; other tests may tell which one it is.

        Now, an important pair of questions: the HD Tune test created two graphs running across to the right, a blue line and a set of green dots. Is the blue graph line fairly steady running across, does it slowly decline, are there many sudden deep drops with steep recoveries? And the green dots–do they show a more or less consistent (tight) scatter pattern, or are they all over the place up and down the chart?

        Now to answer your question about Macrium Reflect. It is indeed backup software, well regarded here at Woody’s and for good reason, in my opinion. After clearing the Seagate drive of bad data, you can either leave the Seagate software intact (if you have any usable prior backups made with it) or you can uninstall/delete it altogether. But first make sure that you know how to run Macrium Reflect.

        Finally, when you get a chance to, please try running Disk Cleanup and then Error-checking on the Seagate drive, as suggested in No. 1 of my previous post. For error checking, select both of the options that come up (“automatically fix” and “scan for and attempt”).

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #315507 Reply

      Paul T
      AskWoody MVP

      Slowpoke, as you are not a “tech” user I would not recommend Macrium.
      The easiest interface of the free backup programs I’ve tested is Aomei Backupper and it does almost everything Macrium does.
      There is also EaseUS ToDo and Paragon Backup.

      Whatever program you decide to try you can install it and run a backup to your external disk, then un-install it if you find it doesn’t suit you.

      cheers, Paul

      p.s. I use but am not associated with Aomei (in case anyone is wondering).

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    • #315582 Reply

      geekdom
      AskWoody Plus

      Start here to read about terminology and definitions.

      – system image backup
      https://www.howtogeek.com/192115/what-you-need-to-know-about-creating-system-image-backups/

      – default Windows folders and local files in libraries
      This is your personal data.

      Test with a basic Windows backup:

      1. Get a new, unused external hard drive or a flash drive. Remember, all you are doing is testing, If you use an external hard drive, you will be able to make a system image in addition to backing up all your files.

      2. Plug into your computer the external hard drive or flash drive.

      3. Select Control Panel

      4. Select Back up your computer

      5. If you need to, select Change settings

      6. Select where you want to save your backup and press Next

      7. Select Let Windows choose

      8. Press Save settings and run backup

      9. You will see Backup in progress…

      Let the backup run to completion and report back here.

      Group G{ot backup} Win7Pro · x64 · SP1 · i3-3220 · TestBeta
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         geekdom.
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         geekdom.
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    • #316011 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      OK, thanks for running CrystalDiskMark and HD Tune, we’re making some progress. For point (1) in your reply, do try to copy some random selection of files over to the external drive. That will tell us if the drive can work properly independently of Seagate’s software.

      Just took another look at the files backed up to the Seagate, found just one or two that are actually good copies of files in the computer.  There may be others, didn’t try to see everything.  I’ll try to add some files manually, not sure how I’ll be able to tell whether files on the drive were backed up there or put there by me.  Maybe I should clear the drive first?

      Edit- just copied files to drive by right-clicking in the folder and sending to drive.  This offers the option of renaming, so I am able to see that the files did go into the Seagate.

      I’ll re-run the testing and post the results.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by
         Slowpoke47.
      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316015 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Slowpoke, as you are not a “tech” user I would not recommend Macrium. The easiest interface of the free backup programs I’ve tested is Aomei Backupper and it does almost everything Macrium does. There is also EaseUS ToDo and Paragon Backup. Whatever program you decide to try you can install it and run a backup to your external disk, then un-install it if you find it doesn’t suit you. cheers, Paul p.s. I use but am not associated with Aomei (in case anyone is wondering).

      Thanks for the advice.  Once I’m sure the drive is ok, I’ll look at these apps.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #316016 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Start here to read about terminology and definitions. – system image backup https://www.howtogeek.com/192115/what-you-need-to-know-about-creating-system-image-backups/ – default Windows folders and local files in libraries This is your personal data. Test with a basic Windows backup: 1. Get a new, unused external hard drive or a flash drive. Remember, all you are doing is testing, If you use an external hard drive, you will be able to make a system image in addition to backing up all your files. 2. Plug into your computer the external hard drive or flash drive. 3. Select Control Panel 4. Select Back up your computer 5. If you need to, select Change settings 6. Select where you want to save your backup and press Next 7. Select Let Windows choose 8. Press Save settings and run backup 9. You will see Backup in progress… Let the backup run to completion and report back here.

      Thank you.  All help appreciated.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #316027 Reply

      anonymous

      I always find it tricky to advice back up software other than native Windows Backup, specially to a non-tech user.
      Why? If the whole C-drive gets messed up, third party software will not be able to restore the image if that software can’t run becaue it’s on that same C-drive.

      In case of native Windows Backup, all you have to do is insert the Windows Repair cd, choose the backup that you want to restore et voilà: all will be back to normal.

      Just my 2 cents

       

      • #316032 Reply

        PKCano
        Da Boss

        That’s why backup software has the facility to create rescue boot disks. They are used in the same way you use your Windows Repair CD – insert disk, boot, point to a backup, restore.

        I use Acronis mostly, but also EaseUS Todo and AOMEI Backupper. In fact, I have never installed it on my computer(s) because I don’t trust a backup executed from a running computer with its files in use. I always boot from the rescue disk, then I know none of the files are in use. I run my backups and restores from the disk. That works from the backup software (several) I am familiar with. I have never Macrium, but I suspect it works the same way.

        • #316224 Reply

          Cybertooth
          AskWoody Lounger

          In Macrium Reflect, you can indeed create a backup via the rescue disk. And to restore a system image, the only way I know to do it is by booting into the rescue disk.

           

    • #316216 Reply

      wavy
      AskWoody Plus

      + 1 for booting from a separate disk to do a backup in this situation. Eliminate as many of the unknowns as possible and get you backup secured, especially as you said you formatted your old backup media.

      🍻

      Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
    • #316248 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Today has been a day to forget.  Yesterday I found no problem in copying files to the Seagate drive.  Today I decided to reinstall the updates recently removed, since they were not the source of problems, and might be helpful going forward.  Successful installations of KB4459934, KB4466536, and KB4483187.  KB4459942 no longer in MS update list and looks like it has become redundant.  KB4471318 not only failed twice, but took the computer down with it.  Several conflicting error messages, several different automatic “searching…” operations, eventually the only option left was System Restore, which at first reported back as failed, then changed its mind, and the system does seem to have been “backdated” so to speak.  This means that those updates are of course gone again, along with the test apps cited in this thread.  Several dire-looking screens, warnings, etc. before getting back in business.

      I’ll reinstall the three updates that gave no trouble, but skip the large KB4471318 in hopes that a subsequent update obsoletes it.

      Now that I know the external drive is working, is there a downside to sidestepping the Seagate software and using the Windows Backup app to back up to the Seagate drive?  I would format the drive first.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #316301 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        @slowpoke47, there should be no downside to your reformatting the Seagate external drive and using Windows Backup or any other non-Seagate backup software.

        Do what you propose to do, including trying to use Windows Backup, and let us know how it went.

        I’ll let others comment on the significance of some of the updates working but KB4471318 messing up your machine.  🙂

         

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    • #316305 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Since my last post, found that KB4459934 would not download from the MS catalog, tried a couple of times and still waiting, download icon reports 0 bytes downloaded after about two hours.  Yesterday this update was also stuck, but on bootup today it was waiting for me even though I had abandoned the attempt, and at that time installed without issue.  So, of the five updates uninstalled to bird-dog this fiasco, only one is now installed.

       

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #316337 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        I just downloaded KB4459934 with no issues. Alrighty. What antivirus program are you using? I am beginning to suspect that malware could be an issue.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316322 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Windows Backup set for weekly backups as before.  Backup running now, seems to be ok, shows about ¼ done after about 10 minutes- of course, it’s starting from scratch.  Question- when the b/u is finished, how do I shut the drive off for removal?  The Seagate software has an icon for that, but, of course, I’m not using the Seagate software.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #316324 Reply

        PKCano
        Da Boss

        Be sure Windows Backup is closed. In the System tray on the right side, there is an icon (if you hover over it with the mouse) says “safely remove hardware,” Click on it and choose your drive to remove.

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    • #316350 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      I just downloaded KB4459934 with no issues. Alrighty. What antivirus program are you using? I am beginning to suspect that malware could be an issue.

      Using Emsisoft anti-malware, 1 year+.  This idea came to me also, and I ran an extra scan and contacted Emsisoft re interference between their software and the Seagate program, the tech looked at the Emsisoft logs that I sent- answer was, no problem as far as they could tell

      Maybe a second opinion needed?

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #316352 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Be sure Windows Backup is closed. In the System tray on the right side, there is an icon (if you hover over it with the mouse) says “safely remove hardware,” Click on it and choose your drive to remove.

      There are three icons there, the network status, speaker volume, and a white pennant, had some sort of little accent thing on it while the backup was running, but now that the backup has finished, there is no reference to the external drive, just a message to change update settings, which is always there (wants me to go for automatic updates).  There is a fourth icon there that relates to the Seagate software, it has and has always had a pop-up with an “exit” option, but I don’t know if that is in force now, since I didn’t use the Seagate program for the backup.  That icon has been red (backup failed) since this issue began some weeks ago.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #316394 Reply

        anonymous

        It is possible your taskbar preferences allows for hiding extraneous icons. PKCano expected you to see an icon resembling a thumbdrive. This is the standard placeholder image for any item connected to a USB port. The image may be different if you have personalized your theme. Selecting that icon would have given options including the “safely remove hardware”.

        You do not see any icon beyond the three you name. How is your external drive connected to your system? Is there a caret shaped symbol, ^ ? When you select that, additional hidden icons may appear.

        Setting aside the taskbar / system tray navigation, use the keystroke combination [Windows Key]+[E] to launch Windows Explorer and select the external drive among the list of drives under the heading “Computer”. When the drive is selected, and is identified as removable, the same option to “safely remove hardware” will be available.

        Either way you get to it, once selected a few moments will pass while the system verifies there are no pending tasks, and the unit is idle or parked. A dialog box will appear with the message “It is safe to remove …” the described item.

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      • #316418 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        @slowpoke47, the icon you need looks like the middle one in the top row in the following screenshot (note that it’s highlighted):

        Notification-area

        If you have this icon, you can right-click on it with the mouse and select the drive letter corresponding to your Seagate external drive, to remove it. Before you click to remove it, make sure that there are no Windows Explorer windows showing contents of the Seagate drive, as this will prevent you from removing it.

         

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    • #316357 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      This backup ran about an hour, looks like 108 GB.  FWIW, the C: has 60 GB on it and the D: has 148 GB.  The backup pop-up says 1 file skipped, don’t know why, it’s a scanned photo that I can bring up easily.  Can’t figure out how to view backed up files, left- or right-clicking the drive at Start>Computer don’t give me a view option.

      Does an hour seem like a reasonable time to back up and create a system image?  The Seagate backups took about 3 or 4 minutes as a rule (w/o system image).

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #316379 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        The backup time sounds about right, if you used Windows Backup which isn’t particularly speedy, for an older and slower laptop hard drive.

        It occurs to me that we never checked your laptop’s hard drive for any possible issues. Could you download and run the free version of Piriform’s Speccy? Here is the download link:

        https://www.ccleaner.com/speccy/download

        What I am interested in seeing is the reported SMART info for your laptop’s hard drive. The SMART info is in the table, similar to the attached screen capture.

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    • #316434 Reply

      Paul T
      AskWoody MVP

      Does an hour seem like a reasonable time to back up and create a system image? The Seagate backups took about 3 or 4 minutes as a rule (w/o system image).

      A full image of my laptop takes about 10 minutes on USB3, but it’s quite a bit smaller than yours. One hour on USB2 seems OK.

      cheers, Paul

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    • #316435 Reply

      Paul T
      AskWoody MVP

      I have never installed it on my computer(s) because I don’t trust a backup executed from a running computer with its files in use. I always boot from the rescue disk, then I know none of the files are in use.

      Windows has had a snapshot system in place for a very long time, that effectively freezes your disk whilst the backup copies the files off, then resumes normal disk activity. The system is tried and tested and I’ve never seen it produce a bad backup in many years of use on many machines.

      cheers, Paul

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      • #316442 Reply

        PKCano
        Da Boss

        Well, I have seen a Windows backup fail. And I have never had a problem backing up with Acronis in the way I do it. Not everyone has the same experience.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #316928 Reply

          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          Isn’t that the point of multiple backups?

          cheers, Paul

          • #316944 Reply

            PKCano
            Da Boss

            What does multiple backups have to do with the choice of software or the method one uses?

            • #317140 Reply

              Paul T
              AskWoody MVP

              Multiple backups prevent you losing all if one fails. This allows you to use the most convenient method (running whilst Windows is in use in my case) without fretting about possible failures.

              cheers, Paul

            • #317201 Reply

              PKCano
              Da Boss

              I do multiple backups. But I use different software and different methods.
              I still don’t see the how that requires I use the same software and methods you use.
              If the results are the same, that is not relevant.

              1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316471 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      @slowpoke47, the icon you need looks like the middle one in the top row in the following screenshot (note that it’s highlighted): Notification-area If you have this icon, you can right-click on it with the mouse and select the drive letter corresponding to your Seagate external drive, to remove it. Before you click to remove it, make sure that there are no Windows Explorer windows showing contents of the Seagate drive, as this will prevent you from removing it.

      Here’s a photo of the tray with the hidden icons showing.  As you can see, there are not many, as there are not a lot of added programs in this machine.  The red icon shows me that, as far as the Seagate software is concerned, the backup has failed, but that refers to the most recent attempt with that program, earlier this week.  The flag icon only wants me to set up automatic updating.  The other two, of course, are network connection (to a LAN) and speaker volume.  EDIT- just found that, on closer examination, the icon in the upper right of the pop-up has changed from Privacy Badger to an almost-identical looking USB connector, which turns out to be the shutoff icon.  The two are so similar that I never took a close look at the new one before now.

      Tray-photo
      When the Seagate is connected, clicking on the K drive in Start>Computer raises this pop-up (moved out of the way for clarity).
      Computer-screenshot
      A right-click brings up three items in a folder, one of which, after several steps, brings up the actual backed up files, so the backup did happen.

      This computer is a desktop, originally came with Vista, so that dates it.  At the time, it was kind of middle-range in speed, etc., probably now considered slow.  Some years ago I bought a new, second hard drive with a legal copy of W7, which has worked well ever since (with typical MS hiccups) and, as you would expect, I no longer use the Vista OS.  We also have a fairly new laptop also running W7 which is much faster by comparison, but this desktop is still our “main” computer.

      In any case, I’m not sure whether this issue is put to bed or not.  I’m going to uninstall the Seagate software, as I think the problems must have come from there.  My grateful thanks for the patience and help by everyone who posted to this thread.

      Slowpoke (group B)

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      • #316570 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        @slowpoke47, thanks for the images. It’s clearer now what’s going  on with that.

        As @anonymous #316394 wrote, it looks like your USB connections may not be configured to show up in the notification area. If you click on the arrow (triangle) there and then select Customize, you should get a window that looks much like this:

        Notifications
        In the screenshot, note the bottom item, “Windows Explorer–Safely Remove Hardware and Eject Media.” On your PC, it looks like this may be set to “Hide icon and notifications”. Just click on that dropdown menu and make sure that one of the other options is selected; then when the Seagate external drive is connected, that USB icon should show in your notification area.

        Regarding the Seagate software–yes, if it’s only giving you grief, go ahead and uninstall it.

         

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    • #316479 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      The backup time sounds about right, if you used Windows Backup which isn’t particularly speedy, for an older and slower laptop hard drive. It occurs to me that we never checked your laptop’s hard drive for any possible issues. Could you download and run the free version of Piriform’s Speccy? Here is the download link: https://www.ccleaner.com/speccy/download What I am interested in seeing is the reported SMART info for your laptop’s hard drive. The SMART info is in the table, similar to the attached screen capture.

      Thanks for that link- I’ll be able to do that some time today (Friday).

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #316518 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      The backup time sounds about right, if you used Windows Backup which isn’t particularly speedy, for an older and slower laptop hard drive. It occurs to me that we never checked your laptop’s hard drive for any possible issues. Could you download and run the free version of Piriform’s Speccy? Here is the download link: https://www.ccleaner.com/speccy/download What I am interested in seeing is the reported SMART info for your laptop’s hard drive. The SMART info is in the table, similar to the attached screen capture.

      Speccy program run, here’s the summary-

      Speccy-scan-screenshot
      Looked at the dependent screens listed on the left, no idea what I’m looking at, but didn’t see any red flags.

      Slowpoke (group B)

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      • #316521 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        Hi Slowpoke,

        My bad. I should have explained that you need to click on the blue labeled Storage summary in order to see details about your hard drives. Please do so and then post screen captures of the S.M.A.R.T. table for your laptop’s internal hard drive which has partitions C: and D:.

        The upshot simply is that I want to see if your laptop’s internal hard drive is showing any potential issues.

        Best regards,

        –GTP

         

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316540 Reply

      Mr. Natural
      AskWoody Plus

      Sorry if this has been mentioned, but have you tried deleting that backup routine and creating a new one? I don’t like windows backup. There have been times I had to recreate a backup routine due to some oddity where the backups would start failing.

      Red Ruffnsore reporting from the front lines.

      3 users thanked author for this post.
    • #316560 Reply

      ky41083
      AskWoody Lounger

      After you make sure all your drives are healthy, I cannot recommend this enough:
      https://www.veeam.com/windows-endpoint-server-backup-free.html

      It is better than Windows Backup in every single way. Windows Backup has failed for me on backup, restore, consolidation, pretty much everywhere it could have, in multiple environments, and required manual intervention to fix.

      VAFW has not failed on me one single time, and at this point I use it on far more endpoints and environments than I ever used Windows Backup on.

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
         ky41083. Reason: Double speak
      4 users thanked author for this post.
      • #316576 Reply

        Microfix
        Da Boss

        @ky41083 That backup S/W looks quite interesting, thanks for the pointer.
        bookmarked for later 😉

        | W8.1 Pro x64 | Linux x64 Hybrids | W7 Pro x86 | XP Pro O/L
      • #316580 Reply

        Mr. Natural
        AskWoody Plus

        We use veeam enterprise at work and it is highly recommended. Awesome integration with VMWare.

        Red Ruffnsore reporting from the front lines.

    • #316573 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Hi Slowpoke, My bad. I should have explained that you need to click on the blue labeled Storage summary in order to see details about your hard drives. Please do so and then post screen captures of the S.M.A.R.T. table for your laptop’s internal hard drive which has partitions C: and D:. The upshot simply is that I want to see if your laptop’s internal hard drive is showing any potential issues. Best regards, –GTP

      This window has vertical and horizontal sliders, not sure if they will work on this site.Speccy-storage-screenshot
      I could post the rest in pieces, if needed.

      Slowpoke (group B)

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    • #316579 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      @slowpoke47, thanks for the images. It’s clearer now what’s going on with that. As @anonymous #316394 wrote, it looks like your USB connections may not be configured to show up in the notification area. If you click on the arrow (triangle) there and then select Customize, you should get a window that looks much like this: Notifications In the screenshot, note the bottom item, “Windows Explorer–Safely Remove Hardware and Eject Media.” On your PC, it looks like this may be set to “Hide icon and notifications”. Just click on that dropdown menu and make sure that one of the other options is selected; then when the Seagate external drive is connected, that USB icon should show in your notification area. Regarding the Seagate software–yes, if it’s only giving you grief, go ahead and uninstall it.

      Thanks, Cybertooth, you were correct, the icon for USB connections was hidden, just changed it.  But, that icon did appear when the drive was connected, I misinterpreted it- see my earlier post.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316601 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Hi Slowpoke, My bad. I should have explained that you need to click on the blue labeled Storage summary in order to see details about your hard drives. Please do so and then post screen captures of the S.M.A.R.T. table for your laptop’s internal hard drive which has partitions C: and D:. The upshot simply is that I want to see if your laptop’s internal hard drive is showing any potential issues. Best regards, –GTP

      Is this what you are looking for?Speccy-SMART-scan

      Slowpoke (group B)

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      • #316646 Reply

        GoneToPlaid
        AskWoody Plus

        Yep. Both hard drives looks fine. They show no uncorrectable sectors, no pending sectors and no reallocated sectors. One shows that 14 ultra DMA CRC errors occurred, yet that doesn’t matter. The point is that you are working with known good hard drives.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316614 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Hi Slowpoke, My bad. I should have explained that you need to click on the blue labeled Storage summary in order to see details about your hard drives. Please do so and then post screen captures of the S.M.A.R.T. table for your laptop’s internal hard drive which has partitions C: and D:. The upshot simply is that I want to see if your laptop’s internal hard drive is showing any potential issues. Best regards, –GTP

      This is the other part of the SMART scan.

      Speccy-SMART-scan1

      Slowpoke (group B)

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    • #316743 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Once again, my thanks to all who posted to this thread and helped save my bacon.  My next moves will be to try again to reinstall the updates that were removed during this effort and to abandon Windows Backup in favor of the Veeam Agent backup.  I have learned quite a bit here.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #316810 Reply

        ky41083
        AskWoody Lounger

        That is always awesome to hear!

        Just a footnote, it may be a good idea to get a Veeam backup before you do anything more with updates, just in case.

        Don’t forget to create recovery media! I have found the resulting ISO works well with YUMI in Fat32 added as “Try Unlisted ISO (GRUB)”:
        https://www.pendrivelinux.com/yumi-multiboot-usb-creator/

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #316833 Reply

          Cybertooth
          AskWoody Lounger

          Veeam sounds intriguing, especially as I’m transitioning to Linux, but I have to admit that the 300-page manual is pretty intimidating.  🙂

           

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #316875 Reply

            ky41083
            AskWoody Lounger

            The manual for the Linux Agent, or the full B&R solution? If memory serves, the manuals for the agents are much shorter…

            I run the Linux agent on Debian. It also works great, zero complaints.

            • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
               ky41083.
            • #316913 Reply

              Cybertooth
              AskWoody Lounger

              This is the manual I found on their website.

              If there’s a shorter one, I’m eager to see it, thanks!    🙂

               

            • #317419 Reply

              ky41083
              AskWoody Lounger

              Wow, yeup, you are correct, lol. Honestly, just make sure the OS + filesystems you want to backup are supported, add the repo, install via package manager. It really isn’t horrible to setup. Think of it as an SSH text GUI of the Windows version 😉

            • #317506 Reply

              Mr. Natural
              AskWoody Plus

              It can be daunting because there are so many options. Perhaps this will narrow things down. Here is the link for the free version with not so much info.

              https://helpcenter.veeam.com/docs/backup/free/introduction.html?ver=95

              Red Ruffnsore reporting from the front lines.

              1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316848 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Veeam sounds intriguing, especially as I’m transitioning to Linux, but I have to admit that the 300-page manual is pretty intimidating. 🙂

      My computer came with Vista installed, but when W7 came out I bought a legal copy of 7 on a hard drive of its own and put it in alongside the original, so this computer is now dual-boot.  Of course, I abandoned Vista in favor of 7 and transferred all docs, etc.

      What do you think of replacing the Vista with Linux mint?  Maybe this would ease the transition out of W7.  The more I read about W10 the less impressed I am.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #316914 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        Assuming that both of your operating systems are on the same physical disk drive, you may want to research the order of the OS partitions for a dual-boot that includes both Windows (any flavor) and Linux. I seem to remember that in these cases Windows needs to be on the first partition, ahead of Linux. (Experts reading this, please confirm or contradict that.) I have one PC set up just that way, Windows first and then Linux on the next partition. So it may not be a straightforward matter of replacing your Vista partition, which presumably was set up prior to the Windows 7 partition, with Linux Mint.

        BTW, you have a lot of company in being less than impressed by Windows 10!

         

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #316849 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Well, everything looks good.  Veeam is up and running, Windows Update is sidelined, the only glitch was that KB4471318 again would not download correctly from the MS catalog, but I expect the January replacement to be green-lighted before too long, so I’ll wait for that puppy.

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #317343 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Okay…. the first scheduled backup ran at 8 AM this morning.  Ran for about an hour, seems to be good as far as I can tell.  Disc usage now shows 177GB used, which includes the last 8GB input from the Seagate s/w plus one b/u thru the Windows Backup s/w.

      Start>Computer shows disc usage at 56GB for C, 148GB for D, and 8.27 for E.  Does a 1- hour backup seem consistent with these figures?

      Could be that, for whatever reason, the Seagate s/w was not doing proper b/u’s from day one, as it took years before the 500GB external drive was full, and looks like each Seagate b/u added maybe 8GB of data.  These b/u’s each took about 4 or 5 minutes.  Since I had no context to compare, or previous experience, I never suspected anything was other than a-ok.

      This has been yet another learning experience for me, and I appreciate the help and patience received here.  Sometimes the story of the blind men and the elephant comes to mind when I try to grasp the ins and outs of the cyberworld.  Again, thanks to all who posted.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #317399 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        @slowpoke47, everything you reported sounds promising.

        Since you’re starting Windows Backup from scratch, it’s normal that the initial backup will take longer. If the software is working properly, subsequent backups are supposed to back up only new files and files that have changed since the last backup, so the backup process finishes faster.

        I say “if” because it won’t necessarily behave that way; my Vista system for example, seems to have lost the ability to do incremental backups and every new Windows Backup is at least as large as the previous one. After doing some research, it looks like you need to make sure that certain settings are correct in order for Windows (7) Backup to do incremental backups rather than a whole new backup every time; see here and here. (To get the gist of these long threads, just read the first two posts in each.)

        Time will tell if Windows Backup is working properly in your case.

         

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #317424 Reply

        ky41083
        AskWoody Lounger

        In the Veeam GUI, just click the corresponding backup size bar to see the backup log. As long as it lists all volumes you want backups of, and completed successfully, she’s good. If you are interested, and it sounds like you may be, the log contains the size of data that was read from each volume (incrementals will be much less), and the stats at the top (restore point size) tell you how much actual storage space that backup run occupies (after deduplication and compression).

        • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
           ky41083. Reason: Clarity
        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #317457 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Just had these boxes from the Veeam app- not sure what I need to do.

      Veeam-Agent-screenshot
      Veeam-event-history
      The program does report back that b/u was successful (with this footnote).

      Slowpoke (group B)

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    • #317461 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      @slowpoke47, everything you reported sounds promising. Since you’re starting Windows Backup from scratch, it’s normal that the initial backup will take longer. If the software is working properly, subsequent backups are supposed to back up only new files and files that have changed since the last backup, so the backup process finishes faster. I say “if” because it won’t necessarily behave that way; my Vista system for example, seems to have lost the ability to do incremental backups and every new Windows Backup is at least as large as the previous one. After doing some research, it looks like you need to make sure that certain settings are correct in order for Windows (7) Backup to do incremental backups rather than a whole new backup every time; see here and here. (To get the gist of these long threads, just read the first two posts in each.) Time will tell if Windows Backup is working properly in your case.

      I thought that by using the Veeam b/u I am bypassing Windows Backup- is this not so?

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • #317597 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        Yes indeed. I misread the post by you that I was replying to, and thought that it referenced continued use of Windows Backup. Sorry about that!

        I haven’t tried out Veeam yet, but it seems to use its own processes to perform the backup, so you’ll be OK on that score.

         

    • #317462 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      In the Veeam GUI, just click the corresponding backup size bar to see the backup log. As long as it lists all volumes you want backups of, and completed successfully, she’s good. If you are interested, and it sounds like you may be, the log contains the size of data that was read from each volume (incrementals will be much less), and the stats at the top (restore point size) tell you how much actual storage space that backup run occupies (after deduplication and compression).

      Not sure how to do what you suggest- can you dumb it down a little for me?

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #317522 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Assuming that both of your operating systems are on the same physical disk drive, you may want to research the order of the OS partitions for a dual-boot that includes both Windows (any flavor) and Linux. I seem to remember that in these cases Windows needs to be on the first partition, ahead of Linux. (Experts reading this, please confirm or contradict that.) I have one PC set up just that way, Windows first and then Linux on the next partition. So it may not be a straightforward matter of replacing your Vista partition, which presumably was set up prior to the Windows 7 partition, with Linux Mint. BTW, you have a lot of company in being less than impressed by Windows 10!

      In my case, if I do bring in Linux, it would be on a separate drive, as this computer came with Vista and I added a second hard drive with W7.  I would replace the Vista OS with Linux- is that doable?

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
         Slowpoke47.
      • #317602 Reply

        Cybertooth
        AskWoody Lounger

        @slowpoke47, let me make sure I understand what you intend to do. The computer originally came with Vista, and then you added a second hard drive and installed Windows 7 on it. Now you wish to replace Vista on the original hard drive with Linux, leaving Windows 7 alone on its own separate hard drive. Is that right?

        If that is what you have in mind to do, I’m not aware of any obstacles to your accomplishing that. Just make sure that you tell the Linux installer to do its magic on the Vista drive and not the Windows 7 drive. When doing this, bear in mind that Linux uses drive labels that may be unfamiliar to Windows users. In your case, the Vista drive  may be labeled something like “hda” or “sda” and the Windows drive “hdb” or “sdb”, with numbers tacked on at the end of each to designate the partitions on the drive.

        If the Vista and Windows 7 drives are of different sizes, it will be easier to tell which is which just by looking at the GB figures for each. But the main point is to make sure that you select the correct drive to put Linux on.

        Of course, once you’re at the point of installing Linux it’s a high-stress, critical situation. Before starting the installation process, I would play around with the Linux Live DVD first and open the file manager just to familiarize myself with how it designates each of the drives on your PC, so that you don’t have to start looking into it once the process is going.

        And needless to say, if there is anything at all on the Vista drive that you would like to keep, copy it (back it up) prior to starting the Linux installation, as that will erase everything on the drive.

        Good luck!

         

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #317847 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      @slowpoke47, let me make sure I understand what you intend to do. The computer originally came with Vista, and then you added a second hard drive and installed Windows 7 on it. Now you wish to replace Vista on the original hard drive with Linux, leaving Windows 7 alone on its own separate hard drive. Is that right? If that is what you have in mind to do, I’m not aware of any obstacles to your accomplishing that. Just make sure that you tell the Linux installer to do its magic on the Vista drive and not the Windows 7 drive. When doing this, bear in mind that Linux uses drive labels that may be unfamiliar to Windows users. In your case, the Vista drive may be labeled something like “hda” or “sda” and the Windows drive “hdb” or “sdb”, with numbers tacked on at the end of each to designate the partitions on the drive. If the Vista and Windows 7 drives are of different sizes, it will be easier to tell which is which just by looking at the GB figures for each. But the main point is to make sure that you select the correct drive to put Linux on. Of course, once you’re at the point of installing Linux it’s a high-stress, critical situation. Before starting the installation process, I would play around with the Linux Live DVD first and open the file manager just to familiarize myself with how it designates each of the drives on your PC, so that you don’t have to start looking into it once the process is going. And needless to say, if there is anything at all on the Vista drive that you would like to keep, copy it (back it up) prior to starting the Linux installation, as that will erase everything on the drive. Good luck!

      Yes, I’m hoping to get to a situation where I have a W7 escape route all ready to go, but at the same time, I like W7 and will only leave it, kicking and screaming, if  that OS becomes a problem.  Before I get the Linux (likely Mint) I plan to investigate ad nauseam in an attempt to avoid disaster.

      Meanwhile… I discovered yesterday that, with the Seagate ext. drive connected, the computer runs at less than ½ speed, and refuses to shut off that drive for removal- the only way I can stop it is to shut the computer down.  Today, without the ext. drive, the computer runs normally.  With the drive connected, I do get the shutdown icon in the tray, but when I use it, a pop-up tells me the drive can’t be shut down when in use.  Any Veeam users out there with some wisdom on this?

      See my previous post for screenshots of the Veeam warning pop-ups.

      Slowpoke (group B)

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
         Slowpoke47.
      • #317850 Reply

        PKCano
        Da Boss

        If you have backups scheduled it may mean the drive is in use. If the drive is in use, ie, connections open to it, it won’t dismount. Turn off the backup program(s) temporarily and close any Explorer windows. Then see if it will disconnect.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #317960 Reply

        PaulK
        AskWoody Lounger

        “With the drive connected, I do get the shutdown icon in the tray, but when I use it, a pop-up tells me the drive can’t be shut down when in use.”

        I can’t speak to Veeam and what it may be doing with/on the external hard drive.

        On my Lenovo tower, for most of my USB thumb drives, when I use that “Safely Remove” icon I also get that warning. To continue, I use Explorer, right-click on the drive, and Eject. This gives another warning, but I then click on Continue, and that releases it. I can put the same drive on a HP Laptop, and not get any objection. Years ago I tried to research this, and the consensus was that there are differences in the manufacturers’ USB hardware.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #317907 Reply

      Cybertooth
      AskWoody Lounger

      Meanwhile… I discovered yesterday that, with the Seagate ext. drive connected, the computer runs at less than ½ speed, and refuses to shut off that drive for removal- the only way I can stop it is to shut the computer down. Today, without the ext. drive, the computer runs normally. With the drive connected, I do get the shutdown icon in the tray, but when I use it, a pop-up tells me the drive can’t be shut down when in use. Any Veeam users out there with some wisdom on this? See my previous post for screenshots of the Veeam warning pop-ups.

      Whoa, that’s a huge performance hit!

      Like @pkcano, I suspect there is a Veeam-related process that’s running all the time in the not-so background. We should go into Task Manager to confirm what process is eating up your CPU cycles. With the Seagate drive not connected and your computer running at normal speed, right-click on the taskbar and select “Start Task Manager,” then when that pops into view go into the second tab (Processes) and click on the button on the lower left that says, “Show processes from all users”. Along the bottom edge, what percentages does Task Manager report for CPU Usage and Physical Memory?

      Now, try to recreate the conditions that led to the computer running at less than half-speed: connecting the Seagate, or connecting the Seagate plus a reboot, whatever you need to do. Then see the two percentages reported by Task Manager. At least one of them should be dramatically higher than before connecting the Seagate drive; click on the column heading under the Processes tab for the one that’s changed (CPU or Working Set/Memory) so as to sort the columns by usage of that resource.

      You may see a new or unfamiliar process listed that’s using up tons of resources–this is the likely culprit. Do you see anything different, compared to before you connected the Seagate? Get the Image Name (first column) and the Description (usually the last column) for that process and let us know.

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
         Cybertooth.
      • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
         Cybertooth.
      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #318000 Reply

      Mr. Natural
      AskWoody Plus

      Veeam most likely has 3 services running at boot on your computer. So yes this explains the “in use” issue. Veeam is always running in order to manage scheduled backups.

      Red Ruffnsore reporting from the front lines.

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    • #318041 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Meanwhile… I discovered yesterday that, with the Seagate ext. drive connected, the computer runs at less than ½ speed, and refuses to shut off that drive for removal- the only way I can stop it is to shut the computer down. Today, without the ext. drive, the computer runs normally. With the drive connected, I do get the shutdown icon in the tray, but when I use it, a pop-up tells me the drive can’t be shut down when in use. Any Veeam users out there with some wisdom on this? See my previous post for screenshots of the Veeam warning pop-ups.

      Whoa, that’s a huge performance hit! Like @pkcano, I suspect there is a Veeam-related process that’s running all the time in the not-so background. We should go into Task Manager to confirm what process is eating up your CPU cycles. With the Seagate drive not connected and your computer running at normal speed, right-click on the taskbar and select “Start Task Manager,” then when that pops into view go into the second tab (Processes) and click on the button on the lower left that says, “Show processes from all users”. Along the bottom edge, what percentages does Task Manager report for CPU Usage and Physical Memory? Now, try to recreate the conditions that led to the computer running at less than half-speed: connecting the Seagate, or connecting the Seagate plus a reboot, whatever you need to do. Then see the two percentages reported by Task Manager. At least one of them should be dramatically higher than before connecting the Seagate drive; click on the column heading under the Processes tab for the one that’s changed (CPU or Working Set/Memory) so as to sort the columns by usage of that resource. You may see a new or unfamiliar process listed that’s using up tons of resources–this is the likely culprit. Do you see anything different, compared to before you connected the Seagate? Get the Image Name (first column) and the Description (usually the last column) for that process and let us know.

      Well… today, the computer runs correctly w/ or w/o drive installed.  The disconnect icon in the tray appears when the drive is connected, and works properly to turn it off on command.  Task manager lists 62-63 processes, cpu usage generally 0-1% with occasional spikes to the high 30’s.  There are two line items for the Veeam s/w, showing 0-1% cpu usage with or w/o drive connected- one item shows just under 16,000k and the other 47,xxx.  These numbers jump around a little, but do not change w/ or w/o the ext. drive.  The backup schedule is for Mondays at 8AM.  The drive does operate when connected, confirmed by lighting up and a slight vibration that tells me the disk is spinning.

      There are several processes showing large numbers in the memory column, those numbers jump all over the place, but I can’t identify anything big that appears with the drive connected- but, as stated, it’s behaving today.

      Yesterday, I couldn’t even spell confused, and today, I are one!

      Slowpoke (group B)

    • #318087 Reply

      Cybertooth
      AskWoody Lounger

      Yesterday, I couldn’t even spell confused, and today, I are one!

      LOL

      Intermittent issues like you just experienced are very frustrating, like the TV that starts working again just as the repairman shows up.

      Like @pkcano and @mr.natural, I’ll bet that it’s related to the Veeam service(s). Just keep an eye on the PC’s performance and see if you can catch it in Task Manager if and when the problem comes back.

      Otherwise, it sounds like you’re good to go.

       

      • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by
         Cybertooth.
      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #318093 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Yesterday, I couldn’t even spell confused, and today, I are one!

      LOL Intermittent issues like you just experienced are very frustrating, like the TV that starts working again just as the repairman shows up. Like @pkcano and @mr.natural, I’ll bet that it’s related to the Veeam service(s). Just keep an eye on the PC’s performance and see if you can catch it in Task Manager if and when the problem comes back. Otherwise, it sounds like you’re good to go.

      Thanks again for your help.  Your explanations zero in well on my level of understanding. Not sure just what I would be looking for, but I remember an old adage about what to do with sleeping dogs…  Or another- if it ain’t broke…

       

      Slowpoke (group B)

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #322235 Reply

      Slowpoke47
      AskWoody Plus

      Can anyone who uses Veeam please explain what this graphic is telling me- in particular, the significance of the red segments of the bar graphs?

      Veeam-Agent-screenshot1

      Slowpoke (group B)

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      • #322240 Reply

        Microfix
        Da Boss

        Slowpoke47, you have a DM
        just attach pic to DM reply and I’ll upload it for you.
        Sorted, apologies, we seem to be having issues with upload of pics atm.

        | W8.1 Pro x64 | Linux x64 Hybrids | W7 Pro x86 | XP Pro O/L
        1 user thanked author for this post.

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