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  • Desktop Dead After Update To 1903

    Posted on Travasaurus Comment on the AskWoody Lounge

    Home Forums AskWoody support Windows Windows 10 Windows 10 version 1903 – May 2019 Update Desktop Dead After Update To 1903

    This topic contains 24 replies, has 13 voices, and was last updated by  Bertram Pincus 5 days, 16 hours ago.

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    • #1878209 Reply

      Travasaurus
      AskWoody Plus

      This is a first and the craziest problem I’ve ever run into (and I’ve been working with Windows since 3.0).  This has happened twice now, the 1st time on a high-end Dell Precision Tower 3620 desktop and later on a garden-variety Dell Inspiron 5567 notebook, both with different owners and a week apart, updating Windows 10 Pro from 1809 to 1903. The upgrade proceeded normally with no error messages or other problem indications but when both computers booted back up after the update, the screen went to what I’d call the “lock screen” (but no logon option was offered) with the usual Windows background (which was kind of dimmed out) and there were only 3 icons visible in the lower right-hand corner of the display. They were the “Network Access” (Internet), “Ease Of Access” and a “Power” (Shutdown / Restart) icons. The mouse cursor was active but the keyboard was dead as a doornail on both units; not even a “Ctrl-Alt-Del” response.  I tried a different USB keyboard on both units with no success.   I used the mouse (or trackpad on the notebook) to shut them down and that’s about all I could do, other than monkey with the Ease of Access settings, which I had no need of. Both computers could be booted into Safe Mode with Networking after 2 successive boot failures (as usual with the Windows recovery function) but Windows Update, System File Checker and DISM all would not run in Safe Mode.  I did manage to run checkdisk but it reported no errors and the computers went right back into the “Dead Desktop” mode when they booted back up afterward.  I may be 1 of the few guys who actually makes a “Windows 10 Recovery Disc” (flash drive) and I used it to run the “Startup Repair” option but it had no effect on either computer.  The fact that they both could boot into Safe Mode should say something but I could not identify anything (video drivers, etc) that was causing the problem.  I even tried pulling the NVIDIA video card out of the desktop and letting it try to use the generic integrated Intel video hardware on the mobo but that didn’t work either; the notebook uses the integrated Intel hardware by default.  Neither computer has ever had a problem with Windows update (or really any Windows-related problem in general) since they were purchased; this is a first.  When I called Dell ProSupport they’d never heard of the problem and told me just to reformat and be done with it but that’s not really an option with either unit, unless I want to devote a lot more time than I’m getting paid for, trying to back everything up and load the myriad apps that these customers have back on their respective computers.  And what’s to say it won’t happen again?  The fact that the identical same problem occurred on 2 vastly different machines should tell me something but as I said, this is a first for me with such a bizarre problem.  Any ideas?

      Dead Win 10 Desktop

      Attachments:
    • #1878320 Reply

      woody
      Da Boss

      I’ve never seen this before.

      How did you do the upgrade?

      • #1878400 Reply

        Travasaurus
        AskWoody Plus

        The Dell desktop got in in-place upgrade downloaded from the Windows Update site during the “natural course of events”.

        The Dell notebook got upgraded via the upgrade files being copied from a flash drive to a folder on the hard drive, per Microsoft’s suggestion.

        As I mentioned, these were 2 totally different computers, owned by different people and were both upgraded at different times.  The only commonality was that they had Intel processors (i7 & i5), plenty of memory, had never had a day’s worth of trouble before and were going from Windows 10 Pro 1809 to 1903.  It’s like Windows put up some kind of impenetrable shield after the upgrade that will only basically allow you to turn off the computer.  The placement of the icons on the desktop is anything but “random”.  This has some kind of sinister purpose to it (since both screens are identical) but darned if I can figure out what it is.  Any SWAG would be most welcome…

    • #1878335 Reply

      PKCano
      Da Boss

      I think the blur on the login screen you see is because MS has turned on the “stupid” acrylic thing in 1903 on the login screen (after the lock screen moves out of the way) that lowers the resolution on everything, and makes it blurey, except the actual login box. It’s supposed to put the focus on the login instead of the background (or something like that, which was probably an upvote by the Insiders).

      I wonder if this has to do with the graphics –  do the two computers have high resolution?

      • #1878401 Reply

        Travasaurus
        AskWoody Plus

        The Dell desktop has a high-end NVIDIA Quadro card in it as well as the low-end Intel video circuitry integrated into the mobo, but it only uses the high-end video card installed in the PCIe slot.

        On the other hand, the Dell notebook uses the relatively low-res Intel circuitry which comes integrated into the mobo on that computer, so there’s no real commonality between the 2 (save that the both have the identical problem after upgrading)  This is a true conundrum!

    • #1878391 Reply

      Alex5723
      AskWoody Plus

      Any ideas?

      Try disabling Fast Startup in Safe Mode :

      [Solved] No Login Screen in Windows 10

    • #1878762 Reply

      bbearren
      AskWoody MVP

      In the Windows Recovery Environment, run bcdedit to find out the drive letter assigned to the system drive, then use that drive letter (where I have A) in the following command:

      dism /image:A:\ /cleanup-image /restorehealth

      Create a fresh drive image before making system changes, in case you need to start over!
      "The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Savvy?"—Captain Jack Sparrow
      "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns

      "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #1879291 Reply

        Travasaurus
        AskWoody Plus

        Thanks for your suggestion but, while I could get DISM to run, it did not fix the problem.  Neither did the System File Checker.  I’d rather take a beating but I’m going to admit defeat and do what Dell advised the 1st time around; reformat and re-load Windows.  However, it’s just a matter of time before this occurs again; as we all know, where Windows is concerned nothing happens in a vacuum and if 1 guy has a problem there will be dozens, if not hundreds more going down that same road.  The killer here is that this appears, for all the World, to be some deliberate configuration of Windows and not just some random happening that “accidentally” occurred on 2 different computers at different times, during an upgrade to 1903, one a high-end Dell workstation and the other a relatively low-end Dell Inspiron notebook.  The placement of the icons in the lower right-hand corner of the screen was very deliberate.  Surely somebody, somewhere will experience this same thing and come up with the answer to this insane happening…

    • #1879548 Reply

      bbearren
      AskWoody MVP

      Those three icons always show up if I do a cold boot, in that same configuration, on the primary login screen.  Your graphic is 640X480.  Mine shows up in 1920X1080.

      Meaning no disrespect, or I-told-you-so, this is where I would restore my version 1809 drive image and keep on truckin’.

      When you know something is going to happen again, why not be prepared for it?

      Create a fresh drive image before making system changes, in case you need to start over!
      "The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Savvy?"—Captain Jack Sparrow
      "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns

      "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware

    • #1879840 Reply

      bbearren
      AskWoody MVP

      You still have options.  You can use DISM to extract install.wim from install.esd on your flash drive.  You can do this from another PC, and save install.wim to another flash drive; assign drive letter B to the flash drive.

      dism /get-wiminfo /wimfile:install.esd

      You’ll get a list of the Windows 10 versions on the installation flash drive.  I’ll use index:6.

      dism /export-image /sourceimagefile:install.esd /sourceindex:6 /destinationimagefile:B:\install.wim /compress:max /checkintegrity

      Plug the install.wim flash drive into the problem machine, then from Windows Recovery Environment run diskpart to get the drive letters used for the system drive and the flash drive.  If the flash drive doesn’t list a letter, assign one to it.  Then use

      dism /image:A:\ /cleanup-image /restorehealth /Source:B:\install.wim:1 /limitaccess

      where “A” is the system drive and “B” is the flash drive.

      Create a fresh drive image before making system changes, in case you need to start over!
      "The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Savvy?"—Captain Jack Sparrow
      "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns

      "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware

      • This reply was modified 4 weeks ago by  bbearren.
      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #1901490 Reply

      firewolfrl
      AskWoody Plus

      Try this in safemode if it will do it:

      Set the value “Shell” to “explorer.exe”: HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Winlogon

       

      That may do the trick

       

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #1902945 Reply

      Travasaurus
      AskWoody Plus

      Thanks to all who made various suggestions but my time window ran out and I had to re-format and start from scratch.  With any luck it will never happen again but I’ll always wonder what might’ve caused such a bizarre thing on 2 totally different computers in such a very close time period.  Oh well…

      • #1902975 Reply

        rpetruzz
        AskWoody Plus

        Hi,

        I realize you’ve already bitten the bullet and done the reinstall, but I thought I’d share with you my similar problem.  I have a Maingear Shift desktop that is loaded with power.  After my upgrade to 1809 I started having a similar problem on restarts.  If I am in Windows and I elect to “restart” the system, or post install of a new program it asks for a “restart” and I click yes, in every case my system comes up with the lock screen and no matter what I do, the keyboard is “DEAD”.  Like you described, the system seems to be running fine otherwise.  My only recourse when this happens is to hit the reset button on the front of the machine.  When I do this, the machine reboots and I can then use the keyboard and login.

        I just love Windows….

        WindowsAbout

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        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #1903163 Reply

          Travasaurus
          AskWoody Plus

          That’s virtually identical to what happened to me; seldom in the wide world of Windows does a problem occur in a vacuum.  Unfortunately I haven’t seen a “Reset” button on a computer in many years now (and certainly not a notebook).  I exclusively use Dell products and there’s no telling when they last included a reset button one of them.  All you can do is hold the power button down until it shuts off, but that’s not quite the same as a “reset”.  However, it is good to know and may well help some other poor soul who has experienced this (and has a reset button on his unit).  I would like to know the cause of it more than anything though, especially since I witnessed it happen twice in a row on both a desktop and a notebook…

          • #1903417 Reply

            mn–
            AskWoody Lounger

            Heh, the “reset” button on some notebooks is in a tiny pinhole under a lid somewhere… knowing that, didn’t have to pull the battery after power management got hung (and so didn’t react to the power button).

            Power management was fixed in a firmware update a couple of weeks later, but for those weeks we used that a fair amount. (It was a batch of brand new models…)

            • #1907274 Reply

              EP
              AskWoody_MVP

              hmm, which brand/model of notebook pcs have that kind of feature, mn–?

              I know for sure old laptops don’t have that kind of reset feature

            • #1907720 Reply

              mn–
              AskWoody Lounger

              Actually several models from more than one manufacturer have that. Might be typical of models where the battery isn’t user-replaceable.

              The model where the power management problem happened was a Lenovo touchscreen “laptop/tablet hybrid”, you know those where the thing opens all the way around so the keyboard is hidden under the display. (Second batch came with the fixed firmware already, too.)

    • #1903213 Reply

      anonymous

      Too late to be of any use but if somebody else can check. Normal or Safe Mode, were you able to note if the keyboard driver failed to initialize the controller?

      When using the Windows 10 recovery disc, did Windows fail to notice any external keyboards? Did the internal keyboard function or fail when trying to use it?

      The barrier is weird, have no clue…

      What did you mean exactly the placement of icons being sinister?

      As depicted this has been the arrangement for those icons since Windows 10 1607 (probably earlier); The network connection icon had to be put somewhere, elsewhere it would be bizarre on the login screen.

      The Ease of Access looks out of place but maybe exists there now so as not to easily missed for people looking for that icon, because users are shown on the left. On Windows 7 login screen Ease of Access is in a natural place on the lower left hand side, but back then Microsoft Windows did not have a more phone like interface.

      The Power icon is located at a convenient usable place.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #1903255 Reply

        Travasaurus
        AskWoody Plus

        I was just being a little overly-dramatic when I mentioned the icon placement being “sinister”, mostly out of frustration that I couldn’t get to the account log-on screen.  Looking back, there was probably a clue somewhere there, that the computer wouldn’t recognize (and display) the Master Account, even though it was the only one on there (both computers were 1-user machines and the Admin account had never been activated on either of them).  Seems like there should’ve been some other option to get to the regular user account other than those 3 useless icons in the lower right-hand corner of the screen.  As for the keyboard, it was active both in Safe Mode and when I booted-up on the Emergency Recovery Drive but not on the dead-as-a-door-nail “lock screen”.  The “Startup Repair Mode” ran but had no effect on either computer.  It’s as if some rogue Windows internal security mechanism took over, thinking there was some kind of attempted intrusion into the computer, even though no password of any kind had ever been set on either machine.  Another reason I was questioning the icons was at that point who really cares to know if you’re “on the network” or not or if you need “Ease of Access” or not?  You are simply stuck on the Lock Screen with nowhere else to go.  I suppose having an active Power Button icon to facilitate a “graceful shutdown” might be of some ancillary use but at that point in time, who really cares?  If you can’t log-on to your computer it’s all totally useless anyway!  And why is the keyboard disabled as well?  That certainly makes no sense at all.  This all seems like some sort of bizarre Windows “security scheme” gone wrong and surely sometime, somewhere, somebody will experience this and report it to Microsoft Tech Support so they can successfully determine why this is happening.  As mentioned in my original post, I’ve been working with Windows for decades now and I’ve never experienced a crazy problem like this even once, let-alone twice within the same week.  Any additional “diagnostic opinions” would certainly be welcome, if only to help somebody else this might happen to…

    • #1903263 Reply

      PaulK
      AskWoody Lounger

      Likely a dumb question.
      Did you ever try to ‘wait it out’? That is, give it a half hour or so; maybe some quirky task timing/race that ‘eventually’ might complete?

      • #1903281 Reply

        Travasaurus
        AskWoody Plus

        Left it overnight in both cases, something over 8 hours…

    • #1903377 Reply

      doriel
      AskWoody Lounger

      Travasaurus, try this solution, if it is possible to do something in “safe mode”. Simply disable Safe Boot in System Configuraion

      I apologize if you already tried, but there is too much reading in this article at the moment.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McGoHJMaGNo

      I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.
      --- Thomas A. Edison

      • #1903379 Reply

        doriel
        AskWoody Lounger

        Uncheck this box – Your keyboard should start to act afterwards.

        I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.
        --- Thomas A. Edison

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    • #1907736 Reply

      Bertram Pincus
      AskWoody Lounger

      I’m trying to think of constants w/in those two vastly diff. machines.  Did you try pulling/resetting the CMOS batteries?  Assuming both were plugged in when your troubles began, did you check your electrical outlets with a PowerMeter?  Internal power supply?  Weird one.  Hoping doriel’s post above might be the answer for you (sorry about all that extra work).  Did you try any bootable USB drives, linux based, or good old Hiren’s?  😛

    Please follow the -Lounge Rules- no personal attacks, no swearing, and politics/religion are relegated to the Rants forum.

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