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  • Patch Lady – checking for updates

    Home Forums AskWoody blog Patch Lady – checking for updates

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      • #2308703
        Susan Bradley
        Manager

        On my 2004 machine at home I did a test. When you leave the machine alone for the month, you will not get pushed the optional .net update nor the opti
        [See the full post at: Patch Lady – checking for updates]

        Susan Bradley Patch Lady

        3 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2308736
        WCHS
        AskWoody Plus

        I’m still waiting for Woody to say “GO”. I hope Intuit has done its tests with 2004. It’s getting close to the end of the year!!

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2308747
        Bob99
        AskWoody Plus

        I remember seeing a post somewhere here on AskWoody where the poster (maybe one of the MVPs) was quoting @abbodi86 as saying that as long as you keep your Feature Update/Preview Build deferral period set to 365 days, you won’t ever be offered any of the .net previews nor the monthly quality update previews.

        I just don’t remember where on this site the actual post is, but I do remember seeing it not too long ago.

        And, because of the aforementioned setting, I haven’t been offered any previews of any kind as an optional update or otherwise. I’m currently on 2004 x64 Pro fully updated through October’s updates. This is a new machine that came with a clean installation of 2004 not upgraded from any earlier version of Windows, and is a custom build from a local mom and pop computer shop.

        I use wushowhide and no previews have come across in it nor WU since I implemented the policy (deferring feature updates and previews for 365 days) after reading about it in the AKB put out by @PKCano .

        • #2308862
          abbodi86
          AskWoody_MVP

          I never saw .NET CU Preview affected by feature update deferral
          the only way not to gets it is not to install the latest .NET CU Security

          • #2309032
            WCHS
            AskWoody Plus

            I did not see the Week C dotNet Preview in the WU legacy queue between Oct 20 and Oct 31. This appears to be so because I had not installed the Week B dotNet security CU at that time. But, now that it was installed Oct 31 (end of week D), is it likely that this preview will show up in the WU queue sometime between Nov 1 and Nov 9, i.e. before the next week B patches?

      • #2308772
        Latka
        AskWoody Plus

        That is why I still keep the Windows Home Edition machines on “metered” network connections, in addition to setting update deferrals to five weeks.

        The inconvenience about the “metered” connection setting is that Outlook will not sync my emails due to the “metered” connection setting until I click to override.  This happens every time I launch Outlook.  I have not found a setting to turn off this feature.

        The “metered” network setting is much less disruptive now (Win 1909) than it was in previous releases.

        1.  Both wifi and ethernet connections can be set to “metered.”
        2. There are now options in One Drive to sync despite “metered” connection settings, so your One Drive files will stay up-to-date.
        3. When Windows Update is triggered (whether by “seeking” or simply by deactivating the update deferral status), “Updates will not be downloaded due to metered connection” appears.  It is at this point that I run the WUShowHide utility to hide unwanted updates, such as the “Optional” .net update.  I click on “Download anyway” only after WUShowHide finishes its business.

        This usually works.  (As with most things from Microsoft, the emphasis is on “usually.”)  Your mileage may vary.

      • #2308780
        woody
        Manager

        This HAS to be a bug, yes?

        The behavior makes absolutely no sense – and it’s been that way for months.

      • #2308861
        abbodi86
        AskWoody_MVP

        How come i get slightly different design for optional updates?

        or that is affected by configured policies?

        • #2308869
          WCHS
          AskWoody Plus

          How come i get slightly different design for optional updates?

          Your screen(s) are from version 2004?
          What are your configured policies?

          • #2309148
            abbodi86
            AskWoody_MVP

            Yes, the updates description says that cleary 🙂

            AUOptions = 2 (do not auto download or install updates)
            ExcludeWUDriversInQualityUpdate

            1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2308881
        anonymous
        Guest

        Even if you don’t “check for updates,” when you click on “download and install” under the cumulative update preview that it says is available (and there is no mention of any .Net preview also being available), it will not only download and install the cumulative update preview identified but also the .Net preview that is not even mentioned. It is as if Microsoft is bound and determined to force you to accept either both or neither, at least on the Home versions.

      • #2308883
        PFC
        AskWoody Plus

        I don’t know if 20H2 is even more aggressive but this morning after powering on, the following happened.
        From my desktop I ran show/hide, the only thing to hide was a Defender update. I did nothing, closed it.
        Went to Windows Update via Start\Settings\Update and Security. When it opened it was as though I pressed the “Check For Updates”, the little blue dots were rolling and it said “Checking for Updates” then it displayed You’re up to date. It did NOT install that Defender Update. Knowing there was nothing else waiting I clicked Check for Updates and it then installed the Defender Update.
        I had not done it but when I saw this behaviour I immediately put gpedit notification #2 to Enabled.

        Did I just NOT notice that Automatic check for updates prior to 20H2?

      • #2308936
        Marcus Weldby
        AskWoody Plus

        I’m not sure of the best place to direct a question to Patch Lady about the Master Patch List. My question is regarding Version 1903 – none of the patches released on Oct. 13 are listed, but I do see them in my WSUS. Thank you!

      • #2308980
        CraigS26
        AskWoody Plus

        Excuse a slight bend in the road … In Settings/Updates I see the Oct Preview of CU (KB4580386) but it’s Not in wushowhide for Hiding (daily WU checks are active) Is THAT right? I’d even TRY for 20H2 via Check for Updates — but Preview would come, too.

        Per my Signature setup I cannot get May 2004 to show-up; HP + Intel Software Sppt Apps offer Nothing and Dev Mgt checks for (ie) Wi-Fi, Ethernet show Current. My Sound-Video-Game Conexant HD Audio driver (8.65.282.54) is NOT the MS-Blocked “affected-Ver”  [8.65.47.53, 8.65.56.51] (wonder if My 3rd group .282 numbers = 3-characters is per an HP mod) , so Unless I can Hide the Preview I can’t try anything via Check for Updates (multi-Macrium Images).

        Thanks for any suggestions.

        W10 Pro 21H1 / Hm-Stdnt Ofce '16 C2R / HP Envy Desktop-Ethernet/ 12 GB / 256G SSD + 1 TB HDD / i5-8400 CoffeeLake-S / GP=2 + FtrU=Semi-Annual + Feature Defer = 1 + QU=0

        • #2308990
          PKCano
          Manager

          If you are on Win10 Pro and v1909, you can get v2004 two ways:
          See AKB2000016 Sections 3, 4 and 5 (says ro 2004 but settings are the same) for instructions and screenshots. Once on 2004, you will need to change the settings for the long term.

          Either Quality Update deferral = 0, Feature Update deferral = 100, and Automatic update = Enabled, value 2

          OR TargetReleaseVersion = 2004

        • #2309147
          abbodi86
          AskWoody_MVP

          Excuse a slight bend in the road … In Settings/Updates I see the Oct Preview of CU (KB4580386) but it’s Not in wushowhide for Hiding (daily WU checks are active) — Is THAT right? I’d even TRY for 20H2 via Check for Updates — but Preview would come, too.

          Yes, wushowhide cannot show OptionalInstall updates (feature update or CU Preview)

          however, if you set any Deferral days, or use TargetReleaseVersion, OptionalInstall updates becomes regulr Install updates

          • This reply was modified 8 months, 3 weeks ago by abbodi86.
          3 users thanked author for this post.
          • #2309180
            WCHS
            AskWoody Plus

            however, if you set any Deferral days, or use TargetReleaseVersion, OptionalInstall updates becomes regulr Install updates

            I am on version 1909, I have TargetReleaseVersion=1909, FU=365, QU=0, and GP Automatic Updates, value 2 (notify download/install).  I set TargetReleaseVersion to 1909 on Oct 2.  If there were no TRV, then the Oct 20 Cumulative Preview would be prevented from showing up as an optional update because FU=365.  But, since TRV was in play when the Oct 20 Cumulative Preview was released, it should have, as you say, been in the WU queue (if that is where regular install updates go).  But, I have not seen this October 20 Cumulative Preview appear, not as an optional update with a ‘download and install’ button, not as a non-optional, regular update with a ‘download’ button, not in wushowhide as an update to hide.

            How do you explain that??

            • #2309272
              WCHS
              AskWoody Plus

              But, I have not seen this October 20 Cumulative Preview appear, not as an optional update with a ‘download and install’ button, not as a non-optional, regular update with a ‘download’ button, not in wushowhide as an update to hide.

              add:  not as a non-optional, regular update without a ‘download’ button

            • #2309287
              abbodi86
              AskWoody_MVP

              FU Deferral + TargetReleaseVersion = no CU Preview

              1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2309288
                WCHS
                AskWoody Plus

                FU Deferral + TargetReleaseVersion = no CU Preview

                This rule works:

                1. for 1909 users (via GUI FU deferral=365 & TRV=1909)?

                2. for 2004 users (via GP, Windows for Business, select when Preview Builds and FU are received=365 & TRV=2004)?

                3. for 20H2 users (via same way as v2004, except *TRV=2010)?

                *I think you said earlier that TRV for 20H2 is designated as ‘2010’, right?

              • #2309291
                WCHS
                AskWoody Plus

                if you set any Deferral days, or use TargetReleaseVersion, OptionalInstall updates becomes regulr Install updates

                FU Deferral + TargetReleaseVersion = no CU Preview

                So, becoming a regular Install update:
                1. does not mean that it moves to the WU queue, where it would otherwise show up with a “Download” button, if GP=2 (notify download/install)?
                2. And means that it remains in the UUP queue, but is a regular Install update instead of an OptionalInstall update, and since there is a FU deferral, it doesn’t show up on the WU screen, under “Optional Updates” with a ‘download and install’ link?

                So, given 1 and 2, what does ‘regular Install update’ mean? It sounds to me that it’s the same as an OptionalInstall update.

              • #2309293
                PKCano
                Manager

                You can set the FU = 0 or 1 if you use TRV.
                The FU = 365 will confuse people thinking they also have 365 days deferral.
                You should think using one or the other, but not think you have both.
                See the quote from AKB2000016 you sent me earlier.

              • #2309331
                WCHS
                AskWoody Plus

                You can set the FU = 0 or 1 if you use TRV.
                The FU = 365 will confuse people thinking they also have 365 days deferral.
                You should think using one or the other, but not think you have both.
                See the quote from AKB2000016 you sent me earlier.

                Thanks. This explains, for me, too, your thinking behind your screenshot for CraigS26 at Semi-Annual Channel.

                Can you work that screenshot where Semi-Annual Channel=0 into AKB2000016 where you talk about TRV? I confess I seemed to have skipped over the text where the recently added **NOTE in various places says “If you use TargetReleaseVersion, set deferrals to 0 0r 1, as they are going to be ignored anyway.” That visual helps, too, because it also relates to preventing CU Previews from showing up on the WU screen when TRV is set.

                So, whoever is reading my post at #2309288, where you see FU=365, change it to FU=0 OR FU=1. This change is needed because TRV is also configured and has a value.

              • #2309343
                PKCano
                Manager

                That note was added when I added the TRV section.
                People get confused and think they have to set all the controls possible at once (TRV, Deferrals, Pause, Metered connections, and hiding with wushowhide).
                What happens is you end up defeating the purpose and don’t know which one is actually in effect. So you get surprises, things you weren’t expecting happen.
                There is a link to MS Documentation there in AKB2000016 – try reading that.

                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2309352
                WCHS
                AskWoody Plus

                There is a link to MS Documentation …

                Yup, I read the MS documentation, which concludes “When you specify target version policy, feature update deferrals will not be in effect.”

                But, given your text and screenshot for CraigR26 at Semi-Annual Channel, when FU=0 or 1, a CU preview (which is a type of feature update deferral) will not show up on the WU screen (which means that there is an effect, i.e., the CU preview is not deferred per se, but it is prevented from ever appearing (and therefore, no ‘download and install’ link to click on). In other words, you don’t even know that it is out there, because you don’t get a ‘download and install’ link, you will never see it in wushowhide, and you will never get a ‘download’ button, if GP=2.

              • #2309345
                WCHS
                AskWoody Plus

                You can set the FU = 0 or 1 if you use TRV.

                Even in the GUI of version 1909?

              • #2309328
                Microfix
                AskWoody MVP

                FU Deferral + TargetReleaseVersion = no CU Preview

                and that explains why I’m not getting/ seeing CU previews on 1909, Great!

                | Quality over Quantity |
            • #2309326
              abbodi86
              AskWoody_MVP

              Yes, those rules work

              there are no separate WUA queue and UUP queue
              regular install (Download button) include WUA and UUP update
              Optional updates are for UUP only

              no FU Deferral or TargetReleaseVersion = you get optional updates

              FU Deferral or TargetReleaseVersion = you don’t get optional updates

              FU Deferral only = you get feature update or not (based on days)

              TargetReleaseVersion only = you get CU Preview

              FU Deferral + TargetReleaseVersion = you don’t get DU or CU Preview

              QU Deferral only = you get feature update (if available)

              QU + TargetReleaseVersion = you get CU Security

              2 users thanked author for this post.
          • #2341617
            Bob99
            AskWoody Plus

            Yes, wushowhide cannot show OptionalInstall updates (feature update or CU Preview)

            That explains why, no matter what I did with the settings in gpedit under Windows Update for Business (including setting them all to “Not Configured”), I couldn’t see the CU preview for next month, only the .NET preview for next month: wushowhide isn’t designed to show CU or FU previews!

            Thanks for the information!

            1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2309000
        CraigS26
        AskWoody Plus

        If you are on Win10 Pro and v1909, you can get v2004 two ways: See AKB2000016 Sections 3, 4 and 5 (says ro 2004 but settings are the same) for instructions and screenshots. Once on 2004, you will need to change the settings for the long term. Either Quality Update deferral = 0, Feature Update deferral = 100, and Automatic update = Enabled, value 2 OR TargetReleaseVersion = 2004

        Per Signature GP=2 and TRV is 2004 = No 2004 Offered since Oct 28 setup changes and daily WU chks verified.+ all the driver/software chks I mentioned…

        Never had a Version Upgrade issue so I’d try 20H2 but didn’t want to without Hiding the Preview.

        Should the Preview of Oct CU Now in Settings Update be in wushowhide as THAT is the only way I know to hide it So I can Check for Updates and (with multi-Macrium’s) see what happens?

        W10 Pro 21H1 / Hm-Stdnt Ofce '16 C2R / HP Envy Desktop-Ethernet/ 12 GB / 256G SSD + 1 TB HDD / i5-8400 CoffeeLake-S / GP=2 + FtrU=Semi-Annual + Feature Defer = 1 + QU=0

        • #2309004
          PKCano
          Manager

          Give me a few – I’m researching on mine.

        • #2309012
          PFC
          AskWoody Plus

          Should the Preview of Oct CU Now in Settings Update be in wushowhide as THAT is the only way I know to hide it So I can Check for Updates and (with multi-Macrium’s) see what happens?

          I checked for updates this morning and the Optional update did NOT install

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2309262
            WCHS
            AskWoody Plus

            I checked for updates this morning and the Optional update did NOT install

            Did you have TRV set?  Did you have any deferrals set?

            • #2309296
              PFC
              AskWoody Plus

              Did you have TRV set? Did you have any deferrals set?

              No, neither, nor did I want the optional update to install. I was just telling CraigS26 what I did. He seemed to have the same issue but worrying about checking for updates. This get confusing at times.

              I’ll have to put in those gp edits that PK gave, to prevent the previews.

               

              • This reply was modified 8 months, 3 weeks ago by PFC.
        • #2309033
          PKCano
          Manager

          Leave TRV = 2004

          I have deferrals set in the GUI WUAdvanced settingspulldowns Feature=365, Quality=0
          In GP, only “2.” Everything under Windows Update for Business is “not configured.”
          Settings specified in section 4 of AKB2000016. I do not see any Preview.
          (These GUI settings are gone in 2004, so you have to use GP settings for the same thing once you upgrade).

          If I set deferrals in GP Windows Update for Business, the GUI pulldowns are grayed out or disappear (as per AKB2000016).

          If I set deferrals in GP Windows Update for Business and I do not want Preview CUs, I specify “Semi=Annual Channel” (which doesn’t exist as a GUI setting anymore, but it keeps the wolves away). Try setting the Feature deferral = 1 there too. It should be ignored.

          Screen-Shot-2020-11-02-at-1.19.44-PM

          2 users thanked author for this post.
          • #2309209
            CraigS26
            AskWoody Plus

            If I set deferrals in GP Windows Update for Business and I do not want Preview CUs, I specify “Semi=Annual Channel” (which doesn’t exist as a GUI setting anymore, but it keeps the wolves away). Try setting the Feature deferral = 1 there too. It should be ignored.

            Above hi-lights Done …..

            Per PFC Check for Updates did NOT install the Preview but since nothing is on the Settings/Update Page as Ready to Install it’s not shocking that nothing else happened.

            Everything seems ready for 2004 or 20H2, so I’ll just coast awhile and keep up with Forum posts. Thanks to all for Replies.

            W10 Pro 21H1 / Hm-Stdnt Ofce '16 C2R / HP Envy Desktop-Ethernet/ 12 GB / 256G SSD + 1 TB HDD / i5-8400 CoffeeLake-S / GP=2 + FtrU=Semi-Annual + Feature Defer = 1 + QU=0

            • This reply was modified 8 months, 3 weeks ago by CraigS26.
          • #2309236
            CraigS26
            AskWoody Plus

            PKCano wrote: If I set deferrals in GP Windows Update for Business and I do not want Preview CUs, I specify “Semi=Annual Channel” (which doesn’t exist as a GUI setting anymore, but it keeps the wolves away). Try setting the Feature deferral = 1 there too. It should be ignored….. Above hi-lights Done …..

            Per PFC Check for Updates did NOT install the Preview but since nothing is on the Settings/Update Page as Ready to Install it’s not shocking that nothing else happened. Everything seems ready for 2004 or 20H2, so I’ll just coast awhile and keep up with Forum posts. Thanks to all for Replies.

            Since the two GP changes above the Oct CU Preview has Disappeared in Settings/Updates.

            W10 Pro 21H1 / Hm-Stdnt Ofce '16 C2R / HP Envy Desktop-Ethernet/ 12 GB / 256G SSD + 1 TB HDD / i5-8400 CoffeeLake-S / GP=2 + FtrU=Semi-Annual + Feature Defer = 1 + QU=0

      • #2309830
        MrToad28
        AskWoody Lounger

        Just bought a new [for me] Win10 pro refurb desktop Ver1909, last patched 11/2019. My experience is only with Win7’s. I know there be daemons with updating. The conservative strategy would be to keep V1909 but get security updates. The posts I’ve found on this describe complicated ways to tiptoe through this update minefield.. My tentative plan is to create an ISO backup of the system as it stands and get a V1909 copy using https://heidoc.net/joomla/technology-science/microsoft/67-microsoft-windows-and-office-iso-download-tool  as Woody has recommended. With that, I will start my trek through the minefield. Any sage advice on this strategy would be deeply appreciated.

        Thanks

        • #2309834
          PKCano
          Manager

          At this point, Woody is still recommending staying on v1909.
          And there have been problems with installs using ISOs causing the loss of certificates (see the main Blog article on this).
          V1909 is good until May 2021, I would recommend you waiting a while before upgrading to either v2004 or v20H2.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2310016
            MrToad28
            AskWoody Lounger

            Thanks..my tentative plan is to keep 1909 until Devcon 4 or 5 in early 2021 and upgrade to 20H2 before 21H1 hits..by then the kinks should be ironed out of 20H2 and I’ll have a long runway before 21H1.

            Really appreciate the assistance.

        • #2309895
          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          Just bought a new [for me] Win10 pro refurb desktop Ver1909

          Set TRV to 1909 and leave Windows to manage the patches is easiest.

          cheers, Paul

          1 user thanked author for this post.
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