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Patch reliability is unclear, but widespread attacks make patching prudent. Go ahead and patch, but watch out for potential problems. |
Susan here with a non patching post: My Wall Street Journal tech alert just came in pointing to an email from Satya Nadella about a big shake up in t
[See the full post at: Cloud is in, desktop is uh …. well?]
Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher
Not surprising coming from Satya himself, I just can’t stand him. I miss the times when Microsoft was a company that always put the customer first, no matter what. I don’t think I even need to explain why this isn’t the case anymore. Windows used to a product that served the customers, today Windows is a cloud based service that instead earns a huge amount of money of the customers information. Windows isn’t the product anymore, the customers are. This would at least be a little more understandable if the OS was free, but it’s not. I have nothing nice to say about Satya Nadella, from my point of view, he killed Windows And Microsoft.
‘Having a deep sense of customers’ unmet and unarticulated needs must drive our innovation’
Our customers don’t know what they want, we will tell them what they want and if they don’t like what we provide they are wrong and not ‘modern’
If you had Mr. Nadella’s ear for a moment, what would you say is unmet?
If I had his ear, I would clean the wax out of it!
As Susan mentioned, we users are thinking, if M$ can’t get the update procedures working correctly, and we don’t trust the Windows foundation, why would we move with M$ to the cloud (clod)?
Nadella & crew are instead thinking, hey if we move everything to the clod, we can force updates whenever we want, and have TOTAL CONTROL.
This disconnect is an unfortunate corollary to the lack of customer focus that FakeNinja mentioned.
Microsoft’s push to the cloud is hilarious given how I don’t use Microsoft’s cloud services. At all.
Windows has always been a base operating system where I exercised full control over it and chose the programs and the services I wanted for it. Updates were installed on my schedule. What I did on my computer was what I chose to do with it, and it wasn’t anybody’s business what I did on my computer. I worked; I played; I gamed; I mooched; I spent lazy mornings and quiet evenings and productive afternoons on the computer.
I still expect that of Windows these days as this is how I’ve always used my computer and honestly, I’ve always found other companies have done a better job with cloud services, particularly Google and their Google Drive suite of applications. As such most of my work is on there right now.
Windows has far too many roots in placing files and data on the local machine to make a transition to the cloud easy and smooth, to the point that I think Microsoft should have just made an entirely new operating system entirely. In fact, that might’ve been the best choice. Google is working on a new OS called Fuchsia which appears to be their attempt at a universal OS. Whether or not they’ll succeed in that regard is anybody’s guess, but they’re making a new OS instead of [*] forcing Android or Chrome OS onto everything, when Android was originally designed for phones and Chrome OS Chromebooks. They’re building a new OS from the ground up, and it seems it’s showing some promise. Windows was designed for desktops and laptops, not mobile phones, and it was designed with the intention that things would be stable from the day you purchased the computer to the day you retired it. If they want an OS that’s based in the cloud with seamless updating and secure-by-design, they should make a new OS, not try to retrofit those features into Windows.
Like I said, Microsoft needs to stop pouring new wine into old wineskins; the old wineskins will burst and you’ll just have a huge mess. If you have new wine, use new wineskins.
Microsoft has in effect been trying to adulterate their best desktop operating systems to become a web-based service, for which they can charge either the user, or get the money from buyers of information dishonestly obtained from the user.
How much better it would have been to let desktop software take its own path forward and develop something new for handheld devices.
The industry I worked in for thirty-seven years, U.S. railroads, repeatedly tried to resist change by using the argument that the available equipment could be adapted even though the market was rejecting it. Accounting systems showed that the equipment had X years left on it, and the industry was determined not to have to write it off, even though the new equipment was significantly more efficient and profitable to operate. This is that, all over again. A classic textbook management error.
Windows as a desktop software does not need to be written off, but to avoid that it needs to be supported as a product with a future.
That whole new operating system is being developed by Microsoft. Microsoft is not idle on this front. Read this article:
Understanding Windows Core OS and Microsoft’s ‘Polaris’ for modern PCs
By Daniel Rubino 26 Jan 2018
https://www.windowscentral.com/understanding-windows-core-os-and-polaris
(This has already been announced by Microsoft as being under development.)
Some highlights:
Windows Core OS is setting the path for Windows for the next decade. How it all works is a bit mysterious, but this is why “Polaris” will be significant for consumers, the education market, and enterprises.
Legacy components are being gutted to streamline Windows for the next decade.
Microsoft wants to get consumers using the Microsoft Store and apps on the UWP platform.
…(I)t should be noted that Microsoft is not forcing Windows Core OS – whether Andromeda or Polaris – on anyone.
(No forced “upgrades” on existing devices — but often will be found installed on new devices. This new Windows Core OS will not be the same as the S Versions of Windows 10.)
…(I)t will be positioned in the education market, including primary and secondary schools, first-line workers (FLW) and information workers.
…(F)uture Always Connected PCs running Snapdragon processors will eventually come with Windows Core OS.
(The article mentions 4G LTE connectivity. They should have printed this as 5G connectivity, as new standards are already in the works for mobile and fixed wireless communications infrastructures.)
None of this is to say that Windows 10 Pro will be retired…But long-term, Microsoft sees Windows Core OS as the primary play for desktop, mobile, gaming consoles, mixed reality, and ambient displays (Surface Hub-like devices).
Is this the sort of new, leaner, more modern OS which Microsoft should be developing?
-- rc primak
@ rc primak
Quoting someone at https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-windows_install/windows-core-os-an-open-source-operating-system/425e8d20-b335-4977-9559-d33f0b188d52 …
Recently, Microsoft has begun developing a next-generation Windows Platform, namely “Windows Core OS”. This platform is like the Android Open-Source Project, which is the “bare-bones” for a proprietary Android operating system. Like the AOSP, Windows Core OS will not include any proprietary binary-blobs or software. Without those, the platform can be open-source.
Just to let you know, Windows Core OS is not for everyday users. It is for device manufacturers and developers to build custom Windows operating systems for their devices. This platform is “modular”, meaning that a version of Windows can be tailored to a device’s needs. To make a proprietary Windows operating system, you would have to inject proprietary binary-blobs and software into the source code.
Microsoft can still make proprietary editions of Windows, based on Windows Core OS. The “Home” edition could be proprietary freeware, while the “Pro” edition will be commercial software. The “Enterprise” edition will be subscription-based, and will be sold at volume licensing as usual.
With Microsoft’s first open-source Windows platform, it could certainly beat AOSP, and could see device manufacturers give up Android on their devices.
Personally, I think Win Core OS will be a lemon like Win 8, Win 10 and Win 10 Mobile if it ever comes into fruition.
Maybe, the windowscentral reporter misunderstood the following for Win Core OS …
Pricing for the SKUs is as follows: Advanced ($101), Core + ($86.66), Core ($65.45), Value ($45), and Entry ($25).
Also, Windows 10 S is dead, it’s now Windows 10 S mode and the baseline SKU will be going away but each version will have an S mode.
https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/151578/new-windows-10-consumer-sku-roadmap-revealed
Quoting Microsoft:
“Over the past several years, Terry and the WDG team transformed Windows to create a secure, always up-to-date, modern OS.”
Well, what is it called and where can we see it? <wink>
I didn’t particularly think that it was necessary to “transform” Windows into anything. It’s always a bit concerning when people whose priorities are very different from one’s own talk of “transforming” things that you kinda liked the way they were. I only like Windows 8.1 to the extent that I can hit CTRL-Z on the transformation, and Windows 10 is too transformed already (and getting worse as time goes on) to ever hope to go back without support from Microsoft. They’re actively working to thwart their customers’ efforts to undo those transformations!
Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, KDE Neon
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, KDE Neon (and Win 11)
Ok, sadly guys that’s the harsh reality we have to accept if we want to keep using windows. in a twisted way THAT CAN be accepted.
HOWEVER, What I will never understand and accept is that Windows wants us to keep updating and updating with broken updates, I mean, if you are forcing the customers to update frecuently, then MAKE SURE the updates works and don’t make costumers suffer for your bad patches.
When i had a laptop and it had Windows 7, it broke because i was clumsy, NEVER because a bad update (I must mention I had my updates configured to automatically download and Install), I learned of the dangers of updates ONLY after starting to use Windows 10
at least this is the only thing we can do as costumers under the new model, making a call to microsoft to ensure its updates are stable.
Windows 10 has so many things about it that my clients and I find unacceptable, but clearly, the crowning glory of all the bad features is uncontrollable, patching which risks bricking machines. When you add the gross level of incompetency that is clearly present, it just adds up to a very bad product.
My clients are sticking with Windows 7 for the foreseeable future and do no Microsoft patching whatsoever. Clearly, the risk of updating for my clients far exceeds the risk of not doing so. For us, January 2020 end of “support” has come and gone. Today, we have 150 machines that run more stably and reliably than any Windows ever. Calls for my assistance are off by at least 50%.
In my humble opinion, Microsoft is on the downhill side (or should I say slide) to an IBM, DEC, Wang future of irrelevancy. I had been a huge Microsoft supporter for literally decades. Today, I cannot think of a single Microsoft product or service that I would recommend to my clients or colleagues.
CT
Today, I cannot think of a single Microsoft product or service that I would recommend to my clients or colleagues.
1. Windows 8.1
2. Excel.
3. Skype for Business.
4. Outlook.
5. OneDrive.
6. Intune.
I could actually go on with the list. The have many good products. But the one they’re most known for has now gone really, really bad.
> 1. Windows 8.1
An okay product, but it’s no Windows 7/XP.
>2. Excel.
An okay product, but trying to get for a business? They push 365, and make it hard as nails to get a desktop copy, and the licensing is even more insane now. This is a far cry from the days of office 2007/2010 where getting business licensing was easy peazy. I think I’ll just use Libreoffice since it’s stable and I don’t have to worry if I accidentally violated a license agreement, or simplifying trying to get basic information about how to get the desktop version and not 36-Spy-On-You.
>3. Skype for Business.
Skype was great. The latest update? Teamspeak 2 back in 2008 was more reliable than this. Oh and making a call didn’t lock powerful desktop machines up for 30 seconds after you press accept. Discord and Tox don’t suffer from this at all. I don’t even care if Discord spys because at least it works.
>4. Outlook.
Is a joke. A sad joke because it was once an excellent product.
>5. OneDrive.
For what purpose? Dropbox already exists. So does Megasync. And at least I know Megasync isn’t snooping through my files like Microsoft said they started doing the other day.
>6. Intune.
Can’t comment, never heard of it.
At this point, I don’t think that I’m putting this too strongly…
There is an antisocial bent to Microsoft these days. It has gone beyond marketing hype.
From Satya’s Nadella’s e-mail, “It also requires that the technologies we create are trusted by the individuals and organizations that use them.”
This is saying the right thing, while doing the wrong thing, in order to advance a personal agenda at the cost of other people. They had the trust, the name, but this is a company that is quickly burning their bridges behind them. Do they really think that they can have a product that millions of people were using every day, and push out updates that are failing and bricking and leaving the products those people are using with bigger security holes, and then talk about ‘trust me?’. His vision is for AI and the Cloud… if that is synonymous with Microsoft’s moral character, it is clear that Microsoft’s AI and Cloud are not worthy of trust.
Reading further, he talks about “the WDG team transformed Windows to create a secure, always up-to-date, modern OS.” There is nothing secure about an operating system that sucks telemetry, randomly updates, pushes unwanted stuff, and brings premature end of life to older hardware. Windows customers, on any supported OS and build are more insecure than ever. And achieving the ‘up-to-date’ part meant forcing unwanted updates on the unwilling. This is something to trust? Trust us to screw up your computer more than any malware has? They’ve earned that kind of trust.
More… “a new team focused on Experiences & Devices. The purpose of this team is to instill a unifying product ethos across our end-user experiences and devices.” The ethos of stick it to them whether they want it or not? I’m looking at what their actions have been, not what they are saying.
And, scanning past all the personnel changes and associated job titles (maybe others are aware of the political positioning within the company, and what it means) comes this:
“As we make technological progress we need to ensure that we are doing so responsibly. To this end, Harry and Brad Smith have established Microsoft’s AI and Ethics in Engineering and Research (AETHER) Committee… AETHER will ensure our AI platform and experience efforts are deeply grounded within Microsoft’s core values and principles and benefit the broader society. Among other steps, we are investing in strategies and tools for detecting and addressing bias in AI systems and implementing new requirements established by the GDPR.”
They could try something really novel… like stepping up and taking responsibility and fix the problems that they have already created… then be proactive.
While there is great opportunity, ensuring we always act responsibly for our customers and partners will continue to be a hallmark of our work.”
They need some core values and principles, but it is absolutely offensive after the barage of bad updates, and ‘mistakes’ that push unwanted and blocked upgrades to say that acting responsibly will continue to be a hallmark of their work. Not an apology or even acknowledgement of their bad behavior and its effect on their customers… so that is more indication that it was intentional.
They need to “bring(ing) together senior leaders from across the company to focus on proactive formulation of internal policies and how to respond to specific issues in a responsible way.” I’d like them to include being responsive to their customer’s, even if Windows is going to be a legacy niche product as they reach for the Clouds. One of the things I’ve learned to look at through the years, is to pay attention to what do people do when interacting with people without power. When all their ‘good’ behavior is for show in front of the right (powerful) people, and they are bullying and abusing those without power, it reveals their true moral character. Any Windows 7 users who had Total Meltdown updates feel abused at this point?
And… their focus on “broader society” while sacrificing users that bought and paid for their products, trusted them, and are being burned by them right and left… is down right evil. I don’t care how successful they are with the cloud and AI… there is a moral failure from the top down.
In order to have a “deep sense of customers’ unmet and unarticulated needs” to “drive our innovation” you would have to actually pay attention, allow customer choice, and repair the damage that your product has done. I only see more marketing hype. Ignoring customers articulated needs for a product that they control, they configure, and use their way, in order to act out Nadella’s need for power and control over them is Conway’s Law in action.
Conway’s Law- “organizations which design systems … are constrained to produce designs which are copies of the communication structures of these organizations.” Now what does that say about Microsoft? Bullying… forcing… ignoring… power plays… and this change at the top hasn’t changed the top bully?
Maybe there is a little bit of light… because Nadella recognizes the need to overcome Conway’s Law… No, that would mean returning choice to the customer, individual updates, opt ins for telemetry, advertising and cloud rather than blocking opt outs, unblock any blocked hardware, stop pushing unwanted apps, and stop acting like he owns the hardware we bought and paid for. Then he could concentrate on producing something people would want to buy… somehow I think this is another say the right thing, while continuing to do the wrong thing…
Woody- I apologize if this would fit better in the rants section… but I don’t feel that I am exagerating the sense of betrayal I have being faced with the last three months updating debacle. What the ****! The amount of whipped cream on garbage is astounding. Why Nadella isn’t ousted is beyond me. I’m rethinking going to Windows 8.1, and jumping away from Microsoft entirely.
Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter
Brilliant post, Elly, congrats!
“Then he could concentrate on producing something people would want to buy”
I think that is the heart of it. You could have added “instead of producing something advertisers would want to invest in”. That’s where it all went wrong in my view. Customers are now at the bottom of the heap.
Yet Microsoft still have to address (internally within the company) the fact as Patch Lady Susan reported the other day that 41% of users are still using Windows 7. They need to understand why.
And no, Elly, your post is not in my view a rant, it is a classic example of everyday technically-minded feedback on the present state of the various Microsoft operating systems.
I personally do not hold Statcounter numbers as being reliable or accurate because they will count the same computer multiple times whereas NMS does not count any computer more than once per day making it far more accurate for the purposes of determining usage shares among various OS’s. NMS has W7 at 44.62% and W10 at 28.98%. Statcounter favors heavy internet use which makes it good for determining which OS the heaviest surfers are using, but not an accurate picture for usage shares at all.
Microsoft doing AI and cloud.. eh, I’m sure some would trust them with that kind of stuff, but there’s already people doing cloud based services better than MS and I’m sure the same could be said for AI. I think this company is making all the wrong choices right now and I don’t see it changing any time soon. Patching has become way too risky IMO, so the conclusion here is correct. MS is losing trust and respect slowly but surely.
The more I mess around with Linux Mint in my VM, the more I become convinced that it might just be good enough to replace Windows for some people especially those who only use their PC’s for simple tasks like browsing and stuff. I think it should be offered on new PC’s and I bet it would catch on, too. Perhaps this is the move that needs to be made to get Linux on more people’s radars because I do believe it’s good enough right now for such a move.
Sessh,
I am positive these are dumb questions. But, over the years, I’ve found that, sometimes, it pays to ask dumb questions as, occasionally, they have revealing answers.
So here they are:
(1) With Mint, is there an easily accessible application (perhaps called “Terminal”) for working from the command line of Mint, an OS that is a variant of Linux?
I imagine that there are manuals for using the Mint command line and also Ubuntu ones that are largely applicable to Mint.
(2) Is there some (preferably free) software for automating the downloading and installing of software packages (e.g. the gcc library of compilers of the GNU).
Thanks.
Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).
MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV
Ubuntu is customized (GNU/Linux) which itself was derived from another distribution named Debian. Mint is Ubuntu 16.04 Long Term Support, (five years after initial release date) with a desktop of your choice and more customization added to make it different.
There are several ways to get software. Using the command line if you know the name of the software package like Abiword (a word processor program). The sudo program temporarily lets you have root privileges needed to use the Advanced Packaging Tool to get and install Abiword.
The command ‘sudo apt-get install abiword’ should automatically resolve and download all dependencies before installing the program.
Another program named Synaptic which is a graphical user interface for using the Advanced Packaging Tool, it should exist in the Mint software repository. You’ll probably have to use the command line to get it first. (The site itself needs updating, but Synaptic has been receiving updates and is stable.)
Muon is also a visual package manager, but it seems to work better with the K Desktop Environment. (I had some trouble, you may not have the problems.)
Oscar, not dumb questions, you are learning…go to linuxmint.com/documentation.php for free user guides. Check out the internet archive for linux mint and other manuals, books. If you really get into it, download Unix manuals, for understanding system architecture and meanings behind commands.
Every Linux distro has a terminal. No need to worry. If you use Linux Mint, you can operate out of the GUI only if you want to.
Use the Software Manager, you get all your software from that and it and everything else is free! (If you are learning keep away from Synaptic for the time being, Software Manager takes care of any dependencies for you, and you can also uninstall from it).
If you have enough RAM on your Windows or Mac, download VirtualBox and install Linux Mint or another user friendly distro into it. Just search for a guide on how to install Linux (distro name) in VirtualBox. When you do install it, you can keep your VM and use it as a reference while you are learning, eg, for installing software, theming and so before you do it in your Linux machine. Check out good videos on YouTube for Linux Mint, installing, using, and all other things you want to learn.
Synaptic also takes care of dependencies and you can also uninstall the software.
You can download a Mint .iso file (about 2GB) and burn it to DVD. When you boot your PC with that you will be running Linux in a ‘live’ session. No need to install to a hard drive to take it for a test drive. https://www.linuxmint.com/download_all.php
Might as well give it a try!
The command line is called ‘Terminal’, and is available from the System menu.
The GNU GCC Compiler Collection and support libraries. as well as Python, come pre-installed. Plus there are many other free development tools and programming IDEs that you can add from the ‘Software Manager’ repository (a friendly GUI app, no command line needed) after installing Mint. For example Geany, Eclipse, Netbeans, & Codeblocks. Many other installers are available if you search for them.
It makes for a very easy to customize development platform.
Mint user guide is here: https://www.linuxmint.com/documentation/user-guide/Cinnamon/english_18.0.pdf
For general Linux how-to questions ‘Linux for Dummies’, and the ‘Linux Bible’ are probably the best places to start. But you can’t just read about it, you have to play along and try it out.
Later on I found more distro specific handbooks like the ‘Fedora Bible’, and ‘Ubuntu Unleashed’ with good coverage for distro specific elements. But there is so much good info on the web now for these distros, and others, that once you understand the basics of Linux, Google is the best way to find answers.
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
You can download a Mint .iso file (about 2GB) and burn it to DVD. When you boot your PC with that you will be running Linux in a ‘live’ session. No need to install to a hard drive to take it for a test drive.
Once you are in a Linux Live session of Linux Mint, you will be mightily tempted to click the “Install” icon, to install it to your hard drive. If you know that you have a good backup of Windows, then you might want to go ahead at some point and install Linux Mint to your hard drive.
If you have at least 4 GB of RAM (more would be better), and if you have installed 64-bit Linux Mint, you can install VMWare Workstation Player, and then install Windows in a virtual machine. This will make the transition to Linux a lot easier, because Windows will be just a click away for those tasks which you haven’t yet figured out how to do in Linux.
It seems your questions have been answered adequately and better than I could have as I’m still learning myself, but the Software Manager is very convenient and for anything else, finding and downloading installers is easy as well. Installing themes and icon packs is easy (once you figure out where they go) and there’s a lot of customizations to play with.
As for the command line, I can do some things, but am far from an expert there. The basic stuff is pretty easy to do, though. It’s no harder than DOS was, but the commands are a bit different. I use the GUI a lot and haven’t had any issues with it. I do plan on continuing to learn the command line and have even wrote a little shell script to install some things during a new install. Finding resources on how to do things is fairly easy.
All in all, I was/am surprised how good Mint is. Give it a try in a VM. Nothing to lose, right? 🙂
The Linux Bible is a good way to get through the basics of the shell command line (terminal), file system, editing text files, managing processes, and writing simple scripts to automate routine repetitive sequences of commands.
Also, VM is something a techy might want to use, but the live DVD is much more accessible for a newbie. And VMs really won’t give you an idea how the distro will react to running on the bare metal of your hardware. The VM hypervisor provides a sterile virtual hardware environment for the guest OS that doesn’t reflect the hardware you are actually using.
So VM is another great option, but not necessarily the easiest way to approach a Linux demo.
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
JohnW, MrJimPhelps, Sessh and Anonymous:
Thank you so much. You have given me what I need to make an informed decision about which Linux Distro to go for.
I have been spoiled rotten, in many years working, first with UNIX and then with LINUX, because I’ve never had to take care of the installation and maintenance of the system myself. Or choose the OS in the first place. It has always just been there, ready for me to use. If I had any questions or problems, a visit, phone call or email exchange with the Sysadmin took care of that. But I’ve moved on, the world moved on, and now the Sysadmin is me.
Looking now for an alternative to Windows 7 once it reaches end of life next January, and with a recent positive experience using the Mac OS, with its user friendlier characteristics, having heard that Mint might be also like that, I decided to know more about it.
You have given me the opportunity to do just that, with your kind and generous advice.
Woody’s is unquestionably a great forum, because it brings in the like of you.
Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).
MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV
I started with mainframe computers back when Bill Gates and Steve Jobs were still messing around in their garages … 😉
But then one day I ran across a ‘Red Hat Linux 9 for Dummies’ book on the shelf at a local CompUSA store about 15 years ago. So I took it home and used the included CD to install RH 9 on a spare PC that I had kicking around. It was impressive that my PC was running without Windows! OMG!
Although I have continued to be a Windows power user over the years, I have to say that initial Linux experience has certainly broadened my horizons. I cannot help but think that the computing future will be different from what it is now.
Linux has made major inroads to mainframe computing and cloud computing, and embedded devices, as well as Android, where it is a strong contender. The desktop is where the last stand will be held. Maybe MS has seen the future and they are packing their bags, LOL!
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
As one of my physics professors use to say, the only dumb question is the one you don’t ask.
Elly, I’m pretty sure that if yow were able to dig out the statements that were being made by Wang, DEC, IBM in their halcyon days, you would find the same kinds of statements you see today from Microsoft management. They are so out of touch with their customers that they have no idea, not even an inkling what they think. The senior minions that feed the top brass tell them what they always liked when they heard it before. They are also skilled at saying the right things.
I Have to laugh when people ask what is Microsoft’s phone number or email address. There are such things but they ring or show up in very far off places that have no real connection with Microsoft.
Bottom line is that among many other things, they just have no picture of what their customers think or want. Its the old story. No one will tell the king that he is actually naked.
CT
Unfortunately it’s not quite the old story. Nowadays the Emperor has a well-funded marketing department whose purpose it is to ridicule and marginalize anyone who claims to recognize something that’s not in the business plan du jour.
-Noel
But tech is supposed to be for an end user… me… and my computer and my data are not secure on a system that is sucking telemetry… no matter who is at the other end of it. As I understand it, security is about maintaining the confidentiality, integrity and availability of my data. My computer is not secure as long as telemetry going out (confidentiality is violated) and updating coming in (integrity of my system) are out of my control. Security is about who has access. Telemetry violates the security of my laptop, plain and simple. My laptop… my security… The fact that Microsoft is the name of the malware, doesn’t make it okay.
Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter
Privacy is a big part of security. If someone you don’t know (e.g. Microsoft) has access to your confidential or personal data, then there is no privacy; and your security is determined by how much that person (or organization) can be trusted with your data.
Would it be secure to mail a copy of your personal diary to Microsoft? If I can completely trust them that they won’t peek at the contents nor share it with anyone else, not now or at anytime in the future, then yes, it is secure. But I don’t have that level of trust with Microsoft. There are very few people I trust that much.
But I am quite sure that Microsoft is more trustworthy in this regard than Google.
I put a lot of Mac articles there. MacOS for Windows Wonks.
I find that Windows 10 Pro is treating me well. I should add that my schedule for quality updates is up to 30 days delayed and my schedule for feature updates is up to 269 days delayed. I was nervous about Microsoft treating feature updates as allowing for up to 365 days, or even 360 days as being too close to “magic numbers.”
My original value for feature updates was 90 days but I relied on PKCano’s advice to move it out to 120 days. Then when I saw what a mess Version 1709 was at 120 days, I boosted my delay up to 270 days and then more recently brought it down to 269 days. There is a bit of superstition built into my last two changes, but that is what I am right now, superstitious and suspicious.
I wish I could be more rational about this.
Jonathan
Whenever the senior execs at my company would make grand announcements, we used to play a fun little game called ‘buzzword bingo’! 🙂
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
“If you had Mr. Nadella’s ear for a moment, what would you say is unmet?”
The two “Ps”.
Patching and Privacy.
Get those right, and I’ll seriously consider upgrading my two home computers (one gaming, one browsing/voluntary work documents etc – I’m retired) to Windows 10. Continue to get them wrong and the chances are growing every month that I’ll remain with an unsupported Windows 7 post-January 2020, being safer than a supported Windows 7 or Windows 10 currently.
If I wasn’t a pc gamer there’s no reason I would need a computer at home running Windows. Thanks to my Nintendo Switch I don’t even turn on my laptop much anymore. From a corporate perspective we’re stuck until someone can come up with an inviting alternative. It reminds me of when I started with the company I have worked with all these years. The company used Lotus 123 and Word Perfect but over time had to migrate to MS Office in order to share information with other organizations without issues.
Maybe it’s time to consider a different OS and use the Office 365 portal for your office needs. I’m sure glad I don’t have many more years to go until retirement.
Red Ruffnsore
Satya Nadella was and remains a ‘cloud’ guy so I guess this was inevitable… with apparently little or no thought to the huge numbers of Windows users who have no wish for, no need for nor – in many cases – any understanding of what ‘the cloud’ is.
Satya, when you’re a hammer, all you see is nails….
Well done, sir… Microsoft is now just an up-to-date version of All your base belong to us.
Nonsense.
Windows 10 is perfect. Microsoft Edge is perfect. What’s the fuss? At least, that’s what a few posters here keep banging on about.
It’s time to take off the rose-colored glasses, folks. The evidence shows a smoking gun. This letter says a lot about Microsoft’s past, present, and future initiatives. Windows 10 was a turning point for Microsoft, that much is clear. It’s taken a while to steer the ship a different direction, but it’s finally happened. From here on out, it’s full steam ahead…right into the iceberg-crested horizon.
“You’ll eat what we give you.” -Microsoft
Since everyone else has focused on the “can we get functional patches released on a reasonable schedule again” question, here’s a different one: considering that stable high-speed internet access is far from being ubiquitous, even in the country MS has its headquarters in, why is MS focusing on services that require such and are therefore worthless in areas that don’t have that type of internet access or are not usable when internet access is disrupted? This includes Windows updates/upgrades, of course. (shakes head) Of course, there’s the additional question: with the security issues in your operating systems, web browsers, and office software, aka the means to access your cloud services within your native ecosystem, why would anyone be willing to trust that their data is safe and secure on your cloud servers?
(Side note: this is still what amazes me the most about people and the cloud, perhaps because unlike most of my peers I’m an internet old fart and I have seen cloud services get shut down, and so prefer using them only as an additional backup, at work, when the files need to be shared as well.)
“I have seen cloud services get shut down”
And, one could add, hacked to steal the personal identifiable information of tens of thousands, or millions of dollars worth of Bitcoin, or broadcasting misinformation through Cloud-based social networks from bogus accounts, or…
Also: good point about the lack of connectivity in large swaths of the nation, that either makes nonsense of the new direction MS is being given, or suggests that those in charge there are feeling confident that stocks will go up like by charm whenever “Cloud!” is heard by potential investors. And that “large swaths of the nation” are not their problem.
As to why the drive to “disrupt” with novelty useful, necessary and time-tested ways of doing things: the battlecry of “Move fast and break things” is another indulgent and retrospective self-justification by people who got lucky when using their sharp elbows to advance within their corporate bureaucracies, often beyond their abilities. And, on actually reaching the heights of their particular heaps and then expected to actually do something important, prove themselves quite capable of doing damage and little else. So that’s what they do.
Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).
MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV
“Having a deep sense of customers’ unmet and unarticulated needs must drive our innovation.”
What about their articulated needs? Those persistently seem to go ignored.
I might mention to Mr. Nadella that he’s doing an unprecedented job of getting Microsoft out of the Windows as an Operating System business.
Supposedly he’s a high level engineer, but even plankton can sense that releasing an operating system every 6 months is just silly. If Microsoft wasn’t profitable enough with 3 year cycles, try 2, or even 1.5. 6 months is lunacy.
Oh, and let Mr. Nadella know please that with software as complex as Windows testing really IS needed – and not just end user testing!
-Noel
NYT: Microsoft Reorganizes to Fuel Cloud and A.I. Businesses
“The Windows era at Microsoft, long in eclipse, is officially history.
Microsoft said on Tuesday that it was splitting up its Windows engineering team and that the leader of its Windows business was leaving.”
Indeed.
What I wonder about is this: Why are the executives so focused that they can’t imagine a company that does multiple things well?
More “and” and less “or” in the big picture plans please.
Why can’t there be a small, nimble Windows organization that just keeps polishing the best things the prior versions brought us. Why should things like Windows Backup need to be deprecated at all? They worked. How much could it cost to just maintain them, maybe polish them up.
Looking at usage stats of arguably the best release of Windows (OK, we won’t debate 8.1 vs. 7 right now), how much better would the desktop PC world – which isn’t going away have liked a cleaner, better-tuned, more usable Windows 7.1, 7.2, etc. than this Modern phone apps garbage?
-Noel
Well that is certainly does not sound good. Looks like Windows has become such a small slice of their pie (2% growth most recent quarter, compared to 98% for Azure), that it has become insignificant to their goals.
I think I may be picking up an extra copy of Windows 8.1 to have around in case Windows 10 takes a turn for the worse. I’ll be needing something stable to run as a Windows VM in my Linux box. 🙂
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
That would argue for selling off the Windows franchise while it still has value. That is, were it not for Microsoft’s desire to milk the franchise to bootstrap itself into new businesses in which it has so far proven to be mostly incompetent.
It would be good news to wake up some morning and find that Windows has been sold to a buyer that wants to make it succeed.
Such things happen all the time–breaking up big companies that have grown sloppy and unsure of what they’re doing or selling. Companies that indulge management mistakes like decimating a well-accepted product to chase butterflies. Along comes a raider or someone else and the furniture starts getting thrown overboard. It’s not a pretty process but the root cause is the arrogant, ignorant mismanagement we’re seeing now.
Perhaps related to Microsoft’s personnel changes: Why can’t Microsoft get Windows 10 updates right? (article) (January 2017)
According to … http://www.zdnet.com/article/heres-outgoing-windows-chief-terry-myersons-email-to-the-troops/ , it seems Terry Myerson is the actual brains behind Win 10’s forced auto-updates/upgrades and Telemetry in 2015, and not Satya Nadella, because Terry was the brains behind Office 365 subscriptions in 2008 and the failed Windows Mobile in 2009.
Maybe, Satya will reverse the damage done to Windows by Terry, eg abolish forced auto-updates/upgrades and Telemetry in Win 10. Otherwise, Win 10 will likely be an eventual train-wreck and the failure of Win 10 will also cause M$’s Cloud, AI and Virtual Reality ambitions to disappear in the cloud .
I find it fascinating that the push to force feed cloud services by MS comes at a time when the viability of local computing and associated costs of backup storage have never been more favorable. The last big push for cloud computing was called ‘timesharing’ when firms like Interactive Data Corp. rented computer resources because the fixed overheads were prohibitive of distributive computing. Unlike Mr. Nadella, I do not try to look like a Steve Jobs wannabe nor engage in karmic utterances. I just try to make sense of the world and fundamentally I have concluded that moving away from using MS products and services is more or less inevitable now. The time line may be a bit ambiguous but Mr. Nadella will either bend you to his will or exile you as a MS customer. In the meantime, everyone should keep a complete list of their unarticulated needs!
I find it fascinating that the push to force feed cloud services by MS comes at a time when the viability of local computing and associated costs of backup storage have never been more favorable
That is a very astute observation.
Just imagine that business makes a lot of money by recycling history, and they don’t even have to be particularly creative.
There will be a time for “well, that cloud thing didn’t really work, so we listened to our customers and now your AI system runs entirely on your local hardware with or without a network connection.
Reference the difficulties this very site has had (is having? will have?) with being responsive as good examples of why cloud computing just doesn’t make sense.
-Noel
“Going forward with artificial intelligence, we have to have an operating system that can self heal.”
If MS can’t fix Windows manually, how will they ever create an AI that can do it for them?
“Going forward with artificial intelligence, we have to have an operating system that can self heal.” If MS can’t fix Windows manually, how will they ever create an AI that can do it for them?
It depends on which party gets to define the injury that is to be healed.
If the injury is the minimal telemetry setting, the removal of UWP apps, the disabling of Windows Update Assistant or the associated services, or anything like that, then we’ve already seen Windows 10 “self heal.” Another term for “self heal,” in this context, would be “overriding the conscious decisions the owner of the PC has made regarding the equipment he owns.”
Given that potential, along with Microsoft’s known tendencies to substitute their own will for that of the PC owner, I’d really rather my OS not self-heal. I’d rather it sit there quietly doing what I tell it to, day in and day out, but if I should happen to ask it for diagnostic data, it could then inform me of the “injuries” it has detected, and ask me if I would like to heal them. After securing my permission, then and only then would it be permitted to “heal” anything.
Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, KDE Neon
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, KDE Neon (and Win 11)
I would tell him that he’s won the battle and lost the war.
They are so out of touch with what people want despite continually trying to bash people over the head with a hammer of what they think people want, or what MS wants people to want.
People have already started trying out options – hence, the war is over.
Chromebooks have taken over schools; Apple is out, and MS wasn’t really a competitor there anyway (other than the infrastructure). Google has a lot of attractive options and aggressive pricing with GSuite, and guess what? Fretting over patching is not a thing!
I know a LOT of people in the field, including many who are “decision makers” or “decision influencers” who are looking at other options now in the Linux realm. Mainly this includes Ubuntu, but RHEL and Fedora are also candidates.
Satya Nadella should enjoy his time while it lasts. He’ll be ousted once the stocks plummet, and a new MS will begin anew at that time, with a lot of garbage clean up to do and a lot of customer good will to attempt to regain after decades of having it and probably a decade of losing it.
I have been using a Microsoft OS since the DOS days, and the very first version of Windows.
I have also been working with Linux since the early Red Hat days.
In my opinion, Windows 10 may technically be the best Windows ever, but I do not trust the business practices of the current Microsoft management.
Now I must use every trick I have learned in my career as an IT professional to wrangle Windows 10 into submission. I really wonder WT*?!? the casual user will do to maintain control of their personal computing environment. This really should not be an issue! I have my system set up to take image backups on a daily basis, so if Microsoft manages to wreck my PC, I can always roll back to yesterday and unplug the internet.
I am really considering moving my day to day operations to a Linux distro, and just keeping one Windows machine running for applications that only runs on Windows. No, or minimal, network access and nothing critical. the Windows only software will be narrowed down to only a few essential programs that I cannot replace with native Linux apps. 🙂
I have already tried using Linux as a daily driver in the past, for over a year, and it was a relief not to worry about MS updates. For most everyday tasks, the native apps for web browsing, email, and office are sufficient. I would only need to use my Windows machine for specific needs, so I think I am about prepared to make the switch. 🙂
Sorry Nadella!
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
rc primak, 
AJNorth, 
SueW, 
AlexEiffel, 
johnf, 
Elly, 
Sessh, 
wdburt1, 
flackcatcher, 
Cybertooth, 
Bill C. Have you tried running Windows 7 or Windows 8.1 in a vm in one of your Linux boxes? If so, how did it go?
I started with DOS 3.3, that is, if you don’t count the Atari ST (my first computer).
I probably could, but a few of my applications depend on Windows drivers running on bare metal. Otherwise, yup, that be the way to go! 😉
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
FYI: Tested out Windows XP as a VM guest in a Linux host under VirtualBox. Works great! Don’t have a spare license for Win 7 or 8.1 kicking around, but am tempted to hit eBay up for an extra 8.1 Pro license…
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
In reality we are all watching the last gasp of a desperate man doing something, anything to keep his job. If you have not, go back up thread and read Elly’s comment again. She has pulled all the problems with not only Microsoft, but with the other big techs in one very smart bow. I’m envious. There is a reckoning coming very soon now. The population of the United States thinks many of these tech corporation now are the enemy of the Country and Constitution. As Elly says, the culture-social disconnect is very real. Politically, these Tech CEOs are idiots. Professionally, they are fools. Like Nadella, most of these CEO choose the Pacific (IE:China) over Western business and Culture. Now the West led by the United States is about to strike back. This is to be expected, when any organization threatens a Countries self worth. Frankly, the board should have put Nadella out to pasture long ago, giving all the warning they had about the drop in profits, not to mention the many complaints from their clients about the performance of Windows 10. The only thing saving Microsoft is Windows 7. Right at this moment, there is no clear replacement in either the corporate or consumer sector. That won’t last long. Someone at some point will invest heavy in Linux to beef up the support for the civilian sector. Apple has always wanted to take Microsoft down a peg, and that opening is now here, and Google is waiting in the weeds(with their on anti trust issues and social-culture on full display). While it may not look like it, we may soon be entering a new golden era of computing thanks to Satya Nadella. Now that’s ironic.
Any halfway reputable tech company that comes up with a new OS that respects user privacy and choice will have a winner on their hands.
But it MUST genuinely respect privacy and choice, otherwise it will be just another Windows 10 and it will dive like Bernie Madoff’s net worth. “Better the devil we know…”
I’m eager to see if any tech bigwigs out there “get it.” Not holding my breath, though.
“CHOICE” is the key word. I’d gladly accept W10 if I could:
a/ select which applications I want to install (and which NOT, obviously) during the installation
b/ select my default apps and expect MS to respect that
c/ let me decide if and when I want to install any updates
I don’t need much fancy stuff from the OS. It just has to work and get out of my programs way.
If you had Mr. Nadella’s ear for a moment, what would you say is unmet?
I’d be very clear about two things.
1) The biggest unmet need is listening to your customers. You’re not doing that. The level at which you’re not doing it is so extreme, that I’ve lost faith in Microsoft striving to meet client needs, or that if I bring up an issue, any of your teams will listen, or if they are listening, that they actually have any power to do anything about that issue, or if they have that power, that someone won’t override them before the issue is fully resolved, or if no-one overrides them, that QA will catch any problems before the feature or fix that addresses my issue goes out the door. If there is a QA department any more. I’m at the point where I believe Microsoft is succeeding not through being a great, innovative company, but by inertia and monopoly, and absolutely nothing else. If true, someday a tipping point will be reached where enough angry people will lead to a competitor rising and eating your lunch.
2) As Susan said, the Windows Foundation is, at this point seriously in need of work. I feel like you replaced all of your QA department with consumers and businesses as unpaid beta testers, and you are completely deaf to our pain. I would not feel out of place in calling Windows 10 a perpetual beta-release, where things are about 80% good, but the remainder is problematic, and you’re apathetic. This is compounded by the fact that in the business world, you’re double-monetizing us by scraping data and analytics from your telemetry. Your rapid-release cycle that was supposed to help us has not only not helped, it has made things worse, and it’s clear you weren’t prepared for it. And for those of us servicing multiple SMB clients, you have completely destroyed our patch control unless we have a WSUS or SCCM setup at every site; there is no third-party patching that can manage your animal, and you’re making our lives miserable. Managed Service Providers across the country have the impression that you don’t care. Satya, I hope you’ll prove me wrong someday.
Bill Gates wasn’t perfect. Neither was Steve Ballmer. But under their management, I was able to accomplish a lot more with your products, and felt like I could find someone who actually listened to IT people and used it to better their company and industry rather than steamrolling the industry and just doing what you wanted.
Edit to remove HTML. Please use the “text” tab in the entry box when you copy/paste.
I would have liked to write a thoughtful dissertation here, but I am so depressed by the current state of affairs that I will just emit a collection of random thoughts.
Customers? Which customers? Ad providers? Software developers that will give you a cut to sell through your flea market of an app store?
I don’t think listening to the customer matters if you know what you are doing and you know better than the customer about how to meet these unconscious unmet needs. One could argue Steve Jobs did that at Apple and it worked well for his customer base that seemed to be the most loyal fans you could have at that time.
I don’t think Microsoft was ever good at listening to the customers. They made me mad often, but maybe I wasn’t a typical customer. The thing is they did a lot of good things and bad things, so the former was enough for them to continue. Let’s get some perspective:
Win 3.1: a little bit cute interface to run Word and Excel and no real multitask. OS/2 was a much better OS with real multitasking and could boot a recompiled Win 3.1 version in 3 seconds instead of about 6 for the Microsoft native one. You could play Doom and download while working in Word. But this nice idea of an OS stopped soon after.
95 : a cute OS that slowed you down from command line in many ways but helped you speed up some stuff and automate some things you should never have to do yourself, although if you remember correctly a lot of the drivers and the subtle details of plug and play weren’t very good. Remember when you had to find that install CD again to put it in the computer for whatever Windows wanted? I remember also finding it much heavier to run my old DOS games slower. But I liked it enough despite the downsides of it and having to click many Windows open to find what I wanted on a miserable 640×480 screen. The world had to adapt and it was ok. I was going to stop creating macros to start my DOS software without typing long paths and I would learn to do things differently, that was fine because the world of possibilities with computers would expand so much from now on.
98: Wow, did I love that OS. More stable, more polished, polished some stuff that was a pain in 95. But it also integrated IE with Windows, what a dumb idea! It still blue screened quite often. It didn’t protect the computer from bad Creative drivers or even bad software that could write in bad parts of memory and make you reboot or just mess up your experience until you do. Security was miserable and you would only run admin, but the Internet hadn’t catched up to it. Would we tolerate all that today? This was also the era of ActiveX, vbScript and trying to prevent other browsers from seeing the Internet. Did the customer asked for that? Still, we hung on to Windows. There was Office, great video games, software from hardware devices bought was running on Windows, you couldn’t not run Windows, almost. And it was quite good for its time, not needing a lot of time to maintain despite the blue screens.
XP : Slower, heavier. Much better in terms of stability. Funny looking, but a good interface in terms of functionalities. Easy to set settings. Simple, good. Only thing deeply missing from user experience was a search tool that Google desktop pioneered. The other OSes would refine little things, but nothing revolutionary except under the hood better security and support of newer hardware technologies and some software things like mirrored drives on ReFS, probably enterprise management tools too for sure. To me, XP was the closest to the right balance of simplicity and features from the USER point of view. Don’t get me wrong, I would take a lot of the subtle improvements done after (WIN-X menu, better command prompt with copy-paste easiness, improved file transfer dialogs, etc.) but not all the scattering of settings and the confusion of all the possible combinations of obscure settings started with Vista, its ton of useless services always started and its cumbersome networking center and hiding of the network card quick access.
I don’t think Microsoft listened to their customers much over the years. They did what they thought was good. The less productive launcher of Windows 7 with default settings where you can’t easily see every open Windows without more clicks, all the things they pushed that didn’t work that great and that they removed the next version of Windows: gadgets, charms menu, homegroups, unnecessary complication of networking with weird things like webclient service that broke integration with other platforms, a ton of useless services, the weird protections in Vista to downgrade video quality if it suspected you of trying to read protected content in a way not intended, lots of not so great ideas, introduction of special folders that just got filled with program data among your documents and added to the confusion of users trying to make things easier for them, etc.
Then came the dumbification of the OS to make things simple for people who have no clue about computers. So, remove details about what feature does (are you running a company or a house? type of question where you don’t know what the answer do, meaningless error messages that don’t give any detail, no description of patches and regrouping them together to prevent understanding easily what is going on, etc.). The problem is the lambda users are not in a better position to fix their OS when it says : we can’t install the feature update, press Ok to try again and now even their by default “expert” that is helping them often can’t either. Did I mention the fact that Windows 10 would not even support properly changing the location of your UWP apps folder, as if anyone who would run a small SSD and a big hard drive would be stuck with this? But the user envisioned by Microsoft should not think about any of this. These problems do not exist.
There is a lesson to learn from the mobile revolution. It succeeded because it filled a need and also because it was a simple product that was working quite well. Iphones were stable simple products that worked and very quickly got you the information you needed even if it was “off”, compared to PCs. This is the basics done quite right. Fast forward to today where they keep adding things too fast, making things more complex, more integrated together inside the OS and not working at all as fine as they were. Big mistake. IOS11 has been a terrible thing. It still feels like there is so much new stuff going on in the background, you don’t know what it is, but your battery drains and what you type on the keyboard takes a few seconds to show up and you disabled every background service or app you could. This is ugly. And what was the response? Tim Cooks admitted the problem and promised they would slow down and test better. Good.
I would argue Microsoft never listened that much to customers. They tried to anticipate what they thought would be good for the customers. I would say they were not that good at that, they made lots of mistakes, but they were good enough to retain and grow their market with everything else in the context that made it possible. And yes, offering choice is a big part of this. Imagine if you had to use Windows with all its default settings, not sure many experts here would be happy to not see their file extensions, to give only the simplest of example.
Microsoft never understood that maybe the person that never used a computer is not the right benchmark to use. It could go in-between and adopt the idea that a relatively small learning curve with the added benefits of availability of more advanced usage capabilities is the way to go. Now they cut everything to the lowest denominator. I’m not the one to advocate compiling the programs yourself. I enjoy automation where I don’t add value, for sure, that is not what we are talking about. Making things longer and manual to feel in control is not a good use of my time. But..
In the last few years, we reached new heights of customer’s contempt with the introduction of obviously detrimental “features” that take over your privacy, something they had not that badly handled in the past, and just ignore your unconscious unmet needs about that. Plus, they now more than ever make decisions that if explained clearly to people what it meant, would not be accepted. Resetting privacy settings after feature updates, enabling again things you really didn’t want like hibernation or disabling things you wanted like system restore, removing Google as your default search engine to replace it with Bing, forcing Cortana on users, installing parallel updating and ignoring users preference to not get updated to the latest version if they set telemetry to 0 because this is what they wanted although it was clearly stated it would not do nothing if not on Enterprise or Education version, that is a clear disregard for what customers want…
So Satya, I have a few questions for you.
Could you focus on the cloud without tying it to the OS, just like MS could have made Windows 98 without IE baked in?
While you pursue the cloud, could you focus on making the best desktop ever and leave it able to run streamlined and fast, with all privacy sensitive features optional and clearly easy to choose, with no unnecessary processes so people actually want to use Windows to access your cloud?
Could you stop pushing that multi-platform one interface to rule them all that will seamlessly provide Word on your Windows phone and Windows desktop? That will not happen. It will never be good enough on both platform at the same time if done that way.
After all these years, do you still tell people to stop using Google because Bing is so much better that it will take it over soon? I would have preferred you continue working on Bing, nothing personal, but we don’t agree when it comes to forecasting what the future will be and your track record hasn’t been stellar. Microsoft was going to make money with the cloud, that was a given, but it didn’t need to ruin the rest of the business.
This is an accurate and insightful account of Microsoft’s handling of Windows since Win 3.1.
You’re sticking your neck out to claim that Microsoft has not been very good at listening to the customers for a long time. I applaud the nuance. Too many seem to think that everything would be all right if we went back to Gates and Ballmer; it’s all Nadella’s fault. Right.
That recognition that M$ could succeed in spite of its years of malpractice reflects the reality that it takes time to ruin a multi-billion-dollar franchise.
AlexEiffel: Good posting. I imagine you know that if you could get Mr. Nadella’s ear, whatever you said to him will go in that ear and come right out the other.
As that infamous hotelier and jailbird, the late Leona Hemsley, reportedly said about paying her taxes, that was something for “the little people.” Of which, self-evidently, she was not one.
When a mediocre mind reaches, somehow, the top of a large corporation and its culture of obedience to the Big Boss, he or she (and I’m looking at you, Carly Fiorina) can take the company any way they want, even if it is a very bad one, at lest for the time being, and put their own dirty thumbprints all over it. Then, on feeling their real path setting power inside their company, they often fancy themselves capable of taking the whole outside world wherever they want, as well.
The way they see it, why even listen to you, when they can make everyone, you included, do things their way?
Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).
MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV
Wow, so many good replies here! Thanks to everyone.
My clients are banks, healthcare, and others that have heavy requirements on security. I’ve already heard feedback before on NOT moving to the cloud. They do not feel comfortable having any of their sensitive data outside their organizations.
Just my 2 cents…
And when personal computer users evaluate their need for security, they might consider… do they have banking info, healthcare info, legal info, and personal info that they don’t want the neighbors to have access to? Their need to protect their privacy is greater than the bank. The reason banks and healthcare have ‘greater’ security needs is because they don’t want to be liable for the misuse of private information. People need to protect their own personal and private information even more stringently than banking and healthcare do, not less. If the bank is robbed, the customers still have access to their money, but if they get tagged with identity theft, it becomes a full time job to try and get their money and credit back. Any one keeping track of how many organizations have reported being hacked for data? Target? Equifax? Facebook? Worse, any idea how many times a business has no idea that they have been hacked? How is it that Microsoft isn’t in the forefront of securing your personal computer, instead of building in vulnerabilities so they can harvest your data?
Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter
Not only shouldn’t they move to the cloud, but they absolutely must avoid Win 10 as well. For your healthcare clients it is not, nor can it be made HIPAA compliant (despite what some claim). I believe the financial and insurance marketplace will also have some issues with the lack of security that can be achieved on a Win 10 platform. And then there’s the simple fact that it is a completely unstable solution that seems to only benefit all the additional IT staff or consultants you’ll need to keep it sort of running.
So far the most stable platforms I support are running Win 7, Win 2008 R2, and Win 2012 R2 with auto updates turned off (set to never) and patching done to the absolute minimum required levels to address actual known issues.
Just remember:
Win10 Pro x64 22H2, Win10 Home 22H2, Linux Mint + a cat with 'tortitude'.
HiFlyer, 
MrJimPhelps, 
Ascaris, flackcatcher, 
Tom in Az, 
Rock, AJNorth, Sessh, Cybertooth, 
JohnW, wdburt1, 
OscarCP, Elly ROFLMAO, that’s hilarious!!! 🙂
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
Basically, the Internet Cloud means rental of computers for storage and/or as servers, instead of paying much more money to buy your own computers for storage and/or as servers. It’s like the difference between renting and buying a home/apartment/store/office.
Certain sectors need the Cloud to save costs on capital expenditure, eg startups, new websites, new online stores, etc. The Cloud is inherently insecure, like a landlord can enter into a rental home for certain purposes or evict the renters at anytime with a month’s notice and a rental is usually not very secured by the landlord (eg no burglar alarm, CCTV, window iron grills, etc).
The ironic thing is that a significant percentage of cloud servers and hosted environments are powered by Linux … at the expense of Windows …
Linux is leading the enterprise shift to cloud
http://www.zdnet.com/article/linux-foundation-finds-enterprise-linux-growing-at-windows-expense/
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
“The Windows era at Microsoft, long in eclipse, is officially history. Microsoft said on Tuesday that it was splitting up its Windows engineering team and that the leader of its Windows business was leaving.”
That certainly seems to say that MS has acknowledged that Windows 10 has been a complete failure and have now thrown in the towel on Windows altogether. It’s just another reason to avoid patching IMO because now, who is going to be making and fixing those patches and how many people will be working on these things? I think MS will end up regretting these decisions they are making in the future.
It’s sad that it has come to this and I too may buy an extra copy or two of Windows 7 and perhaps get a copy of 8.1 as well just in case I ever want to give it a spin.
Not surprising coming from Satya himself, I just can’t stand him. I miss the times when Microsoft was a company that always put the customer first, no matter what. I don’t think I even need to explain why this isn’t the case anymore. Windows used to a product that served the customers, today Windows is a cloud based service that instead earns a huge amount of money of the customers information. Windows isn’t the product anymore, the customers are. This would at least be a little more understandable if the OS was free, but it’s not. I have nothing nice to say about Satya Nadella, from my point of view, he killed Windows And Microsoft.
I totally agree. Yet Microsoft’s investors haven’t realized this as of yet. The downfall of Microsoft, if things continue along its present track, is both predicable yet avoidable. Given Microsoft’s history of incredibly slow internal acknowledgement of their own mistakes, I figure that the end will occur before Microsoft can belatedly realize their own mistakes. Eventually, the failure of Microsoft will become something which is taught by colleges in business school classes.
Pity that IBM abandoned OS/2.
But in an item from The Register, 19 May 2017, it seems that it might not have actually been laid to rest:
What is dead may never die: a new version of OS/2 just arrived
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/05/19/new_version_of_os_2_arca_os_5/
Now, if the folks running that project… .
The modern version of OS/2 is called eComStation, and you can get it here:
https://www.ecomstation.com/
IBM had no choice but to abandon OS/2. They had lost their lead and were playing catch up to Windows. They were pouring money down a rathole trying to turn things around, but it wasn’t working, so they finally bailed on it. They turned it over to the eComStation folks, and it has been going with them ever since.
I wish OS/2 had succeeded. At the time that OS/2 was the leading candidate to replace DOS, I asked my boss why we didn’t develop for OS/2. He told me that OS/2 was so stable that it didn’t represent the real world!
IBM came up with a superior product, but they had no clue how to market it. Microsoft ate IBM’s lunch in the marketing arena, and as a result we got Windows instead of OS/2.
I remember at that time (around 1990) being invited to a meeting with Microsoft Sales guys and a Vendor I knew (no longer in business). The MS guys were as sharp as a school of sharks, they went into how to compare Windows to OS2…and how to make OS2 look bad (crash). Then again, that was the time when Microsoft “looked the other way” as far as user licenses for Word, etc were involved…they knew they needed to get into PC shops, and could charge through the nose later. If you get the apps free, you need the OS.
I also remember seeing the IBM Sales guys at my workplace…I told them at the time they needed to give OS2 away for free, but charge for support (similar to what Red Hat does now), in order to encourage companies to use OS2, and to encourage developers by creating a bigger market for OS2 apps, as Microsoft was going hard after their markets. The IBM Sales people simply laughed it off.
Thirty years later, we see who had the last laugh.
I remember several departments at my company in the early 90’s were switching to OS/2, because of the multitasking appeal, prior to Windows 95.
We were also running WordPerfect and Lotus123 on our Windows PCs. We started noticing that a lot of our vendors were using Microsoft Word, so exchanging documents could often get tricky.
Windows 95 came along. Then our company bought into MS Office 100%. Bye, bye legacy apps. Soon OS/2 got buried. Microsoft started giving away an internet browser for free, bundled with the OS.
It was always about market share, and becoming a monopoly.
Windows 10 Pro 22H2
AJNorth: “What is dead may never die.”
According to the article he gives a link to:
“ArcaOS 5.0 now offers itself up as a migration option for users of both eCS/2 or OS/2. The new OS, numbered 5.0 to suggest itself as an heir to OS/2’s last release, promises it can run native OS.2, Windows 3.1 and DOS applications.”
So, for now, this is aimed at installations running heritage software under old operating systems (“OS.2, Windows 3.1”).
If the folks running that project… indeed. And if MS did not employed more lawyers who know how to sue than it employs developers that know what to do…
Now, FYI, about MS’ efforts to create to create a quantum computer, along with scientists in a number of reputable organizations around the world (and closer to home, people such a Fields’ Medalist, i.e. the winner of the equivalent of a mathematician’s Nobel), while putting Windows out to pasture to pour more money into it:
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43580972
https://www.nature.com/news/inside-microsoft-s-quest-for-a-topological-quantum-computer-1.20774
You may draw your own conclusions. To me, the whole thing seems iffy: the key to success, for this project, the creation topological Marjorana quasi-particles to use as very stable qubits (in this case, a special combination of electrons that act as a single particle), today is just a glimmer in some physicists’ eyes. But, MS having shoveled money into this project for a long time now, there seems to be little prospects for a change in direction any time soon. Because that would take some real leadership, and…
Good money after bad? Time will tell.
http://news.softpedia.com/news/windows-no-longer-a-priority-for-microsoft-former-company-employee-says-520498.shtml
.
Seems, M$ wants to push every Win 10 users into paying Cloud subscriptions, eg subscriptions for Win 10 Ent E3 & E5, Office 365, M$ 365, OneDrive, Azure and for future Win 10 Home & Pro subscriptions.
So, instead of paying one-time for Win 10 licenses, you will likely be paying monthly or yearly subscriptions to use Win 10 Home, Pro or Ent.
AI and VR are and will be integrated into Win 10, like for IE.
https://netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?options=%7B%22filter%22%3A%7B%22%24and%22%3A%5B%7B%22deviceType%22%3A%7B%22%24in%22%3A%5B%22Desktop%2Flaptop%22%5D%7D%7D%5D%7D%2C%22dateLabel%22%3A%22Custom%22%2C%22attributes%22%3A%22share%22%2C%22group%22%3A%22platformVersion%22%2C%22sort%22%3A%7B%22share%22%3A-1%7D%2C%22id%22%3A%22platformsDesktopVersions%22%2C%22dateInterval%22%3A%22Monthly%22%2C%22dateStart%22%3A%222018-03%22%2C%22dateEnd%22%3A%222018-03%22%2C%22segments%22%3A%22-1000%22%7D
.
Seems, the Win 10 numbers has dropped for March 2018, with the caveat “March numbers will be temporarily delayed We are currently removing data generated from a botnet.”
Does this mean all the previous months’ Win 10 numbers were also corrupted by botnets.?
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