News, tips, advice, support for Windows, Office, PCs & more. Tech help. No bull. We're community supported by donations from our Plus Members, and proud of it
Home icon Home icon Home icon Email icon RSS icon
  • Patch Lady – don’t install optional updates

    Posted on Susan Bradley Comment on the AskWoody Lounge

    Home Forums AskWoody blog Patch Lady – don’t install optional updates

    This topic contains 25 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by  abbodi86 2 weeks, 5 days ago.

    • Author
      Posts
    • #2124723 Reply

      Susan Bradley
      AskWoody MVP

      One of the nice changes to 1909 (it only took HOW many versions to get to this) is that the optional updates are not easily get-to-able.Β  Now you can
      [See the full post at: Patch Lady – don’t install optional updates]

      Susan Bradley Patch Lady

      4 users thanked author for this post.
    • #2124726 Reply

      bbearren
      AskWoody MVP

      Your friendly neighborhood Seeker/cannon-fodder here; installed it on the 28th, no issues to report.

      Create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates, in case you need to start over!
      "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."β€”M.O. Johns
      "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."β€”Sir Thomas Robert Deware

      • #2124735 Reply

        Susan Bradley
        AskWoody MVP

        Live on the edge do you?Β  πŸ™‚

        Susan Bradley Patch Lady

        • #2124812 Reply

          bbearren
          AskWoody MVP

          No, not at all.Β  The 28th was Tuesday, my latest drive image was created the previous Sunday, the 26th, by Task Scheduler.Β  My data is triple-copied to separate locations daily, and to OneDrive.Β  Even if I had a BSOD, black screen, or complete failure to boot, The B side of my dual boot would have been unaffected, and I would be about 6 minutes away from having my A side just like it was the 26th, easy peasy lemon squeezy.

          It’s more like fishing.Β  If it’s not a keeper, all I have to do is throw it back and re-bait my hook.Β  And I always have bait at the ready.Β  In all my tinkerin’ and piddlin’ with Windows innards over the years, I have crashed Windows and restored drive images literally hundreds of times.Β  Never had an issue with a drive image restore.

          In all my years of running Windows, I’ve always kept my systems fully updated, and I’ve never had an issue with an update or in-place upgrade.Β  Being a Seeker/cannon-fodder has no real consequence if one stays prepared.Β  I have fresh drive images from this morning, the originals are still on a 1TB SSD in the desktop, and I have copied them to a docked HDD in my NAS, then un-docked it and put it away for safe keeping.

          I started creating drive images with a Colorado Tape Drive, then CD’s, then DVD’s, an internal HDD, then SSD, and now with home network storage.Β  Drive imaging is so much easier to do today than it was twenty years ago, that there is really no excuse to not do it regularly.

          I’m not throwing shade on you by any means, you do a fantastic job and a greatly appreciated service for the SOHO folks, and I commend you for it.Β  But I’m a home user with a home network, and if I break it, I know how to fix it.Β  I’ll keep fishin’.

          Create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates, in case you need to start over!
          "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."β€”M.O. Johns
          "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."β€”Sir Thomas Robert Deware

          1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2124779 Reply

      woody
      Da Boss

      I’ve been waiting for my optional patch to show up, so I can take that screenshot.

      As of this moment, my 1903 machines show “Feature update to Windows 10, version 1909” but no optional patch for 1903.

      • #2124858 Reply

        abbodi86
        AskWoody_MVP

        It won’t show up if you set any deferrals

        • #2135504 Reply

          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          and what happens when the deferral expires? Does the Quality update deferral at Windows Update>Advanced Options apply to non-security, optional updates? If so, then if this non-security, optional update was released on January 28 and the Quality update deferral is set to 21 days, then does that mean that it’s out of the picture until 21 days from January 28? If so, that’s February 18, and before that there will be a Feb 11 Tuesday Patch, which is cumulative. Does the Feb 11 cumulative Patch Tuesday patch of Feb 11 make the non-security, optional patch of January 29 obsolete? And if it makes it obsolete, then do you never see the non-security, optional January 28 patch appear as an offer?

          This is all prefaced by the condition, of course, that you don’t click on “Check for Updates”

          Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
          Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
          Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

        • #2135561 Reply

          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          It won’t show up if you set any deferrals

          It says at Windows Update > Advanced options that a Deferral applies to either a Feature Update or a Quality update. Is a non-security, optional update considered a a quality update, therefore eligible for a deferral? I have been under the impression that only security updates are considered quality updates. But, if non-security, optional updates are considered quality updates, what happens when the deferral expires? Do you get an announcement that an optional update is available, for which you have a “Download and install now” link, which you can refuse to click on? If so, what happens to that announcement whose link you refuse click on … does it stay there forever? Or does it eventually disappear? If it disappears, is this non-security, optional update eventually subsumed under a later Patch Tuesday update?

          Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
          Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
          Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

    • #2125122 Reply

      Mr. Natural
      AskWoody Plus

      Thanks Susan, I started pushing KB4532695 late last week before your post and so far (knock wood) I have not had any reports of issues with this patch. I’ve had it installed on my work pc since middle of last week and no issues to report. My guess is its going to be related to third party software in some form.

      Red Ruffnsore reporting from the front lines.

    • #2125125 Reply

      Win7and10
      AskWoody Lounger

      How do you stop the install of optional updates?

      Is there a way that denies checking for them?

      Do you use the app to hide them if they are downloaded to install?

      This is my first full month with Windows 10 patches and right now I have them on pause.

      Win 7 Home Premium x 64 SP1 (DELL INSPIRION i5) Still Alive!
      Win 10 Home 1909 (HP ENVY i7)

      • #2125129 Reply

        PKCano
        Da Boss

        Check for updates” = download/install whatever updates arepending. DON’T “check for updates.”

        You use wushowhide to hide PENDING updates. You cannot hide them after thay have downloaded.

        If you have updates “Paused” they will not show up in WU until the Pause period os over OR you end the “Pause.”
        When the “Pause” period ends (or you end it), the pending updates have to be installed before you can use “Pause” again. So be sure to mark the “Pause” end date on your calendar, because that is when your computer will update (unless you have metered connections).

        Without clicking “Check for updates,” the updates you will be offered through WU are Security updates, not Optional updates. The optional updates will be presented in the “Show optional updates” section below the WU queue area. They will not download/install without your permission (unless you “check for updates”). See illustration here.

        4 users thanked author for this post.
        • #2125189 Reply

          Win7and10
          AskWoody Lounger

          Right now I am on pause, meaning if I “unpause” on 1909 will the optional updates be there? Should I unpause and just let it check on it’s own?

          Sorry, I am confused, it sounds like pause may or may not bring down the optional updates. I do like the fact that 1909 has the OPTIONAL listed separately, never ever installed any OPTIONAL updates, EVER.

          If I “unpause” the updates will optional appear and then will have to HIDE the optional with wushowhide? I’m familiar with that app already since I investigated it when I set up the computer.

          Thanks for your patience, once I get through the first month of patches and updates with WIN10 after initial setup of the computer I will be fine. πŸ™‚

          Win 7 Home Premium x 64 SP1 (DELL INSPIRION i5) Still Alive!
          Win 10 Home 1909 (HP ENVY i7)

          • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 2 days ago by  Win7and10.
          • #2125198 Reply

            PKCano
            Da Boss

            “Pause” applies to Security = Patch Tuesday updates. If the pause period expires, or if you you end it, you will get whatever Security updates are pending for your computer. That means the CU, .NET CU, MSRT, etc issued on Patch Tuesday. These are euqivalent to the checked Important updates in Win7/8.1.

            The Optional updates are availabel in the optional update section below. They are not install by ending of the Pause period. They are installed if you click the “Download and install” link in the Oprional section. These are equivalent to the unchecked Optional updates in Win7/8.1

            If you click “Check for updates” you get anything that’s out there – Security or Optional. Don’t click “Check for updates'” EVER.

            2 users thanked author for this post.
            • #2125213 Reply

              Win7and10
              AskWoody Lounger

              Thank you so much! I really appreciate it and will be a pro next time for sure. I love this place for all the confidence and updates that you exude.

              Win 7 Home Premium x 64 SP1 (DELL INSPIRION i5) Still Alive!
              Win 10 Home 1909 (HP ENVY i7)

        • #2135519 Reply

          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          You use wushowhide to hide PENDING updates.

          And PENDING means ‘available”, as in “Optional update available”?

          Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
          Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
          Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

          • #2135628 Reply

            abbodi86
            AskWoody_MVP

            wushowhide cannot see the new “optional updates”

            try WuMgr

    • #2125197 Reply

      Alex5723
      AskWoody Plus

      Right now I am on pause, meaning if I β€œunpause” on 1909 will the optional updates be there?

      No, unless you click ‘check for updates’.

      • #2135529 Reply

        KYKaren
        AskWoody Plus

        No, unless you click β€˜check for updates’.

        Let me see if I can get the logic of this —
        So, taking into account @pkcano‘s post at #2125198 that PAUSE/UNPAUSE applies only to Security updates (and Feature updates, too, I believe) and since we are talking about a non-security, optional update here, then “unpausing” would not precipitate downloading and installing it and ??neither would it precipitate the announcement that an optional update was available (and thus there would not be present a “Download and install now” link?? so that means that the only way that it COULD install is to click on the “Check for update”, which you never want to do??

        Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
        Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
        Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

        • #2135609 Reply

          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          You are correct – doncha love the “new” MS way!?

          cheers, Paul

          • #2136179 Reply

            KYKaren
            AskWoody Plus

            doncha love the β€œnew” MS way!?

            I conclude, then, that the Optional Install Update is an animal of its own kind (i.e., a category of Update apart from Feature Update, Quality Update, Servicing Stack Update, or any other category of update):

            • 1) as an optional update, it is by its nature a non-security update, meant for making a fix available to any guinea pig who wants to test it to see if there are any problems with it
            • 2) it cannot be a pending update that could be hidden by Wushowhide.
            • 3) it is out of the realm of PAUSE or DEFER, i.e., PAUSE and DEFER have no effect on it
            • 4) it is only made available via a “Download and Install now” link, which you can click on, if you want to be a guinea pig
            • 5) Do not click on “Check for Updates” or else it, along with any Feature Update and any Quality Update that have been released that you haven’t deferred, will be installed.
            • 6) Just wait for it to be subsumed into an upcoming Patch Tuesday Update release.

            Are optional updates also out of the purview of the Group Policy Editor’s Windows Update option #2-Notify Download and install? This seems to be the case, since it has its own Optional Update notification and its own “Download and Install now” link.

            Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
            Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
            Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

            • #2136199 Reply

              abbodi86
              AskWoody_MVP

              – It’s not different category, it’s different DeploymentAction

              2) it can be pending, but Wushowhide cannot see it

              3) It’s affected by Pause or Defer
              when pause is expired, it will still be pending optional update
              when deferral is over, it will become pending normal update

            • #2136203 Reply

              KYKaren
              AskWoody Plus

              3) It’s [i.e., an optional update] affected by Pause or Defer …when pause is expired, it will still be pending optional update

              If a pending optional update is still a pending optional update when the Pause period is over/expired, how could it be affected by Pause??? If X is still X, then X is not affected/the state of X has not changed, right?

              To further elaborate, I can’t reconcile what you say here [that an optional update is affected by Pause] with the statement by @pkcano in #2125198, i.e.,

              The Optional updates are availabel in the optional update section below. They are not install[ed] by ending of the Pause period. They are installed if you click the β€œDownload and install” link in the Oprional section. These are equivalent to the unchecked Optional updates in Win7/8.1

              Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
              Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
              Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

            • #2136205 Reply

              abbodi86
              AskWoody_MVP

              You like technicalities πŸ™‚

              what i ment is, when you Pause updates, Optional Updates are paused too and the “Download and Install now” section will be removed during pause period

              • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 6 days ago by  abbodi86.
              1 user thanked author for this post.
            • #2136210 Reply

              KYKaren
              AskWoody Plus

              and that when the Pause period expires, the “Download and install now” section will return?

              Offline: Win7Pro βˆ™ SP1 βˆ™ x64
              Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-6500U βˆ™ RAM 12GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender
              Online: Win10Pro βˆ™ 1909.18363 βˆ™ x64 βˆ™ i7-8565U βˆ™ RAM 16GB βˆ™ SSD βˆ™ Firefox βˆ™ McAfee Internet Security βˆ™ Windows Defender

            • #2136216 Reply

              abbodi86
              AskWoody_MVP

              Yes

    • #2125199 Reply

      zero2dash
      AskWoody Lounger

      Every Gordon Kelly article has the same title; nothing new to see here really.
      The guy somehow makes a living off writing FUD and exploiting it to the nth degree.

    Please follow the -Lounge Rules- no personal attacks, no swearing, and politics/religion are relegated to the Rants forum.

    Reply To: Patch Lady – don’t install optional updates

    You can use BBCodes to format your content.
    Your account can't use Advanced BBCodes, they will be stripped before saving.