Good animated movies and shows for ages ten to one hundred and ten.

[OscarCP]

Months ago, being very fond of animated movies, I started a thread called:
“Shaun the Sheep, etc: animated shows in Netflix to watch while self-isolating.”
The comments in that thread can be found here:

Shaun the Sheep, etc: animated shows in Netflix to watch while self-isolating.

But, being that thread about streaming from Netflix, while that was probably sufficient at the time, it is no longer so, as several big companies besides Netflix are also streaming animated movies and shows these days: HBO, Amazon, Disney Pus, to mention the main ones at this time that are also familiar to me. And some of their animated content is not just for kids, but includes great works of cinematography as well, of a kind that can be enjoyed, as the name of this thread indicates, for about anyone able to appreciate good movies and shows, from ten years and up, both young and old.

HBO:

All of Ghiblis Studio’s movies directed by Hoyao Miyazaky, Isao Takahata, and the other greats of animation working for decades at this Japanese studio that has produced, (along with Disney and Pixar), some of the greatest animated movies of all time.

Amazon Prime:

“Ronja, The Robber’s Daughter”, a 2014 coproduction of Ghibli and other studios, directed by Goro Miyazaki, son of Hoyao, and now available for free with an Amazon Prime subscription.

As many of Ghibli’s movies, this series of 26 episodes of some 24 minutes each, is based on an European’s writer novel, in this case the late Swedish children’s book writer Astrid Lindgren, the creator of the Pippin Longstokings stories, among many others:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronja%2C_the_Robber's_Daughter_(TV_series)

“Ronja, the only child of a bandit chief, grows up among a clan of robbers living in a castle in the woodlands of early-Medieval Scandinavia. When Ronja grows old enough she ventures into the forest, exploring and discovering its wonders and dangers like the mystical creatures that dwell there. She learns to live in the forest through her own strength, with the occasional rescue by her parents. Ronja’s life begins to change, however, when she happens upon a boy her own age named Birk, who turns out to be the son of the rival clan chief.”

Ronja’s family (her father, the bragging and violently emotional robbers’ chief and her mother, a remarkable woman) and the members of the father’s gang, live in a large, heavily fortified castle that has been home for the chief’s family for generations of robber chiefs and their men. One night, the night when Ronja is born, there is a terrible electric storm and a lightning strike splits the castle in two, creating a wide and very deep gap later known as “Hell’s Gap” in between the now separate parts. The smaller one, and not the one with the main entrance, but accessible only by climbing a very steep cliff, comes to be occupied by the members of a rival gang, that have escaped from their own place, somewhere down in the forest, to avoid capture by the now very numerous patrols by soldiers prowling the woods, sent there by the local Sheriff that is intent in stopping the numerous combined robberies by the two rival bands. They find it very difficult to bring provisions by climbing the cliff, and when winter comes and that becomes impossible, they start to run short of food.

The presence of these unfriendly and hungry interlopers is discovered by Ronja, who also discovers a boy of her same age called Birk, the son of the rival band’s chief. They eventually become self-declared “brother” and “sister” after both make at first an uneasy alliance that grows deeper, as helping each other through various difficulties they become closer, and saving each other’s lives more than once helps too. Finally, circumstances make it difficult for both to continue living with their families and they run away, to live in a cave on a hill above the forest. As spring comes and then summer, they are happy this way, but with autumn and the approach of winter, for all they would like to ignore this fact, things come relentlessly nearer to a probably painful death from cold and starvation for both. There is a happy ending, but one has to keep watching to earn it.

This a slow-to-develop story and the series has been given demerits by some movie critics for this reason, but this is, I believe, because those critics simple have missed the real point of it.

What is this series point then?
This show is, as I see it, a profound mediation on childhood, where time is not measured in minutes or hours or days, but in events that reveal, now and then, here and there, the wider world and the inner self to the budding person. And, beyond the mystery that is to be a child, are the bigger mysteries of ordinary human life and in it, of love and of death. All of which come to play their roles, in their own good time, in the story that is much more meaningful and deeper than it seems. There is adventure both in the doings of the highwaymen’s band, who all live in a castle keep high in the hills overlooking a forest populated by wild life as wonderfully depicted as is varied, wild horses in particular, as well as mythical beings, either indifferent or inimical to humans. Among the latter, the wild harpies, part bird of pray and part women with beautiful, scary faces and cries as sharp and cruel as their talons.
The animation is flawless, the images of the forest are classical Ghibli, and that means they are beautifully imagined and rendered: a feast for the eyes. And the main characters are fully realized, credible as people, and the scenes of their daily lives in those now so very distant years, recognizable still because these are things people have always done, are presented in a completely natural way: they ring true in their smallest detail.

Here is a trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IuQs_Fl-dE&

And here an extended clip that is a good sample of how the forest and its natural and supernatural beings are depicted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWRcul0hHX0&ab_channel=Wizz

I hope you can watch the 26 episodes of this series and like them.

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doriel

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[Sky]

MODS: I came back to add another suggestion and realised I wasn’t logged in. Please feel free to delete the above anonymous post.

I hope that you don’t mind me making a few suggestions?

Creature Comforts

This is another Aardman show and is free on Youtube, at least in the UK. It features interviews with members of the British public set to the animation of various animals. I genius idea, and good for all ages.

Avatar: The Last Airbender

A 61 episode animation available in the US and UK both on Netflix and Amazon. A really thrilling adventure show from the 00s featuring a cast of brilliant characters in an alternate unverse where people can bend the elements to their will.

Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood

A 64 episode animation available in the US and UK on Netflix. Similar to Avatar, but darker. Some really great characters though. I wouldn’t show it to a 10 year old, however, as there are some dark parts. I recommend the subtitled version, but the dub is acceptable. Just make sure that you watch ‘Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood’ and not ‘Fullmetal Alchemist’, which was a short-lived, incomplete and inferior attempt to animate the manga it’s based on 6 years prior.

Anohana: The Flower We Saw That Day

If you don’t mind subtitles, this is an 11 episode anime available in the US and UK on Netflix. A sad but beautiful exploration of loss among a group of childhood friends. That sounds very morbid, and it’s certainly a work specifically for adults, but it really is quite brilliant. I am not embarassed to say that it made me cry! If you enjoy this, feel free to post asking for more anime suggestions.

Other great western movies inclide:

• Up (Pixar)
• WALL-E (Pixar)
• Coco (Pixar)
• Paddington & Paddington 2
• The Lego Movie

Other great Japanese movies include:

• Your Name
• A Silent Voice
• And of course, almost anything made by Studio Ghibli, which you mentioned in your last post but it can’t be said enough!

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OscarCP

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[OscarCP]

Sky: Now that you mentioned “Avatar: The Last Airbender”, there is another series, in Netflix, written also by Aaron Ehasz (*), called “The Dragon Prince.” It is very worth watching. And the time since  “Airbender” was made has not passed in vain, because the quality of the pictures, in my opinion, is even better. The story, of course, is outstanding. People have commented negatively about the Scottish accent of a central character named Ryla, a Moon elf and an assassin by training, just not very effective at it in her first mission to kill a whole bunch of people, as part of a group of assassin elves like her. Fortunately, because otherwise this would have been a very short series. But, assassin or not, she is a charming and interesting character; the voice artist who does her part is an American, not a Scott, but her parents come from the land of haggis. I just mention this, so people are prepared for it.

There is also in this series a very interesting villain with a complex personality, which makes things more interesting for us grown ups, I wold expect. He is someone that started doing his best to help his friend, a King, and in this way once helped save the whole kingdom from famine, using his knowledge of black magic. But when he believes that a war between humans and elves is coming and coming fast, he tries hard to impose his will on everyone that opposes his attempts to prepare for this war. And that way, driven by his good intentions, he setups up a moral trap without escape for himself and then falls in it with both feet first. Not bad, for a story with elves and magicians in it!

There are a total of six seasons planned, three already are out, so these can be streamed any time by those with a Netflix subscription. The seasons are named each after one  six mythical elements, so far: Moon, Sky and Sun. The forth season is already very delayed, mainly because of the limitations imposed on just about everything by the impossibility of doing many things that normally are easy to get them over with quickly, just with several people getting together. But, sadly enough, not so much these days.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dragon_Prince

And since you mentioned “Your Name”, by Makoto Shinkai, I wonder if you have seen “Children that Chase Lost Voices from Deep Below” and “The Garden of Words”, also by him. These are worth watching too.

(*) And of “Futurama” eternal and glorious fame.

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[OscarCP]

“Millennium Actress”, one of the great anime movies, directed by the late Satoshi Kon, is discussed while showing scenes of this work in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIyGiJE5fbs

One can also stream “Paprika” from Amazon. This is a trailer of this marvelously surreal, beautifully drawn movie  :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBrUhQ0_qYA

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[Alex5723]

The Flower We Saw That Day

Sky wrote:

If you don’t mind subtitles, this is an 11 episode anime available in the US and UK on Netflix.

There is a 2015 movie too : https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4990696/

One of my favorites is : Big Hero 6 (2014). made into a series in 2017
now on season 3.

• This reply was modified 1 month ago by Alex5723.

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OscarCP

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[Sky]

OscarCP wrote:

The Dragon Prince

My other half has been trying to get me to watch this, so I definitely am going to, but I’m probably going to wait until the show concludes. I even held out for the conclusion of Game of Thrones before binging it, so I have patience!

OscarCP wrote:

“Children that Chase Lost Voices from Deep Below” and “The Garden of Words”

I’ve not seen the former, but I’ve seen The Garden of Words and enjoyed it. It’s very reflective and slow paced and I like that style. “The Great Passage” on Amazon is quite a similar vibe, if you’ve ever seen that?

OscarCP wrote:

And of “Futurama” eternal and glorious fame.

Here here!

OscarCP wrote:

Satoshi Kon

I’m ashamed to say that I’ve never seen any of his works. They’ve just never been available in the UK as far as I’m aware, and the DVDs are even hard to come by, at least they were a few years ago anyway.

Alex5723 wrote:

The Flower We Saw That Day

There is a 2015 movie too

There is, although it’s more of a recap as I recall. My message to anyone planning to watch it is definitely to watch the series first, and not to worry if you don’t have access to the film, as it isn’t required.

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OscarCP

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[OscarCP]

Sky,

There is no need to wait another three years to watch “The Dragon Prince” in its entirety: the end of the last season now available (the 3rd one) brings to a satisfactory ending all that went on before without leaving any loose ends, so its season finale could have been very well the end of this show. Except for a brief final scene where the possibility of a continuation to the story is hinted at. Trust me:your other half shall be well-pleased if you do.

And thanks for suggesting “The Great Passage.”

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Sky

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[OscarCP]

Newly remastered copies of the movies of Kon are now available on Blue Ray and DVD:

https://www.awn.com/news/satoshi-kons-millennium-actress-now-available-blu-ray-and-digital

Although where to find them:

https://www.amazon.com/Tokyo-Godfathers-Blu-ray-Toru-Emori/dp/B086G2ZCN4

(Besides “Godfathers”, Kon’s other movies are also there, in “people who bought this often also bought these”, right below it.)

Also one can stream Paprika from the Amazon Prime collection, buying it for a small price that I think is worth paying to see this most original, wildly imaginative and beautiful movie.

And here there is a sample of excellent animation movies for people of all ages to enjoy singly or together, if they can and so choose:

https://www.cbr.com/best-gkids-films-tokyo-godfathers-song-of-the-sea/

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[Sky]

That’s good to hear about “The Dragon Prince”. I will make a note to watch it when I get the chance, then.

You’re welcome about “The Great Passage”. It’s a very relaxing and sweet show. If you enjoy books and words at all, I suspect that you will like it.

As for the works of Satoshi Kon, I’m afraid that the new DVDs aren’t available in the UK yet, nor are his films available to buy on streaming services, but I will look out for them. There are DVDs available from 2018, though, which is new.

By the way, you mentioned Ghibli before; have you seen The Castle of Cagliostro? That’s an early Miyazaki film that is easy to overlook, but it’s quite similar to some of the early Miyazaki Ghibli films such as Laputa and Porco Rosso.

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[OscarCP]

Yes, I have seen “Cagliostro”, a movie made by then young Miyazaki working, at the time, for Hatanaka, before they together founded Studio Ghibli, so it is not included in the HOB-Netflix deal and it is still available from the latter, at least here in the USA. Besides this one, I have the DVDs of every single Ghibli movie.

Now that I am here, I am going to bring attention to the marvelous animation work at Studio Laika, in the USA, one of two major users of a very demanding animation technique where the sequence of images is not drawn but modeled in tree dimensions using tiny, flexible dolls of the characters made either of plastic (Laika) or plasticine (Aardman; I have already mentioned this UK studio’s work (the “Shawn the Sheep”and “Wallace and Gromit” etc. both shorts and full-feature length movies, in the preceding thread with a link at the very beginning of this one). In this particularly laborious but very impresionistic form of animation, the dolls are positioned in a certain attitude that is photographed and then changed slightly, photographed again, then changing again a little the posture and so on. When stringed together in a film and shown with a movie projector, they give the intended impression of movement.

One I particularly like is “Coraline”:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koInAsdH8WA

Another is their latest, “Missing Link”:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UalKq-DSXI

From a different studio, Disney,and using conventional computer-aided animation, I also want to mention another favorite of mine, “Zootopia”:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujncmH8YnNc

I could keep adding other movies worth seeing, for example the movies of Pixar. But that is for another day.

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Sky

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[Sky]

I’m glad that you’ve seen Cagliostro, it’s easy to miss as it’s not generally included in Studio Ghibli collections, unlike the other pre-Ghibli film Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind (an interesting fact about Nausicaä: Hideaki Anno of Neon Genesis Evangelion fame animated the giant warrior). I’ve been building a Studio Ghibli DVD collection myself over the years, but I have not completed it yet. I’ve seen all of them other than the last few, though. What’s your favourite Studio Ghibli film, out of interest?

On the subject of Aardman, I mentioned Creature Comforts earlier, which I adore, but there is also Chicken Run, which is also worth a watch.

Zootopia is another excellent film, I agree. It’s Disney’s best since the Disney Renaissance, in my opinion. That said, I don’t think that it quite reaches the heights of Pixar’s best works (see my first post for my favourites).

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OscarCP

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[OscarCP]

My favorite is “Princess Mononoke”, followed by “The Tale of Princess Kaguya”, “The Journey of Chihiro”, “Castle in the Sky”, and “Porco Rosso.” Then I am fond of two “minor Ghibli” movies: “Up from Poppy Hill” (directed by Goro Miyazaki) and “When Marney Was There.” And, what can I say? I’m an old sentimental fellow: “Murmur of the Heart” (because I also like Neil Diamond and young people with high ambitions). I am leaving some, not because they are inferior, but because I am answering Sky’s question.

And there is one I have the DVD, but is not available for streaming: Takahata’s masterpiece “The Grave of the Fireflies.” Probably the saddest great movie since “Bicycle Thieves.”

Here is a really nice composite of scenes from Porco Rosso with “Le Temps des Cerises” playing throughout:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNIoyx4F-Ug

And the final titles’ song with scenes of the movie for background:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpxXeNakyfY

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Sky

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[OscarCP]

And also this scene, from “Porco Rosso”:

 

That’s when a genius took a simple, much repeated stock movie scene, and made it into something magical and unforgettable.

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Sky

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[OscarCP]

Now, a word about one of the best illustrated animated children (*) TV shows of this century:

Samurai Jack:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASlVt_YJd10

Created by Genndy Tartakovsky,  4 seasons, 2001-2004:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samurai_Jack

These days, available into its entirety in HBO Plus, free to subscribers.

(*) Or anyone who likes stylish graphic design and 20 minutes of weird/silly/scary/funny 20 minutes episodes.

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[OscarCP]

And before I forget again: Ghibli’s “Kiki’s Delivery Service” is an inexpressibly enchanting, truly big-hearted movie good to watch when real life does not look like much.

And “My Friend Totoro” is, among other things, one of the best studies of young children, how they behave, act  and react to the ever puzzling world they are out to discover, that I have ever seen.

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Sky

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[Sky]

Don’t let anyone from West Virginia hear you mistaking the writer of Country Roads! Or did Neil Diamond do a cover?

My favourite Studio Ghibli film is the same as yours: Princess Mononoke. I like almost all of the others you mentioned too, though. I agree with you about Totoro: Miyazaki’s portrayal of children in that and all of his other films is just spot on. It helps that all of the Totoros and other creatures are enchanting, too, of course! But yes, on his portrayal of children, it’s really just an extension of his observation of everything, I think. I’m reminded of a simple scene in Spirited Away where Chihiro/Sen puts on her shoes (if you know the scene?) and it’s animated in such a realistic way that you just don’t get anywhere else. His power of observation and attention to detail really brings the films to life to an unparalleled extent, and his adding of ‘unnecessary’ detail brings magic to everything.

The one film I will have to disagree with you and every review I’ve ever read of it is Grave of the Fireflies. I just couldn’t get past the dislikable character of the young man. It really ruined it for me, I’m afraid. It is incredibly sad, though, and I have no desire to ever watch it again.

One film that I’d like to bring up that you didn’t mention, though, is Only Yesterday. It’s honestly vying for my favourite Studio Ghibli film with Princess Mononoke. I know that it has received criticism because nothing much actually happens in it, but not every film has to be action-packed. One of the wonderful things about Miyazaki’s work is the ‘Ma’ (the negative space, the pauses) that he uses, so why not give Takahata credit for it too? But anyway, the two halves of the film just overwhelm me with nostalgia for my childhood and the countryside respectively because of the realistic way that they are portrayed. We have both talked about Miyazaki’s portrayal of children, but Takahata’s is equally observant. The film makes me think of how I reflect on my past and that makes me grow, just as doing so does for Taeko, so really it portrayals both adults and children very observantly. It’s a bit of a cliche to say that a character ‘grew’ in a film, but Taeko really does, yet she does so simply by reflecting on her past, not by facing trials. I think that’s just wonderful. I also love the unique animation style, it brings so much character to everyone.

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[OscarCP]

Sky: My own appreciation of “Only Yesterday”is rather muted. I think that women would get more out of it, because it may require a different kind of basic experiences and sensibility from mine. I have never been haunted by memories of my school days. I am one with Joss Whedon in this, whose guiding idea in making “Buffy the Vampire Slayer” was that “High School is Hell”, so he put Buffy Summers in a school built right above one of the mouths of Hell.

Another of Takahata’s movies I like is “My Neighbors the Yamadas.” Interesting how the day to day lives of common Japanese people have a universal resonance: the part where they go shopping with the children and forget one in a department  store. Or when they argue about which fruit is the Queen of Fruits (everyone except one of the children agrees it is the banana.) Or when the father confronts a group of bulling bikers that had decided to occupy part of a street near his house and are making a big racket there. He is really scared, tries to be extra nice asking them to keep quiet, does not succeed, so what then?

As to memories of the countryside, well, I spent some long summer vacations in the station of an aunt of mine where, with my cousins and some of the young station hands, we would ride horses through prairie and bush, help drive cattle and sheep to various places and then go for swims, or to fish, in the creeks and rivers around there. I liked to play a sort of Incas flute called a quena (kenah), and one late evening I had for audience some ten cows forming a semicircle, facing me at a respectful distance. But I am basically a city person.

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[OscarCP]

There is a documentary (*) about Ghibli, how they did  things there and in particular about the working methods, habits and personalities of the three leaders: Hayao Miyazaki, Isao Takahata (the lead artists and founders of the studio) and Toshio Suzuki (the money man) called “Kingdom of Dreams and Madness.” It was made in 2013, towards the end of the days of Ghibli when all the three were still together, working simultaneously on “The Wind Rises” and “Princess Kaguya.” Takahata died a few years later and Miyazaki was soon to enter his longest retirement so far — now is back working on yet another movie, provisionally titled “How do You Live?”

In this documentary, I think it is, Suzuki tells a little story about Miyazaki where the point is his intense attention to detail: Once he saw him spend hours sitting on a bench in a street where many people went by the whole day long. What was he doing? He was watching women. What in particular about them? How their clothes moved when they walked.

“The Grave of the Fireflies” was based on a short story written by someone that had a somewhat similar experience, at the end of the war, as the boy Seito in the movie and also had a sister die of starvation. It is considered to be one of the greatest war movies ever made. I would put it along “The Grand Illusion”, “Rome Open City”, “Das Boot”, “Downfall” and “All Quiet in the Western Front.” The ending, when Seito imagines his dead little sister playing along the banks of a pond, is one of the most emotionally wrenching scenes I have ever watched.

That was the first of Takahata’s full-feature movies. His last, when he was already eighty years old, was “The Tale of Princess Kaguya”, a highly poetic and at times very dramatic retelling of an old Japanese  fairy tale. It is also one of my favorite movies.

Miyazaki and Takahata are among the  great Japanese film makers, alongside the likes of Kurosawa and Ozu.

Also, my sincerest apologies to John Denver.

(*) Available for streaming in HBO.

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[OscarCP]

One more thing about the animation film “The Grave of the Fireflies” and why it is in “the greatest war movies” category:

Those are not the movies that do glorify war, or show courageous deeds being performed by heroic soldiers and, often, also by civilians, with plenty of action, interesting lethal weaponry and plenty of Bang! Crash! Boom!

Great war movies are those so mercilessly realistic that put people off the very idea of war. And Takahata’s masterpiece, therefore, fully qualifies to be one of those.

I would not recommend it for being watched by anyone younger than 12. Which is about the right age to start learning not to believe nor follow those that are always pushing for another one — quite often for one where they are not likely to find themselves in harm’s way if they succeed and get their wish.

As a point of perhaps some interest: I am not a pacifist, because I believe that defending one’s nation by force of arms against a blatant attack is not inherently dishonorable. But one always must be very careful about what being under such an ‘attack’ means in any given case. And an important question to ask oneself is: “if this comes to pass, am I likely to be fighting in it?” If the answer is ‘not likely’, I, at least, would not be pushing hard for it to get started.

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[Sky]

On Only Yesterday:
Well, I am a man too and it really hit home for me, so I can confirm from my sample size of one, at least, that you don’t have to be a woman to enjoy it! It is quite a feminine film, though, I suppose: no action or changes coming about through effort here, just reflection on the past and growing as a person from that. That all said, I do think that you do have to have an appreciation of the countryside to enjoy it. I am very much a country person and it’s where I grew up, so the idea of escaping the city and going to the countryside appeals to me.

On The Kingdom of Dreams and Madness:
Yes, I have seen that documentary, it was a very interesting watch. I think that Miyazaki would get arrested if he did that observation today though! There’s another documentary, included with the latest Only Yesterday release, charting the creation of that film, and it’s well worth a watch as well if you haven’t seen it. It shows, among many other things, how they took the unusual step of recording the lines first and then copied the actual faces of the voice actors as they spoke to draw the characters, which is how they achieved that unique art style.

On Grave of the Fireflies:
I agree with your last post completely with how it’s very much a ‘great war movie’, despite focusing on civilians, because of the relentless realism. I can certainly appreciate it, and it did get to me as it intended to, which is why I have no desire to ever watch it again. That said, I felt strongly and still do that it would have been much better if the consequences that happen to the main characters came about solely because of their helplessness rather than partially because of the stubbornness and immaturity of the the young man. That’s what disappointed me about the film.

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OscarCP

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[Alex5723]

Amazon’s new Invincible (adult) is really good.

IMDB :

“Mark Grayson is a normal teenager, except for the fact that his father, Nolan, is the most powerful superhero on the planet. Shortly after his seventeenth birthday, Mark begins to develop powers of his own and enters into his father’s tutelage”

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OscarCP

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[OscarCP]

Sky wrote about Isao Takahata’s  Ghibli animation movie “The Grave of the Fireflies”:

” … I felt strongly and still do that it would have been much better if the consequences that happen to the main characters came about solely because of their helplessness rather than partially because of the stubbornness and immaturity of the the young man. That’s what disappointed me about the film.”

Well, let me be the devil’s advocate here for a moment and argue his case thus:

“Downfall” is generally considered to be also a great war movie. It is about what (more or less) happened at the Berlin Führerbunker when the end of the Third Reich was rolling in from the East, brought along by General Zhukov and his troops, including many traveling inside nice and even shiny, if noisy, Russian tanks, along with the usual frequent aerial bombardments, regular long-range cannon shellings and the not all that impossible irruption of General Montgomery and his troops from the West at any time. Now, it would be a stretch to say that the people piled up inside the bunker the movie is about, including the Führer himself, his dogs, the Goebbels and their many children, his girlfriend — except for the naïve young woman that was his brand-new personal secretary and the one who, in real life, was the actual witness of much of what was shown in the movie — that practically all of those there (but not the people at the very top already mentioned) who were trying very hard to have a good time regardless of the bad weather outside, so to speak, were exactly very nice, smart and mature or at least endearing people. And things did not go well for them. By the end of the movie, in fact, things were going horrendously bad for almost the whole lot of them, except those that, later on, ended up hanging by the neck after the Nuremberg trials, or escaped such fate in different ways (the young secretary managed to get away when the bunker was finally abandoned, walked through a crowd of Soviet soldiers without being stopped, and went on to live to a ripe old age).

But it is a great war movie, nevertheless, and I was left quite satisfied after watching it once, which was quite enough for me.

Another thing about this movie, is that people have been having fun for years and years subtitling in English (those samples I have seen, at least) the impassionate speeches Hitler was making to the very few people who had to hang around to listen to him anymore. Those subtitles are not really very faithful translations. But they are popular all the same. As is Quentin Tarantino’s movie about the decapitation of the 3rd Reich by Movie Theatre Performance. Or more precisely, Quentin’s alternate-history version of the end of all that.

Now, what could be even more fun that watching those scenes so subtitled? Well, I think that would be watching  LAIKA Studio’s “Missing Link” (that I have already recommended here) or else any of the Wallace and Gromit movies, be it one of the shorter, or one of the longer ones.

More recommendations of movies like these (not war ones, please) are enthusiastically welcome.

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Alex5723

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[OscarCP]

I wrote: “In this documentary, I think it is, Suzuki tells a little story about Miyazaki where the point is his intense attention to detail: Once he saw him spend hours sitting on a bench in a street where many people went by the whole day long. What was he doing? He was watching women. What in particular about them? How their clothes moved when they walked.”

Sky commented among other things about that: “I think that Miyazaki would get arrested if he did that observation today though!”

Well, Suzuki did not say that the was doing more than sitting on a bench and watching or that Miyazki mentioned that he was doing anything different. So there is no evidence that he was also touching, cracking wise, wolf-whistling, cat-calling, or doing anything else that could be actionable by the police. Looking, not touching, and doing it quietly and not in any obvious way, that is fine. If it were not, the human race would be doomed.

By the way, has anyone here watched any of these animation movies by Wes Anderson (of  “The Grand Budapest Hotel” and “The Royal Tenenbaums” fame, among many other live-action classics) “Fantastic Mr. Fox”, “Isle of Dogs?” In my opinion, every second of these two is worth watching. And fun too.

Here is a video showing how “Isle of Dogs” was made (as is stop-action animation made, regardless of the specific technique used)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzibT_SjeoM

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Sky

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[OscarCP]

And this other video of how the “sushi” sequence of “Isle of Dogs”, a single scene that took six months to get done, was made:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSKK–p2Nrs

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[Sky]

On Grave of the Fireflies:
I get what you’re saying about Downfall, but I don’t think that you can compare it, because while the characters in both films are in the midst of a war, we’re not meant to feel sympathy for the characters in Downfall, whereas we are meant to feel sympathy for the characters in Grave of the Fireflies. I feel like the point of Grave of the Fireflies is to show the consequences of war on a civilian population, the suffering they have to endure as a result, yes? Given that, making the suffering of the main two characters in it come about partly because of the actions of one of them and not solely because of the war I feel distracts from that message of the brutality of war on a civilian population. It’s still a very moving and harrowing film, though, and I don’t dispute its place among the great war films.

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[OscarCP]

Sky, I get you point, but what I am arguing here is this: Seito was deluded in believing that the war was going to end well for Japan, that what was going on was a temporary reversal of fortune (besides, news of what was happening were strictly censored by the military dictatorship) and his father, a high-raking Navy officer, was going to be back any time soon. So himself and his sister were going to be all reunited once more with their father, safe and sound. Had he known otherwise, he might not had taken off, enduring instead as much as they had to in the hands of their abusive and selfish relatives. Besides, he was a proud person, proud of being the son of an important officer in the Imperial Navy and, therefore, not someone to be long on his knees, taking whatever abuse was dished out to him.

And if Seito, foolishly but, in my opinion, also understandingly, had not left their relatives taking with him his little sister that believed he could do no wrong, Takahata could not have shown the larger situation and the movie had been more limited in scope, showing mostly Seito as a sort of particularly unfortunate Cinderella and the war only through its consequences to the sheltered protagonists. Besides, he is told later, in no uncertain words, not to be such a fool and go back and live with his obnoxious family, if he wanted himself and his sister not to die. But he was convinced the bad situation they were in was going to end shortly and well, so the two of them could survive by fishing and scrounging, while being free to do as they pleased, away from their nasty relatives.

Finally, the movie is based on a short semi-autobiographical story written by someone who had acted more or less like Seito but literally lived to tell the tale, and wrote the story as a sort of pained ‘mea culpa.’

The special importance of this movie in film history, is that it showed, pretty much for the first time in a such a blindingly clear way, that animation movies can be much more than something for weekend TV, something nice for the kiddies to watch and that keeps them in one place, so they don’t get underfoot. That was the one thing that has impressed me most about it.

Want to hear about one more great war movie? “Zulu.”

It is based on something that actually happened during the Zulu Wars. A small detachment of British soldiers defending a mission station, a critical location from a military point of view, and its inhabitants, as well as themselves, at a place called Rorke’s Drift, after two days of indecisive fighting win a final pitched battle, causing extraordinary carnage by disciplined firing by ranks with their Martini-Enfield rifles against living wave after living wave of Zulu warriors charging against them, protected only with leather shields, and the confrontation is over. So everyone on the British side seems happy, relieved, as well as clearly exhausted, But the junior officer of the unit and his commanding officer are not taking part in the subdued celebrations. The CO asks the junior officer (played by a very young Michael Caine) how is he feeling. And the Caine character answers, after a pause: “Shame. I feel ashamed. Is this always this way?” And the CO tells him that this is so. And that is why Zulu is not just a very good movie (which it is) but also a great war movie. And, I think, consequently, also a controversial one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zulu_(1964_film)

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Sky

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[Sky]

You make a very good point about his delusion. I hadn’t considered that. Perhaps it could have been made a bit clearer, or perhaps I’m at fault for not noticing it. Either way, it’s a good point.

I wouldn’t describe myself as a big fan of war movies, but I watched a lot of them when I was growing up, as they showed them on TV regularly. A lot of American ones, but mainly all of the 50s and 60s British-made movies made back when my country still had a film industry of note. This includes Zulu, so I have seen it, but also includes great movies such as Bridge on the River Kwai, Lawrence of Arabia, Where Eagles Dare, The Heroes of Telemark, The Dam Busters, etc. We produced a lot of war films back then! I suppose it was a time when my country was even more obsessed with WW2 and empire than it is now! But yes, Zulu is definitely the best of the bunch, since it’s not just a glorification of war, although that does make it a harder watch.

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[OscarCP]

Well, now that Sky and I are in agreement over war movies, it is time for something else.

So here is a big shout out for Brad Bird, the author of some of the funniest and most interesting animated movies since the turn of the century: “The Iron Giant”, “Ratatouille”, “The Incredibles.” (*)”Incredibles II” (streaming from Netflix) and, on the live-action side: “Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol” (with Tom Cruise hanging on and jumping around near the top of the highest building in the World, while OUTSIDE of it) and the underappreciated but, in my opinion, absolutely wonderful “Tomorrowland” (streaming from Amazon):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brad_Bird

(*) And the voice of Edna Mode.

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[OscarCP]

Among other commentary here:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/B08DK1W2WV/ref=atv_wl_hom_c_unkc_1_1

“I wish I could give this show 100 stars. My kids started watching it as it was advertised as being a children’s program. At first I didn’t pay much attention, but Ronja’s story sucked me in and I ended up watching the entire show with my kids, absolutely riveted. The subject matter is not children’s subject matter. This show deals with death, near-misses with death, and suicidal ideation (the episode “Life Isn’t To Be Thrown Away”). Yet it’s done in such a subtle manner that my kids did not pick up on it or were not disturbed. I feel that my kids probably don’t comprehend the show and so I don’t really know why they like it, but I’m so glad they found it. One of my favorite shows of all time. I should mention that I don’t like sad shows, so even though this one deals with adult subject matter as I described, each episode closes in an uplifting manner, not a dark one. Listen for the lullaby the mother sings to Ronja about a wild wolf prowling about; it is chilling!”

That was written by someone who reviewed for Amazon “Ronja, the Robber’s Daughter” after streaming it from there. Based on the children’s book of the same name by Astrid Lindgren, this is a 2014 Ghibli animated series directed by Goro Miyazaki, the son of the famous anime creator that, along with Takahata and Suzuki, was one of the three founders of the Studio. The story is supposed to happen in the early Middle Ages in Scandinavia, in a forest inhabited by magical creatures, not all of them well-disposed towards humans. I am copying that review here, because it expresses my own feelings about this show almost perfectly.

Essentially, it is a Romeo and Juliet story that ends well; certainly better than the original. Besides what has been mentioned by that reviewer, it is also a story about love and hate, friendship and enmity, understandings and misunderstandings — and their consequences — about growing up and discovering a larger world outside and inside oneself, and, yes, also about life and death.

Particularly “not really for kids, but OK for them to watch” are the passages where one of the two main characters pretends that the summer they have enjoyed so much together, Ronja and himself, will never end. They have been living very happily during it, all alone in a cave up a high hill, after running away from their families and their irreconcilably enmities, and he believes that there is no going back for him, and his only choice is to stay in the cave alone, because, of course, Ronja must go back home and live, while he must stay there and  freeze to death when winter finally arrives. So, after insisting they should not worry about winter while they are still in full summer, he starts remarking about how cold and windy is the summer (actually already early autumn). While this is disturbing, there is also an earlier, very dramatic episode that I find most remarkable, when both are in a river near some very high falls, letting themselves be driven towards them by the strong current in a thrill-seeking stunt, and as the time finally comes for them to swim to shore and safety, they are attacked by a flock of mystical beings: harpies, part women and part large birds that like to feed on human flesh. So they have no better choice for the moment than to stay in the water, hidden by some floating tree branches they manage to get hold of, while the same water is taking them closer and closer to their likely death in the waterfall. The sound of it is already so loud they cannot hear each other, but they speak to each other all the same and understand one another while saying, as the occasional narrator mentions in voiceover, “the things that have to be said before it is no longer possible to say them.” What they are saying to each other is their mutual declaration of love at the point of their imminent death. This scene has been treated by Ghibli in a way that I find truly moving, and I think that not to be moved by it enough to have one’s eyes grow a little moist would be the same as not being moved in this way by the last scene of “Elvira Madigan”, the end of Fellini’s “La Strada”, or that of “Romeo and Juliet” itself. Because it is that kind of animated show. Even if it is one that ends well, because it is “for kids.” And that is one more among Ghiblis’ distinct and distinguished creations.

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[OscarCP]

Time to update this thread with some news of interest:

Netflix and Amazon, at least in the US, now have now available for streaming more that they used to have from the Studio Aardman’s Bristol geniuses of stop animation (the particular form known as “claymation”) of “Shawn the Sheep” and of “Wallace and Gromit”, about a genius inventor, but otherwise without much to say, except to ask for “Cheese!”, and his often put out by him clever dog that saves the day. Amazon has all the medium-length features of “Wallace and Gromit.” Netflix now has some of the full-feature “Shawn” movies and something really remarkable is now showing in Apple TV+ .

Netflix:

“Shaun the Sheep” first two seasons

“Shaun the Sheep Adventures from Mossy Bottom” 1 season.

“A Shaun the Sheep Movie Farmaggedon.”

Amazon:

“Shaun”: “The Farmer Llamas” Season 1 and and also “Shaun the Sheep” Season 1.

“A Grand Day Out”

“The Wrong Trousers”

“A close Shave”

“A Matter of Loaf and Death”

Tomm Moore, the Irish animation creator of beautifully drawn and scripted movies such as “The Book of Kells” and “Song of the Sea”, based on Irish ancient myths, has one new movie in Apple TV+ called “Wolfwalkers”

Trailer:

A clip:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HSIgYeVqZ8

And a clip:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_Z_tybgPgg

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