• Thunderbird: A worthy alternative to Microsoft Outlook

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    #2471822

    SOFTWARE By Lance Whitney If you find the Outlook email client too cumbersome or complicated, Thunderbird is a simpler yet robust email program worth
    [See the full post at: Thunderbird: A worthy alternative to Microsoft Outlook]

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    • #2471835

      I’ve been using consecutive versions of Thunderbird (by Mozilla, not by Ford) for multiple years now. I wholeheartedly and enthusiastically agree as to the worth of Thunderbird.

      One little criticism though: In 2015 Mozilla only offered the 32 bit version, which then I installed in my brand new Windows 10 64 bit. Since then I’ve been expecting a promised automatic upgrade to 64 bit. Yes Mozilla, you promised it a while ago. Unfortunately I’m still waiting for it.

      1 Desktop W11
      1 Laptop W10
      Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
      • #2472012

        UPDATE: Thunderbird 91 and cents (32 bit) finally received an automatic upgrade to 102.1.2 (64 bit).

        1 Desktop W11
        1 Laptop W10
        Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
    • #2471848

      I am interested. I use Outlook because it keeps my email calendar and contacts integrated, and because I can sync the latter two to my Android phone and tablet using the add-on AKRuto (paid for). But, I am on Outlook 2010 so at some stage I will need to change, and I have no need to pay for a Microsoft 365 subscription. Email sync is not a problem because I use IMAP on my own domain, which does not use a Microsoft back end.

      So – I assume Thunderbird can import my contacts (1000+) and calendar from the Outlook pst file. Can it?

      Most importantly, is there a way, add on or otherwise, for Thunderbird to sync contacts and calendar to my phone and tablet? I do not use Google calendar – just the native calendar.

      Thoughts from experienced users wold be much appreciated!

      Chris
      Win 10 Pro x64 Group A

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      • #2473024

        Yes, you can import your Outlook address book into Thunderbird. HOWEVER, getting a precise matchup of ALL the data fields can be a challenge, especially if you really made use of a lot of the available fields and features in Outlook with addresses, multiple contact numbers and alternative emails, birthdays, etc.

        For the majority of my contacts, I had minimal info entered into Outlook beyond the Name and Email. For closer contacts and friends and relatives, I had lots of info in the Outlook 2010 Address Book. Using the relatively simple Thunderbird import tool worked, but due to differences in data field terminology between Outlook and TB, some data was in the wrong data field in TB.

        To fix the issue, I looked carefully at which field went where and then did different EXPORTS of the Outlook data into a both a TXT file and into CSV files and then imported them into TB. Once I saw what actually went where, I opened the CSV file in Excel and moved the data to the correct location and did a re-import.

        I am sure that was NOT the easiest and fastest (or even correct) way to accomplish the task, but it worked for my purposes. Now that I am using TB on all my systems, I just do a manual full Thunderbird (and Firefox) profile backup on a bi-weekly basis to a USB drive. This facilitates a truly easy duplication of my Thunderbird data (including emails) to any new installs, other systems, or in case of disaster. Plus a TB profile works identically and interchangeably on a Windows or Linux machine.

        On the Thunderbird vs. Outlook calendar, Outlook allows far more flexibility for repeat scheduling, such as the 3rd Tuesday of every month. This cannot be done in TB as it allows monthly, but does not provide a specific week/day, instead defaulting to the same DATE of each month.

        If Mozilla ever discontinues development, it would be a massive loss or the FOSS community and folks not wedded to the Microsoft OS or MSOffice platforms.

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    • #2471859

      I also use Thunderbird and think it’s various features make it much better than Outlook.

      I really like the fact it “automatically” creates separate inbox/draft/trash folders for each account, all in one place, without all the rigamarole you have to go thru to do that in Outlook!

      @Chris-B

      Not sure about the contacts, but there’s Lightning Calendar (an Integrated Calendar & Scheduler add-on for Thunderbird) that can “create/accept” invitation emails just like Outlook.

      Don’t know if it can sync with phones and tablets (never tried to use it for that)?

    • #2471854

      Every time I backup my data files, I also backup all my Thunderbird email messages. It’s a long path, but once you do it a few times you will have it memorized. Go to File Explorer and choose:

      Local Disk C:\Users\[Your User Name]\AppData\Roaming\Thunderbird\Profiles\[Your Profile]\Mail\Local Folders (or whatever you named your mail folder)

      When you get to Local Folders, RIGHT CLICK on it and choose Send to. Choose the location where you save your backups. In my case, an external hard drive.

    • #2471867

      While I am a devotee of Microsoft “Outlook”, I have in the past tried to use “Thunderbird”. My problem with “Thunderbird” is its Address Book which is very cumbersome to use. As far as the last time I used “Thunderbird” the Address Book was the old Eudora model. It is very difficult to get names and email addresses to properly align.

       

      If this has been changed I would like to know about it.

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    • #2471881

      Not supporting Android is a non-starter for me. I must have the desktop info of contacts and calendar on my phone. At least Outlook has an Android app.

      Don’t get me wrong – I loathe Microsoft’s software, don’t even get me started!

      I have a 3rd party program that syncs nicely my desktop Outlook contacts and calendar to my G-Contacts and G-Calander. Other Outlook folders could be synced also, but it’s not necessary for me.

       

    • #2471885

      I’ve been using it all the way back  to the original Eudora look. when they had the trash barrel  symbol.

    • #2471861

      My vote goes to EM Client….much better

       

      https://www.emclient.com

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    • #2471901

      @Douglas9x Can EM Client do the stuff I am after in my post above?

      Chris
      Win 10 Pro x64 Group A

    • #2471904

      Wholeheartedly endorse Thunderbird.  I have used it for many years and love it.

      As one of the respondents recommended, I backup Thunderbird email as suggested.

      Will never use Outlook.  In fact, I won’t use any Microsoft products except Windows and Office dating back to DOS where I was involved in a minor way with a business deal.  Two Microsoft reps were convicted of bribery and I never forgave.

    • #2471928

      I have used Thunderbird for many years, but this year I had to give it up. I could not modify font size in the different panels.

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      • #2472080

        In Thunderbird version 102.1.2, font size can be adjusted by clicking on the 3 bars (‘Display the Thunderbird Menu’) in the top right hand corner and by going to ‘View’ in the drop down menu followed by ‘Font size’. Use the – or + buttons to adjust the size of the font in all panels at the same time. Hope this helps.

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    • #2471938

      Lance:

      Concerning your article on Thunderbird in ISSUE 19.34.F • 2022-08-22.

      I also use Thunderbird as my email agent and then later discovered that also has all the features I wanted in a blog reader. I was previously using the ancient RSSOwl blog reader and have successfully transitioned to using Thunderbird to keep up to date on a number of blogs.

      Thanks – Dave

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    • #2471947

      I’ve used Thunderbird at home for many years, and it’s worked OK. As others have noted, the ability to backup email accounts is great.

      One area Outlook out performs Thunderbird is in formatting emails. Outlook can be a pain, but it shines when you want to apply more than bold face or underline to text.

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      • #2471994

        I’m using Thunderbird on my Kubuntu Linux machine, and I’ve found the program to be adequate, nothing more. The main reason has to do with the type size selection. Instead of allowing me to specify (for example) 9-point or 12-point size, Thunderbird’s font size menu only lists choices from “tiny” and “small” up to “extra large” and “huge”. But it doesn’t tell me what point size any of these are. I can also use Ctrl-> and Ctrl-< to make the type bigger or smaller, but again I am not told what sizes these are. In Outlook, I can even specify (say) 10.5-point type rather than 10 or 11, as it lets me enter that number in addition to picking from a list of predetermined sizes.

        And then I always have to watch out for the type size suddenly changing without my telling it to, for example after hitting the Enter key to start a new paragraph and the new text comes out smaller than what comes before it.

         

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    • #2471957

      I have been using Outlook 2010 Email Client with Pop3 for quite a while. Are there any recommendations on converting Outlook 2010 Pop3 emails to Thunderbird email?

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2471955

      Have only been using Thunderbird, since the days of Netscape Communicator which I used before (aside from Unix “mail” and Compuserve).

      acott s.

    • #2471970

      Thunderbird is great to manage emails. I love it and have been using it at work for years. The quick filter is awesome. I literally have more than a million emails on it and it handles them flawlessly and fast.

      The problem with Thunderbird is its calendar and contacts synchronization. We lost so much time trying to make it work. It sucks and when it seems to work, then you discover weird issues, like doubling your invites or other.

      Instead of changing the UI, the devs should really focus on making it work well with Google Calendar and other popular solution to become a real professional alternative to Outlook.

      For all others who doesn’t need this synchronization, I highly recommend it.

       

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    • #2471974

      I am outlook fan, but also play with open source distros and prefer evolution and not thunderbird due to EWS integration.

      Dave M

    • #2471977

      I have been using Thunderbird for as long as I can remember, now with Win 10

      But, recently the title ‘Subject ‘ column has disappeared from the Inbox, Trash and is NOT in the ‘Select Messages’ section.

      The email listings without a ‘Subject’ are hard to follow. Is there any other info you need?

      How can I get the Subject back in my email lists.

      MikeD

       

      • #2472013

        In the small menu bar along the top of the large right hand panel, which contains “Subject” and other items, place your mouse pointer on a hardly visible vertical line and move the two headed pointer back and forth. On my TB this hides or shows “Subject” and others.  Hope this helps.

    • #2472017

      I have been using Thunderbird for more than one year now, because it can work with a POP3 type of incoming server and SMTP outgoing server, something that allows me to keep all my emails, received as well as sent, in my computer.

      I have never used Outlook in any of my own computers, for the reasons given by Lance Whitney in his Newsletter article.

      A second important reason for using TB is that a lot of people at AskWoody use it, someone can ask questions, or explain a mystery problem and someone will come along and help with an answer or an useful suggestion for fixing the problem. I must mention in particular PaulK, who has been invariably most helpful in this respect. And, of course, PK.

      Both things mentioned above have worked as advertised. Everything else has been very, very, very disappointing.

      I have written several times about weird problems using Thunderbird I’ve never had with any of the other email clients I’ve used over the years. For more details, search “I hate Thunderbird”, “Have  told you how much I hate Thunderbird?”, and “Tiny Letters.”

      See also Cybertooth comment, earlier in this thread: #2471994 .

      Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

      MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
      Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
      macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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    • #2472099

      I use TB 52.9.1 version. It’s a good version and some of the newer versions are awful.

      I loved Oulook Express when I got my first computer back in 1999. When Microsoft ditched it I switched to TB and I am very happy with it. I would probably hate newer versions though so I stay with an old version. I hate IMAP and continue to use POP.

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    • #2472105

      I don’t think anyone mentioned the biggest strength of Thunderbird over Outlook.  Outlook uses a single huge file to hold all the data.  Thunderbird uses separate files to hold calendar, contact, and each email folder’s information.  If any single file gets corrupted in Thunderbird, the damage is limited.  In outlook, everything is gone.  Archiving is also handled better in Thunderbird since you can create archive folders; each capable of holding the max file size worth of data (although I would not recommend that – spread them out).

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      • #2472176

        We have been using Outlook for decades and have had no problems recovering from the corruption or loss of an Outlook data file.

        Our emails are stored on our email service provider’s servers as well as on our PCs.

        My calendar has data going back years and I have hundreds of contacts.

        Our practice is to “export” calendar and contact files to external drives weekly using Outlook’s export tool. At present, my backup calendar file is 29,000 KB and the contacts file 6,000 KB. This is in addition to daily backups using Acronis True Image for Western Digital.

        If things go bump in the night, all we have to do is delete the problem Outlook account, setup a new account, sync the new account with our email service provider’s servers, wait while our in and sent email is downloaded from the server, and then import our backup calendar and contact files.

      • #2472198

        File management under Outlook, using local PST files:

        With Outlook, I use multiple files. I use a separate file for calendar, address book, notes, and tasks. For email, I use two current files plus multiple archive files. Rules divide my incoming email to two separate email only files.

        To manage the size of the files, auto archive is run monthly. Mail files are compressed every few months. Maximum file sizes are kept to around 1.5 GB each for email, for this 32-bit implementation of Office.

        To help prevent corruption, scanpst.exe is run every few months with backup. To recover from fatal corruption, the contents of a corrupted file can be copied into a new one. No email has ever been lost with Outlook. Local Outlook files are a part of incremental backup.

        This is not to say which file storage method, Outlook verses Thunderbird, is better. Or to say Outlook is better than Thunderbird. A comparison between the two is complex. A huge difference is cost: I consider Outlook expensive compared to other choices.

        Windows 10 22H2 desktops & laptops on Dell, HP, ASUS; No servers, no domain.

    • #2472148

      My Outlook is not broken,  so no need to fix it.

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      LH, b
    • #2472206

      My wife occasionally experiences a strange problem, where Outlook 2016 will close itself down without warning or apparent reason.

      Apparently there is a way to set Outlook to restore the previous session (like a browser) so that all the emails that were open will come back up when she relaunches Outlook, and we will now implement that solution, but I’m more interested in figuring out what the heck might be causing Outlook to shut down spontaneously so that we can prevent the issue from happening again.

       

    • #2472215

      UPDATE: Thunderbird 91 and cents (32 bit) finally received an automatic upgrade to 102.1.2 (64 bit).

      I just got updated from Thunderbird 91.x to 102.2.0, but it’s still 32-bit. What’s up with that?

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      • #2472244

        UPDATE: Thunderbird 91 and cents (32 bit) finally received an automatic upgrade to 102.1.2 (64 bit).

        I just got updated from Thunderbird 91.x to 102.2.0, but it’s still 32-bit. What’s up with that?

        No idea, sorry.

        I updated first to TB 102.1.2 and then to TB 102.2.0.
        That gave a BAD result. I could not connect to Gmail.com any more and manipulating TB’s Gmail settings was no help.

        After restoring Thunderbird 91.12 (complete partition image restored) Gmail works fine again.

        I think I’ll wait for a version 103.x to update Thunderbird.

        1 Desktop W11
        1 Laptop W10
        Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
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        • #2473974

          I got 102.2.0 and it broke connections with AOL POP accounts. When I tried to go back to 91 it said I couldn’t because my stored email format was upgraded. Am I stuck now?

          • #2473987

            Try updating to 102.2.1

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            • #2473997

              no luck. says “server does not support selected authentication method”, but it still works fine on V91 at a different computer.

            • #2474009

              Are you using your AOL password?
              I think you need a (16-character?) security passcode, instead of the AOL password, to connect to AOL with Thunderbird.
              OAuth or OAuth2 maybe? Check the AOL website for instructions on creating an email security passcode.

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            • #2474087

              yes, I’ve got these in the past. Doesn’t even go through the process of getting one. Used to pop up a browser window, I’d log into the account, then would ask if I authorized Tbird access. I’d click yes and all is well. DOESN’T ask anymore, just the “we don’t support this authentication method”. Did tbird remove this process in 102? How do I find out?

            • #2474094

              TBird wasn’t the one requiring that. It is the email provider that is requiring the extra mile. Go to the AOL website and make inquiries about it. It may be the same passcode you were using before is the one you need now (in place of the AOL password). But there should be instructions somewhere on your email carrier’s website regarding security and using third-party apps to retrieve your mail.

      • #2472245

        JohnW: “What’s up with that?

        It’s Thunderbird! It moves in mysteriously imprecise and confusing ways: for some it’s 64-bit, for others, the same one is 32-bit!

        There is no upside, in my opinion, to worrying about what’s up with it: either keep using TB, or else don’t — and, either way, accept the corresponding consequences. Assuming that not using TB has consequences worth accepting.

        Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

        MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
        Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
        macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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        • #2472410

          I will keep running Thunderbird. I migrated to it back when Microsoft end-of-lifed Outlook Express. Been smooth sailing ever since. 🙂

          I have other modern applications that still execute as 32-bit programs on Windows 10 64-bit without any issue. So I don’t see any downside to running an email client in a 32-bit address space. Just wondering why some Thunderbird installations are 64-bit, and some are not… inquiring minds just want to know!

          Windows 10 Pro 22H2

    • #2472916

      Lance, Yep!  Outlook is too darn complicated, as I find when called upon to troubleshoot it. I am sure there are good people who make a good living as specialists in the hundreds of radio buttons, check boxes and fields that one can mess with, often out of ignorance due to the complexity of the product and the unavailability of ready explanations, only what can be found on the Microsoft website or a website dedicated to Microsoft support, only after making up the right Google search.  And, of course, we have the ongoing battle for world domination among Microsoft, Apple and Google.  So Google’s email stopped supporting older versions of Outlook on June 30, because they weren’t secure enough.

      Far better to use Thunderbird outside the corporate and enterprise world.  And it is close enough to Outlook in the way that it works for everyday use that people are not flummoxed.

      3 users thanked author for this post.
    • #2474002

      it broke connections with AOL POP accounts

      It’s been a while since I used POP, but some settings in Thunderbird may have gotten reset with the newer version. You may want to check that you are using these settings for AOL:

      https://www.lifewire.com/what-are-aol-mail-pop3-settings-1170848

      What Are the POP Settings for AOL Mail?

      When you want to connect with your AOL Mail account via POP from another email program, provide the following requested information:

      AOL Mail POP3 server address: pop.aol.com
      AOL Mail POP username: Your AOL Mail screen name (for example, if your address is me@aol.com, your screen name is “me”)
      AOL Mail POP password: Your AOL Mail password
      AOL Mail POP port: 995
      AOL Mail POP TLS/SSL required: yes

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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      • #2474025

        Not everyone using AOL has “AOL” servers allocated. I use AOL, but have “Verizon” servers, because AOL used to be part of Verizon. So: for historical reasons.

        If the person now asking about this happened to be one AOL user that was before a Verizon user (the email is still also probably of the form “xxx@verizon.net”) then the following screenshot of my  Account setup might be useful as a guide of how to set things up.
        It might look different in  newer version of Thunderbird than mine, but I doubt it will be essentially different:

        Server-settings-for-Verizon

        Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

        MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
        Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
        macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

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    • #2474049

      Thanks,I’ll try this but the issue is I have several old “verizon” email access that have been working through thunderbird and AOL for years until third updated to 102.2. Another computer with v91 still works fine.  And I getting an error when trying to roll back third. Apparently they’ve modified the storage and it won’t work with older versions. BAD tbird!

    • #2474786
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    • #2475151

      So the fix for me was to completely uninstall 102.2 and re-install 91.3. Lucky IO have an up to date backup of all me email files. I backup religiously!

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2475210

      Probably the very last thing one needs or wants to have is trouble with one’s email client.

      TB excels in bringing frequent, unexpected and unearned emotion to one’s life, otherwise perhaps more quiet than one deserves?

      Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

      MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
      Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
      macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2478266

      What do you gain by using Thunderbird to access and manage your e-mail versus using Firefox and its ad blocking extension(s) for going directly to the provider’s e-mail URL to access and manage your e-mail from there? I have only 1 e-mail account.

      • #2478271

        Using a browser to view e-mail leaves the e-mail stored on the provider’s server on the Internet.

        Using a third-party email programs allows the download and storage of the e-mail locally on the PC. The email program is simply the “gofor” to get the email from the Internet to the PC.

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      • #2480051

        And it is a nasty annoying interface on the web.

        🍻

        Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
    • #2478298

      Using a browser to view e-mail leaves the e-mail stored on the provider’s server on the Internet.

      Using a third-party email programs allows the download and storage of the e-mail locally on the PC. The email program is simply the “gofor” to get the email from the Internet to the PC.

      I find this method most useful! I can always access my email from my provider via any mobile device or web browser.

      I use Thunderbird on my PC to archive a local copy of all of my email, sent & received.

      Since I am now using only IMAP, my email account remains in sync across all of my devices, including sent messages and status of read messages.

      The thing that bugged me the most about using POP/SMTP as I grew more “connected” was that if I sent an email from a web browser or mobile device, my PC email client never saw it.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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      • #2478324

        The thing that bugged me the most about using POP/SMTP as I grew more “connected” was that if I sent an email from a web browser or mobile device, my PC email client never saw it.

        Maybe it was getting caught in the service’s spam filter?

        I bring up this possibility because, when I send a text message to my Verizon.net personal email account, it always gets intercepted by Verizon/AOL spam filter and my email client never sees it. But if I send the exact same text to my business email account (which goes through Fastmail), it always gets through to my email client, never gets intercepted.

        So it may be a function of your email provider.

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        • #2478354

          The thing that bugged me the most about using POP/SMTP as I grew more “connected” was that if I sent an email from a web browser or mobile device, my PC email client never saw it.

          Maybe it was getting caught in the service’s spam filter?

          I bring up this possibility because, when I send a text message to my Verizon.net personal email account, it always gets intercepted by Verizon/AOL spam filter and my email client never sees it. But if I send the exact same text to my business email account (which goes through Fastmail), it always gets through to my email client, never gets intercepted.

          So it may be a function of your email provider.

          Thanks for your observation, but that was nearly 10 years ago, and I have since switched providers, email programs, and protocols from POP to IMAP. Having no issues with email now, and I would never go back to POP.

          My provider at that time was Earthlink. Whenever I signed into Earthlink webmail from a browser on my laptop and sent an email, my POP email inbox on my PC email client (Outlook Express) only showed my incoming mailbox. It didn’t download my “Sent” mail box from the web client, even though it was the same account. I could log back on to the webmail and see the “Sent” folder, but it wasn’t viewable on my PC email client. And anything that I sent from my PC email client wasn’t viewable on the webmail.

          I prefer the way that IMAP keeps all folders always in sync across devices and clients.

          Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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          • #2478381

            I agree and have switched to imap also (mostly). At first I was concerned about accessing saved Mail folders when off line but hasn’t seemed to be an issue so far.

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    • #2478398

      I agree and have switched to imap also (mostly). At first I was concerned about accessing saved Mail folders when off line but hasn’t seemed to be an issue so far.

      Once it’s on my local PC it stays there until I delete it. I can also move emails that I want to archive into a non-synced local archive folder in Thunderbird, before I delete any from the synced folder at my provider.

      But that’s a once in a while thing here, since my provider allows GBs of storage.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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      • #2478474

        a non-synced local archive folder in Thunderbird,

        Can you tell me more about this? you can create folders in Thunderbird that are Thunderbird folders only and once created, you treat them as archive folders in Thunderbird? and as a folder in Thunderbird, it means that Thunderbird knows about it, but your PC does not overtly know about it (only knows about it by virtue of the fact your PC knows what Thunderbird has in it, i.e., perhaps the folder is in AppData somewhere)? and your provider e-mail does not know about it (after you delete it there)? Trying to get a handle on this.

        • #2478504

          Can you tell me more about this?

          John is referring to Thunderbird’s “Local Folders”, which you’ll find in TB’s Account Settings. You can add subfolders and change the name and location as you wish — I’ve renamed mine to “Archive” and moved it to a different disk and folder. That way, if you want to keep an email for posterity but don’t want to leave it on the provider’s server, simply drag-and-drop it from the IMAP folder to a local folder.

          Note that by default, TB offers to “archive” emails within a subfolder per each email account, which is not how I like to organize things long term. Using a local folder effectively decouples archived emails from the email account they were originally associated with.

          Note that if you wish, you can have more than one “local folders” location by installing the “Local Folders” add-on. This screenshot shows an example:

           

          tbird-local-folders

           

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          • #2478787

            John is referring to Thunderbird’s “Local Folders”, which you’ll find in TB’s Account Settings. You can add subfolders and change the name and location as you wish — I’ve renamed mine to “Archive” and moved it to a different disk and folder.

            I am brand new to Thunderbird. Thanks very much for this explanation and the screenshot. I am going to have to read as much as I can in Mozilla Help to get a good footing before I start working with local folders. But, this is going to be useful when I get up-to-speed.

            As an aside, how do you get the rounded tabs? Is that a function of the edition of Thunderbird you are using? Or is there something like a FF about:preference that will make the tabs look like this? I am using the latest Thunderbird edition 102.2.2

    • #2478420

      The usefulness of POP vs IMAP depends on what one does about communicating with the rest of the world and on how much one trusts one’s personal correspondence to others in times when massive server breaches with millions of users affected are getting more frequent all the time – and also worthy of a Beetle’s song.

      I am sticking with POP, because I neither text to others (although I receive texts when necessary) nor do I email with a browser. Or, generally speaking, use my not-smart cellphone for anything other than making voice calls. The reason that I switched from IMAP, the default one with AOL, these days my email service provider (is there a recognizable acronym for this?), the one that I’ve inherited from Verizon, that is still my ISP, was that I wish to keep all my emails in my laptop and not in someone elses’ computer, or server, not trusting they’ll stay safely private there.

      I also have a secondary Gmail account mainly for getting calls oddly blacklisted by my primary provider and then reflected from there to my primary AOL account (that seems to have a serious case of xenophobia, because those blacklisted are always the ones sent to me from abroad) that has IMAP servers, so my secondary account keeps in the Gmail server the emails received and reflected to my AOL account, copies that I delete by hand from my Gmail account now and then. Yes, I do.

      So what happens if my computer crashes and burns? Well, what happens if I have a fatal heart attack? What should be my plan for that? OK, I can make backups of the data in the SSD to an external drive, and so do I.

      There is no back up plan for matters of the heart.

      Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

      MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
      Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
      macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2478470

        also worthy of a Beetle’s song

        You write that you stick to POP email, having switched from IMAP.

        But GMail offers POP too, though for GMail you go through IMAP. Why do you do that?

        BTW. I have googled for its meaning, because at first I was thinking it was like the expressions “the bee’s knees” or “ants in your pants“. But Google nor Bing gave me an explanation of “a Beetle’s song“.
        Can I conclude it’s a typo?

        1 Desktop W11
        1 Laptop W10
        Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
    • #2478423

      The usefulness of POP vs IMAP depends on what one does about communicating with the rest of the world and on how much one trusts one’s personal correspondence to others in times when massive server breaches with millions of users affected are getting more frequent all the time

      You do realize that POP still depends on your provider’s server, right?

      The distinction is in the protocol used. With IMAP it’s totally up to you whether you leave email on the server or delete it. Using Thunderbird or another client of choice you can archive your email locally, then delete it from the server.

      https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/office/what-is-the-difference-between-pop-and-imap-85c0e47f-931d-4035-b409-af3318b194a8

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2478425

        JohnW: “You do realize that POP still depends on your provider’s server, right?

        Absolutely. I left that out because I forgot to include it. Thanks for the reminder.

        Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

        MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
        Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
        macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

      • #2480054

        not really I store all my mail on my computer with a POP account.

        🍻

        Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
        • #2480063

          Wavy “I store all my mail on my computer with a POP account.

          So do I, but, as far as I understand this, JohnW is right: when using POP, some providers do not keep your email in servers, some do. Regardless, you can always keep automatically, without even trying, your emails in your computer alone, or as well. With IMAP all providers, yours included if this were the case, keep your emails in their incoming server, because that is how IMAP is meant to work. What shows up in your Inbox folder is what is in the server. You can keep a copy of your emails in your computer only if you copy them from the Inbox to another client’s folder to archive them there.

          If the incoming emails accumulated there, perhaps over the years, for whatever reason are deleted from the IMAP server and you have not copied them to a folder in your client, in your computer, then they are gone gone, gone.

          Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

          MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
          Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
          macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

          1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2478429

      https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/pop-vs-imap/

      POP vs. IMAP: What’s Right for Me?

      In almost every case, we recommend IMAP over POP today. There’s a good chance that you’ll want to access your email from at least two devices, and doing so with POP is a huge headache. Since every email service worth its salt supports both, there are no compatibility concerns.

      However, if you’re still not sure, below are a few points to help you decide whether to use IMAP or POP:

      Choose POP if:

      You only access your mail from a single device, and never plan to access it from another.
      You need constant access to all your email.
      Your don’t have a consistent connection to the internet.
      You have limited server storage.

      Choose IMAP if:

      You want to access your email from multiple devices.
      You have a reliable and constant internet connection.
      You want to receive a quick overview of new emails or emails on the server.
      Your local storage space is limited.
      You are worried about backing your emails up.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      4 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2478471

        POP vs. IMAP: What’s Right for Me?

        I DO NOT like nor want my computer, tablet and smartphone synchronised. I use totally separate email accounts on each device. If I want a particular mail to be on more than one device, I forward it.

        POP is still my way to go.

        1 Desktop W11
        1 Laptop W10
        Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
        4 users thanked author for this post.
    • #2478664

      Can you tell me more about this? you can create folders in Thunderbird that are Thunderbird folders only and once created, you treat them as archive folders in Thunderbird?

      dg1261 explained this better than I could have! I set this up years ago, and barely remember the step by step details, but it wasn’t that difficult. I even set up “Local Folders” to hold my archives from my previous email provider accounts that I had discontinued. I can access those “archived” emails whenever I wish from Thunderbird.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

    • #2478717

      Hello,

      This discussion about Thunderbird is very interesting to me as I run TB v 102.2.1 on one laptop and a sightly earlier version on the other laptop. I have a few questions about IMAP, POP and accessing/keeping email on both laptops (soon to be a third) from two different “sources.” I get email from my local ISP, as well as from several Gmail accounts. I want to be able to download all of the mail – I have TB configured into various mailboxes and accounts – onto any computer that accesses it, and not have it deleted anywhere. I am using POP for all of this in each account, but now wonder if IMAP might be what I really need for the gmail accounts – the ISP needs to be POP.

      When I first tried to set this scenario up, I found that the issue was that once any TB account polled gmail for new mail – that mail would not download onto the other computer. It was not deleted at gmail, but Thunderbird would only download it once. I am now wondering if it may be different if I set those to IMAP.

      So I guess my basic question is how to be able to download all of the emails into the mailboxes on both laptops, and also keep all of the gmail on the server. (I do manually delete the local ISP mail each day after it has been downloaded where I want it since there is a very small limit on the size of what can be kept there).

      Can I –

      1. Keep POP for my local ISP and use IMAP for the gmail accounts at the same time?
      2. Set up gmail IMAP to download to each laptop without deleting any?
      3. Using IMAP, if I do delete anything from TB, will it also delete it from the gmail account online? And vice versa – if I delete it on the gmail server, will it also delete it from TB? Will it still show in the deleted folders?
      4. If I move mail from an archive folder – or from a local folder – on TB – how will that affect it being visible on gmail?
      5. My husband generally uses one of the laptops and he will delete different emails than I do on mine, but I want to be able to have all of them visible – so is IMAP a possible solution?
      6. Or is this just not possible?

      I am a bit of an email packrat – and I want to be able to have all of it downloaded on both computers and nothing deleted anywhere till I delete it myself.

      I’m sure this is asking for something that may not be possible – but the discussion of how IMAP works got me thinking that it may be a way to accomplish my goal.

      Thanks for the help – I’ll be happy to test a few ideas or answer any questions.

      And as a side note:

      Note that if you wish, you can have more than one “local folders” location by installing the “Local Folders” add-on.

      I tried to download this add on and it doesn’t seem to work. I can download it, but it won’t install – this download file: localfolders-3.3.0-tb.xpi – won’t open. Any hints on how to get it working? Thanks!

       

      • #2478726

        Most recent Mozilla Thunderbird is 102.2.2, check your updater as there a quite a few fixes relative to email handling and authentication: 102.2.2 Thuinderbird Release notes

        Keeping IT Lean, Clean and Mean!
        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #2478752

          Thanks! I will do that update – but not sure that will affect the inability to download the same email from gmail twice onto different laptops.

          But I wondered if being on 102.2.1 is the reason I can’t install that LocalFolders add on. It says it is for versions 91-102 – and it worked fine on my other laptop – which is still on a 91.x version. Maybe 102 means 102 – not 102.x.x?

    • #2478819

      Can I –

      1. Keep POP for my local ISP and use IMAP for the gmail accounts at the same time?
      2. Set up gmail IMAP to download to each laptop without deleting any?
      3. Using IMAP, if I do delete anything from TB, will it also delete it from the gmail account online? And vice versa – if I delete it on the gmail server, will it also delete it from TB? Will it still show in the deleted folders?
      4. If I move mail from an archive folder – or from a local folder – on TB – how will that affect it being visible on gmail?
      5. My husband generally uses one of the laptops and he will delete different emails than I do on mine, but I want to be able to have all of them visible – so is IMAP a possible solution?
      6. Or is this just not possible?

      I will attempt to answer, to the best of my knowledge… 😉

      1. Yes, each email account you set up in Thunderbird has its own server and protocol settings. So one account could be POP, and another account could be IMAP. As long as the accounts were set up the same on all devices accessing each particular email account. You couldn’t mix protocols on the same email  account.

      2. By default, IMAP keeps the email on the server. That’s where the folders actually live. The synchronized IMAP folders on your local Thunderbird installation are actually just representations of those provider folders on the server. Thunderbird can download the emails locally for offline viewing.

      3. If you delete an email from TB, it gets moved to the trash folder which is synchronized across all devices using that account including the main Gmail account. And vice versa. Same for the marked as “read” status, everything is in sync. The advantage (for some) of IMAP! With IMAP you don’t need to “Get Messages” either. This happens automatically.

      4. What happens in your local folders stays with your local folders.

      5. IMO, multiple users sharing the same email account is not going to work very well using IMAP.

      6. So all possible, except probably #5, unless you don’t delete any emails. The marked as “read” status could still be quite confusing though, because as soon as your husband opened an email, it would show as “read” on your device.

      Note:

      Delete or recover deleted Gmail messages

      When you delete a message, it stays in your trash for 30 days. After that time, it will be permanently deleted from your account and can’t be recovered.

       

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2479069

        Hi John and thanks for the detailed reply! I appreciate the information!

        I guess it may not really be able to be worked out as I hoped, due to the fact that there are two of us who randomly download and delete email on 2 different laptops, and once I get the new one, it will probably make it even more confusing. My local ISP works so easily and will download email to any number of computers, and all will stay on their server till I delete it – and that is why I thought it would work the same way with TB – but it unfortunately doesn’t. The drawback – or maybe a good thing given my propensity to hoard emails – is that they have a strict limit of about 20 MB of storage – so I do need to go in and delete email from there on a regular basis – and if someone sends something “big” I have to get it downloaded and deleted before the mailbox gets full and we don’t get any.

        I am thinking that maybe once I get the new laptop, I may try to set up one gmail mailbox in TB on both of “my” laptops and play around with it. I have one sort of “throw away” address that I can experiment with and give the IMAP thing a try. But, as you said – with two users, it may be more complicated.

        Thanks again for the help! Much appreciated.

        Have a good weekend!

        • #2479077

          In TB, each user can change the settings to “leave a copy of the message on the server.” That way the email will be available to any number of PCs.

          Incoming mail for each User on all computers, look under Account Settings\(email address)\Server Settings (Under Tools on Win, Under Thunderbird\Account Settings on Mac)

          You can leave a copy on the server (forever or choose the number of days or till you delete it). There are a lot of other settings there as well.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2479086

            Yes, that seems like it should be the likely answer. But, I do have all of my Gmail accounts set to leave messages on server, and all of the TB mailboxes set the same way. It isn’t that any given email downloads and then is removed from the gmail server – or is even marked as “read” if it is just downloaded through TB. It is just a case of when the next computer polls for email, it will only download what hasn’t been downloaded on the first one. Neither can download all of them it seems.

            I think it may be something with that popstate.dat file that PaulK mentioned back in June. I never pursued that option as it seemed to involve all email being redownloaded somehow?

            In any case – I may just give the multiple mailbox/laptop thing another try and be very sure that everywhere is marked to leave mail on server. Will let you know if I have a chance to get to it today!

            Thanks again!

            • #2479094

              Went thru this with my Uncle and the catch is, if the email account on even one PC is set to “not leave messages” on the mail server, the exact symptom you described happens.

              The problem is, when that particular PC checks for mail and retrieves any “new messages“, they get removed from the remote mail server because it wasn’t told to leave them in-place.

              So, when the next PC checks for new messages, there aren’t any to retrieve!

              4 users thanked author for this post.
            • #2479119

              OK – I tried a test of getting email to download on two different laptops – and no joy!

              I have TB set up with the same mailbox addresses on both computers. Both are POP and are set to Leave Messages on Server. Gmail is also set up to “Keep Gmail’s copy in the mailbox” – I don’t actually see a place to “keep messages on server” in the online gmail settings.

              I sent 6 emails to that address from various other accounts from both laptops. All were delivered to the gmail server and are unread there.

              I then polled for email from Computer A. All were delivered – and on the gmail server, they all remained visible and unread.

              Next I polled for those messages from Computer B. It said “No New Messages” and didn’t download any. All were still showing as unread on the gmail server.

              Also tried it the other way – sent a different email, polled from Computer B first, then Computer A – same thing – only downloaded onto the first one to poll.

              So – I can’t get the same message on both computers – it is only downloaded once to the first one that polls for it.

              Went thru this with my Uncle and the catch is, if the email account on even one PC is set to “not leave messages” on the mail server, the exact symptom you described happens. The problem is, when that particular PC checks for mail and retrieves any “new messages“, they get removed from the remote mail server because it wasn’t told to leave them in-place. So, when the next PC checks for new messages, there aren’t any to retrieve!

              Thanks. Is your set up POP or IMAP? Mine is POP. I have the gmail mailbox on the gmail site set to “2. When messages are accessed with POP keep Gmail’s copy in the mailbox”. None of the messages on the gmail server are removed or even marked as read after the first polling – they stay there till I delete them and aren’t marked as read until I read them there on the gmail server.

              I don’t see anywhere else to check to be sure that all of the mail is visible and downloadable. I’d be happy to check anywhere else or try whatever settings you have found successful.

              So – that’s where I am at this point. It may well be a case of that popstate.dat file mentioned in a post above – something with “recent” mail. Or possibly IMAP would solve this – but I need to set it up that way to try that when I get a chance.

              In any case – I’m not sure if there is another way to accomplish what I am trying to do – but I do appreciate all of the suggestions and comments.

              Thanks again – and any other thoughts or ideas are welcome!

          • #2479181

            In TB, each user can change the settings to “leave a copy of the message on the server.” That way the email will be available to any number of PCs. ff.

            I am Win10/Pro 21H2. I am new to TB and I’ve been reading the posts here to help me get my settings right.
            TB is 102.2.2. I want to leave a copy of the message on the server, even after it is read or downloaded. First off, I see no ‘Account Settings’ under Tools. See 1st attachment.

            However, I find ‘Account Settings’ under the Hamburger/menu. See 2nd attachment.

            But, under ‘Account Settings’ > Server Settings, I see no “leave a copy of the message on the server.” The Advanced button doesn’t have anything like that either. I want messages to be available to any number of PCs and to be available after reading or downloading. Are the settings here going to do that?? See 3rd attachment.

            • #2479187

              I want messages to be available to any number of PCs and to be available after reading or downloading. Are the settings here going to do that??

              As I am finding in my post above #2479119, with POP, there doesn’t seem to be a way to do that. Perhaps IMAP is different?

              I have everything set to leave a copy on server, but only the first computer to try to poll for email will actually be able to download new email. Once that happens, any other computers that attempt to download the same mail won’t get those previously downloaded messages.

              In your screenshot, in IMAP there doesn’t look like that setting “leave a copy of mail on server” is available, so that may also not allow messages to be retrieved on several computers.

              If anyone has found a way to actually do that – I’d love to see your settings and see what I’ve missed.

            • #2479194

              That “leave email on server” setting is only available for POP accounts. For IMAP users all mail is automatically left on the server, until manually deleted. Then it’s gone for all devices. Gmail has 30 day retention/recovery for trash, don’t know about other providers.

              Windows 10 Pro 22H2

              1 user thanked author for this post.
            • #2479199

              But, under ‘Account Settings’ > Server Settings, I see no “leave a copy of the message on the server.”

              Your screen shot shows you’re using an IMAP account and, as @JohnW pointed out, the “leave messages on server” option is only available for POP accounts.

              As I am finding in my post above #2479119, with POP, there doesn’t seem to be a way to do that.

              The setting is on the “Server Settings” tab in TB.

              In Outlook, it’s located on the “Internet E-mail Settings” tab.

              For Outlook 2010+ Select File > Info > Account settings > Account settings.
              Note: For Outlook 2007 or earlier, use Tools > Account Settings)

              On the “Account settings” window, highlight your account and click Change.

              On the “Change Account” window, click the More settings … button on the right.

              On the “Internet E-mail Settings” window, select the Advanced tab.

              1 user thanked author for this post.
            • #2479203

              As I am finding in my post above #2479119, with POP, there doesn’t seem to be a way to do that.

              Guess I should have said “As I am finding in my post above #2479119, with POP, there doesn’t seem to be a way to have two computers get the same email from the gmail server.

              I do have TB set to leave messages on the server as you indicated. My “that” meant…

              I want messages to be available to any number of PCs…

              …what WCHS said.

              Sorry I wasn’t clear.

            • #2479209

              My understanding is that you have the correct option setup to leave mail on the server in your Thunderbird POP account settings, but your PC #2 computer is not seeing the “new” emails on the server after your PC #1 has downloaded them.

              I used to have POP for my ISP email, and it was setup to leave the email on the server. Whenever I logged into the same account via webmail from my other PC #2, the messages were all still there even after I had downloaded them with PC #1.

              I never tried using email clients on both computers though. I just used the client on PC #1 as my local email storage, and webmail elsewhere. But I would think that should work.

              Windows 10 Pro 22H2

              1 user thanked author for this post.
            • #2479215

              I never tried using email clients on both computers though. I just used the client on PC #1 as my local email storage, and webmail elsewhere. But I would think that should work.

              Yes, you would think it should work, and that is just how my local ISP works. But for whatever reason, it doesn’t with gmail.

              I tried changing the password security – somewhere I read that it might work with a less secure password setting – but no luck. But now that I am thinking about it – my ISP allows “password transmitted insecurely” – maybe that’s why that one works and the gmail that need OAuth2 doesn’t.

              I did also post in the Mozilla forum and they said: “To have gmail POP accounts download to multiple computers, you must enable recent mode…”

              If you’re using the same Gmail POP account with multiple email clients you need to enable recent mode in order to let each email client access all of the messages in that account. You can do that by replacing username@gmail.com with recent:username@gmail.com as the username in Tools -> Account Settings -> Server Settings.

              I haven’t tried that yet – I may just wait till I get my new laptop and then I can experiment between “my” two laptops and not involve my husband’s till I know what works. I know there was some discussion about that earlier in another thread about the “recent” setting causing all email to download – not just what was new – more to figure out!

              Thanks!

            • #2479248

              In your screenshot (i.e., in the screenshot of WCHS at post #2479181), in IMAP there doesn’t look like that setting “leave a copy of mail on server” is available, so that may also not allow messages to be retrieved on several computers.

              I may just wait till I get my new laptop and then I can experiment between “my” two laptops

              I have just started setting up TB on one of my laptops. I intend to set up the server settings in the same way on my other laptop tonight, i.e., using IMAP. I haven’t begun to venture into Local Folders yet.

              My ISP provider is a baby bell of ATT – bellsouth.net. But, ATT contracts with Yahoo for e-mail service. ATT uses IMAP, so that is why you see imap.mail.yahoo.com in the incoming server settings and bellsouth.net in the provider-supplied e-mail address. (I had to scour the web to find out what the server settings should be. I eventually found them in an ATT Community Forum, including the OAuth2 authentication setting. I still have to figure out how to set up TB so that it can locate the ATT/Yahoo calender and the ATT/Yahoo contacts, though.)

              I am expecting that when the two laptops are set up the same way (with IMAP) that my e-mail will be available to TB on the two laptops and will continue to be available in both TB and the provider e-mail, even after reading or downloading.

              1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #2480356

          Get another account and forward ALL mail to the second. (and also the reverse as that will surely be used as a destination)

          🍻

          Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
    • #2478868

      I tried to download (the “Local Folders”) add on and it doesn’t seem to work. I can download it, but it won’t install – this download file: localfolders-3.3.0-tb.xpi – won’t open. Any hints on how to get it working?

      I just tested by clean installing Thunderbird 102.2.2 in a VM, and had no problem. I clicked the hamburger icon in Thunderbird’s upper right corner, selected Add-ons, and drag-and-dropped the localfolders-3.3.0-tb.xpi file into the Extensions window. It prompted me to confirm, then successfully completed the installion. After that, I was able to add multiple local folders from Account Settings -> Account Actions -> Add Local Folder.

      If it worked fine on your other laptop, that implies your .xpi download is good so re-downloading won’t help. I wonder if something got corrupted in your Thunderbird configuration that’s preventing the add-ons function from working properly.

      2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2479057

        Thanks for the reply. I did try to get that extension using Chrome and it seems to have worked. I could drag it into TB and it did install – though I now have to say that I can’t seem to figure out how it actually works – LOL! Thanks for the help!

    • #2478884

      News break: Neither Outlook nor Thunderbird are greatest ever email clients, in my opinion.

      Why TB? I given my reasons in several occasions, here and in other threads, no need to repeat that. I use it because is one way to use POP. Or rather I tried it, and now I’m stuck with it, because the last thing I want to do is to fool around with things that have to do with my email. Yes, I can copy all my sent and received ones to another directory and away from TB, but then I’ll get a bunch of files without the metadata that tell me who sent it, when, what it was about.

      Outlook? It’s too much for me, and it’s MS.

      Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

      MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
      Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
      macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

    • #2478900

      News break: Neither Outlook nor Thunderbird are greatest ever email clients, in my opinion.

      Why TB? I given my reasons in several occasions, here and in other threads, no need to repeat that. I use it because is one way to use POP. Or rather I tried it, and now I’m stuck with it, because the last thing I want to do is to fool around with things that have to do with my email. Yes, I can copy all my sent and received ones to another directory and away from TB, but then I’ll get a bunch of files without the metadata that tell me who sent it, when, what it was about.

      Outlook? It’s too much for me, and it’s MS.

      But if you copy the emails to a local folder in TB your metadata is preserved.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      • #2478924

        JonW: “But if you copy the emails to a local folder in TB your metadata is preserved.

        John, I know you are trying to help and I appreciate that.

        Your advice is to put the emails in a local folder in TB.

        But I would like to get rid of TB. Or at least to ignore it, have nothing more to do with it, if it remains in the Mac, not to keep going back to it to see the old emails. So, if I went to the trouble of moving to another client, I would have to move, or copy all the mails to it from TB, without blowing up the Mac, sending out an EMP that fries the electronics of GPS satellites, or much worse: wiping out all my emails instead of transferring them. Because accidents happen and this is TB we are considering here.

        Besides that, I would be inclined to consider it a dubious undertaking to switch to another client that some people like and like to recommend. I switched to TB because so many people were saying how good it was and how happy they were with it.

        And now here I am.

        I don’t mind to make such changes with most other things and risk coming out a cropper, but my emails, old and new, are too important to me for that. So I guess am stuck with TB. None of the problems it has created, at least so far, have been and are fatal, just very annoying.

        So better the devil I know … Sigh!

        Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

        MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
        Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
        macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

        • #2478945

          So I guess am stuck with TB

          I beg to differ.
          When you copy an email (from Microsoft Outlook, Apple Mail, or Mozilla Thunderbird) to any folder of your choice OUTSIDE your email client, it gets the extension  .eml (unless you interfere). It is readable to most, if not all, email applications, because:

          Because of its wide adoption among email clients, EML has become one of the most common email message formats.

          Quote from https://fileinfo.com/extension/eml  , but go ahead and read all of it.

          And copying from TB to any outside folder is trivial: drag and drop one, or several messages simultaneously. Mind you: they are copied, not moved, so nothing in TB gets lost.

          And you can just as easily drag & drop any single or multiple eml-file(s) back into a TB internal folder.

          1 Desktop W11
          1 Laptop W10
          Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
          • #2478990

            The extension go the file name, yes. But that is not the metadata.

            Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

            MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
            Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
            macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

            • #2479040

              The extension go the file name, yes. But that is not the metadata.

              If the header of the message contains the metadata, then the metadata go along when copying the message to an eml-file.

              In TB highlight a message, then click [View] and then click [Message Source]. Doesn’t the header show the metadata you want?

              1 Desktop W11
              1 Laptop W10
              Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
            • #2479138

              That’s a good point! Email uses a standardized text based file format, with any relevant “metadata” written to the “.eml” file header.

              That’s the reason it can be opened in any host email application, somewhat similar to the way an HTML file can be opened in any web browser.

              In both cases the files are text based formats that are “rendered” for viewing in your local client application. But the files themselves are portable.

               

              Windows 10 Pro 22H2

        • #2480359

          Oscar forgive my poor memory but what is it you find troublesome about TB?
          I have an older version (68?) but find it wonderful.

          🍻

          Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
    • #2478946

      I don’t mind to make such changes with most other things and risk coming out a cropper, but my emails, old and new, are too important to me for that.


      @OscarCP
      , I totally understand your concern! I shudder even to think what would happen if suddenly all my emails disappeared.

      Here are a couple of hopeful ideas. If you want to try a different email client but fear losing your old emails, then so long as you make backups (I prefer full disk image backups), you should be OK when trying out a new client: even if it messes up and your emails get lost or scrambled, you’ll have the backup to rescue you.

      Also, if you want to try a new client, it shouldn’t be necessary to risk losing everything when transferring the inbox etc. to the new client; typically, there will be an “export” function on the old client (and/or an “import” function on the new one) that should let you  copy everything without erasing the old files or losing the metadata.

       

      2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #2479067

      When I first tried to set this scenario up, I found that the issue was that once any TB account polled gmail for new mail – that mail would not download onto the other computer.

      I have been using Thunderbird for many years. I have it set up on my home computer and the portable version on a USB drive to use at work. Both are POP. I have no problem with it downloading all new emails on each instance, so it’s certainly possible under POP.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2479074

        Thanks for that. I’m wondering if it is some setting that I may be missing, but I don’t think so.

        I had asked this question back in June when I first thought I had it figured out, and the advice was that TB adds a line in the popstate.dat file that marks an email as read and it won’t be “re-downloaded” again on a different computer. Something to do with “recent mode”? Here are two help postings about it: Multiple Computers and syncing email on two computers.

        This from PaulK, who is well versed in TB:

        In Thunderbird: POP (for sure; I don’t use IMAP so cannot assert this, but I think that it also is true (perhaps someone can confirm this)); and ‘Leave messages on server’ is checked; and an email is read in — there is added to the file popstate.dat a line that uniquely identifies that email. When a user subsequently does a Get Messages, TB checks the popstate file to see if the download-candidate email already has been read/downloaded. TB will not re-download from the server a previously-read-in email. This is a Thunderbird function, independent of an email source.

        Maybe it has to do with the portable version having a different capability?

        I will keep working on it – would be great if I could get it to work as I want.

        Thanks again!

        • #2480369

          I have both TB with POP3 and macOS “Mail” with IMAP, as preferred by the email provider, AOL, in my Mac.

          I don’t know about the rest of what PaulK mentions in his comment, but what I can tell you is that new messages show up in both mail boxes, but if one sets the POP3 in TB to “keep mail in server for x days”, the AOL IMAP mails disappear on day x+1. The ones in TB remain there.

          Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

          MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
          Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
          macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

      • #2480363

        I have no problem with it downloading all new emails on each instance, so it’s certainly possible under POP.

        works the same for me

        🍻

        Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
    • #2479176

      That’s a good point! Email uses a standardized text based file format, with any relevant “metadata” written to the “.eml” file header.

      That’s the reason it can be opened in any host email application, somewhat similar to the way an HTML file can be opened in any web browser.

      In both cases the files are text based formats that are “rendered” for viewing in your local client application. But the files themselves are portable.

       

      And I will add that the email file storage location & method used by any given email application can vary from another. That is why the steps of migrating your existing local email collection to another application can be tricky, and researching the details of the export/import process for your situation is important before you attempt it!

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2479192

      But, under ‘Account Settings’ > Server Settings, I see no “leave a copy of the message on the server.” The Advanced button doesn’t have anything like that either. I want messages to be available to any number of PCs and to be available after reading or downloading. Are the settings here going to do that?? See 3rd attachment.

      Your 3rd attachment shows that you are using IMAP. You won’t have that option with IMAP, as all mail is automatically kept on the server until you delete it. You can verify this by reading your email in Thunderbird, then log into your email via webmail or some other way. Your email will still be available for any device connected to that account.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2479259

      I am expecting that when the two laptops are set up the same way (with IMAP) that my e-mail will be available to TB on the two laptops and will continue to be available in both TB and the provider e-mail, even after reading or downloading.

      Good luck! Please do post back with your progress – I’ll be interested to see how it all works!

      • #2479729

        Good luck! Please do post back with your progress – I’ll be interested to see how it all works!

        I now have TB set up on two laptops. On each machine, TB accesses my e-mail on my bellsouth e-mail account with IMAP specified for the incoming server and STMP specified for the outgoing server.

        I sent two e-mails from another e-mail program that I use occasionally. It is not tied to TB (or anyother e-mail program) in any way.

        The results are as John W describes <here>.

        I opened email #1 on TB Laptop 1. I replied to it, using TB on Laptop 1. The reply was filed away in TB’s ‘sent’ folder on Laptop 1, on Laptop 2, and in bellsouth’s ‘sent’ folder. The independent e-mail account received the reply.

        I opened e-mail #2 on TB Laptop 2. I replied to it, using TB on Laptop 2. The same thing happened with the reply to e-mail #2 on Laptop 2 as happened with the reply to e-mail #1 on Laptop 1. The reply is in the 3 ‘sent’ folders. The independent e-mail account received the reply.

        I downloaded e-mail #1 to Laptop 1 and downloaded e-mail #2 to Laptop 2. Even though downloaded, both e-mails show up in the TB inbox of Laptop 1, the TB inbox on Laptop 2, and the bellsouth account.

        I deleted e-mail #1 in the TB inbox of Laptop 1. TB Laptop 2 and the bellsouth account no longer have the e-mail in their respective inboxes either. After deletion, it appeared in the Trash folder of Laptop 1, Laptop2, and bellsouth.

        So, in sum, all folders on Laptop 1 and Laptop 2 are identical and they match the folders that are in bellsouth. The bellsouth account is the master and the two TB accounts on the two laptops go by what the master says. The two laptops are set up the same way (with IMAP). In a nutshell, my e-mail is available to TB on the two laptops and continues to be available in both TB and the bellsouth account, even after reading or downloading it.

        I haven’t tried moving e-mail to a ‘local folder’. I don’t know yet whether a move will be specific to a local folder on a specific laptop, or whether both laptops will show the moved e-mail in the local folder. I haven’t set up my own local folder, so right now, ‘Move to’ > Local folder will only move it Trash. I am guessing that you can either a) set up a local folder so that it is specific to Laptop 1 (having been set up on Laptop 1) and specific to Laptop 2 (having been set up on Laptop 2), or b) you can set up a local folder so that it is local to bellsouth (the master), in which case either laptop can find it there, when moved that bellsouth local folder. In this case, it would be like bellsouth’s Archive folder, which both Laptop 1 and Laptop 2 can access.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2479876

      In a nutshell, my e-mail is available to TB on the two laptops and continues to be available in both TB and the bellsouth account, even after reading or downloading it.

      Thanks so much for posting your results! Glad you got it all set up the way you hoped to.

      After reading through your steps and tests, I think I may see where mine is different and thus, not working. I have a local ISP – similar to your bellsouth (but without as many online features and a strict limit of 20 MB so I have to delete most of the mail each day after it is downloaded where I want it) – and that works just as you described with TB. It is set up as POP and I can download all mail from that to both of my laptops and it remains on the ISP server till I delete it there.

      I think the issue is with gmail and maybe it is in the need to have TB send the gmail password as OAuth2 – my ISP is set to just password transmitted insecurely. With gmail, it will only download once as I described earlier – it will stay on the gmail server, and not be marked as read, but it won’t download again.

      It may also be something to do with setting it to “recent” in the TB account settings, but my understanding is that doing that will cause it to download something like 30 days of mail at a time? More experimentation is needed there.

      I am now thinking that I may see what happens if I set up my new laptop when I get it to use a different email client – maybe just the Mail program it comes with and see if I can use TB on one and Mail on the other and see how that affects the downloads.

      Another issue that I think using IMAP will create as JohnW pointed out – two people are accessing the mail and downloading and then deleting some within TB. If that translates to also deleting it on the gmail server – then we will possibly be missing mail as we each delete different ones and some don’t get downloaded to the right computer.

      Hopefully with more time to work on it, I may come up with a solution!

      Thanks again for the info – it has helped to clarify a few things in my mind!

    • #2480003

      I haven’t tried moving e-mail to a ‘local folder’. I don’t know yet whether a move will be specific to a local folder on a specific laptop, or whether both laptops will show the moved e-mail in the local folder. I haven’t set up my own local folder, so right now, ‘Move to’ > Local folder will only move it Trash. I am guessing that you can either a) set up a local folder so that it is specific to Laptop 1 (having been set up on Laptop 1) and specific to Laptop 2 (having been set up on Laptop 2), or b) you can set up a local folder so that it is local to bellsouth (the master), in which case either laptop can find it there, when moved that bellsouth local folder. In this case, it would be like bellsouth’s Archive folder, which both Laptop 1 and Laptop 2 can access.

      That’s a good question. I need to test that as well, as I haven’t done any email maintenance or cleanup in a very long time. One of my Gmail accounts is approaching the limit though, and I need to get a handle on it one day soon.

      My assumption is that if you copy an email to your local folder, the original email still resides on your provider’s server. I need to determine if there is a distinction between copying and moving. On your local PC file system, moving a file implies that the original is deleted during the move, where copying it leaves the original file in place. Not sure yet what the details for this interaction with Thunderbird would be.

      But once you are confident that your local copy is backed up, then it should be safe to delete it from the server. Easy enough to test with a junk email.

      Bottom line is that a local folder will only be visible to the local PC that it is on. That’s the point of being “local”. That is also why I opt to only use one PC with a client email app as my “local” email repository. That PC and the provider server both have copies of the same data in my IMAP folders, and my local folders on that one PC can store stuff that I may want to save after it has been deleted from the IMAP folders.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

    • #2480071

      If the incoming emails accumulated there, perhaps over the years, for whatever reason are deleted from the IMAP server and you have not copied them to a folder in your client, in your computer, then they are gone gone, gone.

      Well, hopefully a major provider like Google (gmail) already has a backup strategy for their IMAP servers to prevent “Gone, gone, gone”!

      In any case it would probably be wise to have your own strategy for copying and backing up essential emails… 🙂

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

    • #2480187

      My only concern with imap is how do you know TB has downloaded a copy of every email in every on-line folder. In activity manager I always see some items that seem to get stuck synchronizing folders, especially gmail. How can I force TB  to do this reliably?

      • #2480238

        I use Thunderbird with Gmail on Windows 10, using a high speed broadband internet connection and I have never observed this behavior. My folders always update within seconds when something changes, such as somebody sending me an email while I am talking with them on the phone. With IMAP there is no need to get mail or refresh. IMAP updates automatically.

        You could always open a browser and view the IMAP folders directly via the web to verify.

        Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      • #2480402

        In activity manager I always see some items that seem to get stuck synchronizing folders, especially gmail. How can I force TB to do this reliably?

        Where is “activity manager”?

    • #2480216

      Based upon this thread, it appears that Thunderbird is more complicated to setup and maintain then Microsoft Outlook.

      As mentioned back in August, we have been using Outlook for decades and have had no problems recovering from the corruption or loss of  Outlook data files on our computers. At present, we have 1,000’s of emails on our system with some dating back to 2004.

      Our emails are stored on our email service provider’s servers as well as on our PCs.  The annual cost for their services ranges from $20 US per year for 2GB of email storage & 200 MB file storage to $180 per year for 250 GB of email storage & 25 GB of file storage.

      They also encrypt the email data flow and their servers are located in a jurisdiction that is highly protective of personal privacy – including access to email stored on their servers by law enforcement and other third parties.

      Our email service also provides step by step instructions on how to setup and email account in Outlook.

      We can also gain access to our email from multiple devices (often open at the same time). Delete an email on one device and all other devices are updated when they login to the internet service’s system.

      If things go bump in the night on one of our computers, all we have to do is delete the problem Outlook account, add a “new account” using the same setting as the account just removed, sync the new Outlook account with the email service provider’s servers, wait while our in and sent email is downloaded from the email service providers server, and then import our backed-up calendar and contact .pst files.

      The whole process takes less than one-half hour.

      From a time value standpoint, it is less expensive to use our email structure then to be playing around for hours trying to make another email application work.

      • #2480231

        Outlook is an email client that covers what is needed in most business, except perhaps those with very few employees, or owned and a run by one person, or just a family. It might not be perfect, but it is usable. It does the job.

        Thunderbird is glitchy and as Kathy Stevens correctly observes, can be difficult to setup and maintain.

        Unless one’s email needs are few and unchanging. As in my case.

        So I use TB at home and Outlook at work.

        Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

        MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
        Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
        macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

    • #2480240

      Thunderbird is glitchy

      Not in my experience. I assume that is just an opinion, stated as if it was a fact.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2480372

        Well, to me that TB is”glitchy” is a fact verified by direct observation, meaning it behaves strangely and annoyingly off its own bat, such as when, but not limited to, showing text in tiny letters that needed wasting time figuring out how to make it behave and use a bigger font. And even after doing that, now and then, it surprises me with switches in font size when I am in the middle of writing an email. There is more, but this should be enough.

        Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

        MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
        Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
        macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

    • #2480554

      I like eye candy with my Email.

      I gave Firefox a pleasing top with the “Angelina Eyes” theme. It looks nice, but not distracting, and at a glance those eyes tell me that Firefox is open. (Click on the images to enlarge).

      Foxeyes

      But Thunderbird 102.3.0 (64-bit) in Windows 11 Pro doesn’t handle a theme’s image properly.

      See Krystal_Win10.JPG with Thunderbird 91.9.0 (64-bit) in Windows 10 Home and compare it with the same theme Krystal_Win11.JPG in Thunderbird 102.3.0 (64-bit) in Windows 11 Pro.

      How can I correct that?

      Krystal_Win10

      Krystal_Win11

      1 Desktop W11
      1 Laptop W10
      Both tweaked to look, behave and feel like Windows 95
      • #2480599

        Speaking of TB themes, can anyone recommend a theme that has some color in it — no images, just color. I like the blue in “Angela’s Eyes”.

        I’ve look at the list of TB theme add-ons, but the list is long and many don’t work with the latest version of TB that I use on my Win10/Pro — 102.2.2.

        Some recommendations would cut down on the search for something with color, but no images.

        • #2480812

          WCHS: Is this something like what you are looking for?

          https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/1271598

          It is about a Mac version of TB, but maybe it’s not different for Windows.

          Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

          MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
          Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
          macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

          • #2480824

            That Mozilla post is about setting the color in only the message window. And if I read the description correctly, it changes the background color of the message for the receiver as well. It doesn’t change the color of any other TB area/panel/bar/window

            I am looking for a recommendation for a theme add-on that will change the boring default black/white/gray color. A specific theme can change backgrounds everywhere in the TB display(s) — black/white/gray to a various shades of light blue, for example.

            To show what I mean, here’s one, but it works only for versions 51 through 58. I am on version 102.
            a-TB-theme

            • #2480934

              WCHS: “That Mozilla post is about setting the color in only the message window

              I thought that it was a recipe for changing the color of the window, not the emails contents when seen on that window. Or in the window of a recipient using any client. Maybe I sent you the wrong link?

              Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

              MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
              Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
              macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

            • #2480935

              Are you sure? [Your edit omitted this question.] I thought that it was a recipe for changing the color of the window, not the emails contents when seen on that window.

              Yes, I’m sure. You can click on the link in your post and you will see that the title and text is about changing the background color of messages.

            • #2480948

              Ohh! I see .. Sorry. Now I can’t find the one that I thought I’d linked …

              Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

              MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
              Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
              macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

            • #2480957

              I am looking for a recommendation for a theme add-on that will change the boring default black/white/gray color. A specific theme can change backgrounds everywhere in the TB display(s) — black/white/gray to a various shades of light blue, for example. To show what I mean, here’s one, but it works only for versions 51 through 58. I am on version 102.

              These appear to be the themes that work with the newest versions of TB. The themes now only appear to change the upper part of the UI.

              https://addons.thunderbird.net/en-US/thunderbird/search/?q=theme&appver=102.3.0&platform=WINNT&cat=themes

               

              Windows 10 Pro 22H2

              1 user thanked author for this post.
            • #2480983

              These appear to be the themes that work with the newest versions of TB. The themes now only appear to change the upper part of the UI.

              Hi JohnW,
              Thanks for the URL. How did you get “/search/?q=theme&appver=102.3.0&platform=WINNT&cat=themes” to show up in the URL? I am assuming that you used some kind of search and that you didn’t type this all out manually. Did you use something like DuckDuckGo to come up with this URL? Or did you use the search box at
              https://addons.thunderbird.net/en-US/ ” to come up with it?

              I’d like to know where you did the search to find this URL and what the search terms looked like — if this all makes sense to you.

            • #2480995

              I’d like to know where you did the search to find this URL and what the search terms looked like — if this all makes sense to you.

              I simply clicked thru my Thunderbird to get to the search box.

              By starting at the hamburger icon (3 horizontal lines) menu at the top right in TB > Add-ons and Themes > Themes; “Find more add-ons” search box.

              Typed “Themes” in the search box and TB opened up that URL in a browser window. Just copied the URL and pasted here.

              Windows 10 Pro 22H2

            • #2480998

              Just copied the URL and pasted here.

              and pasted here in a browser?

              but how did the URL get the ““/search/?q=theme&appver=102.3.0&platform=WINNT&cat=themes” part in order to filter the search so that only themes that would work in Windows and in 102.3 would come up on the screen?

            • #2481012

              Pasted on the AskWoody page while editing a comment, as everyone does. And how knowing this helps you?

              Ex-Windows user (Win. 98, XP, 7); since mid-2017 using also macOS. Presently on Monterey 12.15 & sometimes running also Linux (Mint).

              MacBook Pro circa mid-2015, 15" display, with 16GB 1600 GHz DDR3 RAM, 1 TB SSD, a Haswell architecture Intel CPU with 4 Cores and 8 Threads model i7-4870HQ @ 2.50GHz.
              Intel Iris Pro GPU with Built-in Bus, VRAM 1.5 GB, Display 2880 x 1800 Retina, 24-Bit color.
              macOS Monterey; browsers: Waterfox "Current", Vivaldi and (now and then) Chrome; security apps. Intego AV

            • #2481020

              My question wasn’t about how to get the URL in the AskWoody post. So, even though you gave me the answer to that, it’s not going to help me. I already know how to paste a specific URL in an AskWoody post!

              My question was about how to get that specific URL in the first place so that it could be used in the URL line of a/any browser.

            • #2481018

              Typed “Themes” in the search box [and pressed ENTER] and TB opened up that URL in a browser window. Just copied the URL and pasted here.

              I’ve figured it out now. You have to press ENTER after you type ‘theme’ (‘themes’ will work, too) in the “Find more add-ons” search box — in order to get TB to give you that URL.

              Whew!

              1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2480952

      Speaking of TB themes, can anyone recommend a theme that has some color in it — no images, just color. I like the blue in “Angela’s Eyes”.

      I’ve look at the list of TB theme add-ons, but the list is long and many don’t work with the latest version of TB that I use on my Win10/Pro — 102.2.2.

      Some recommendations would cut down on the search for something with color, but no images.

      Note: As of Thunderbird 68, complete themes are no longer supported.

      https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/install-themes-change-look-thunderbird

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2481032

      Note: As of Thunderbird 68, complete themes are no longer supported.

      https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/install-themes-change-look-thunderbird

      Beat me to it, this is why I am still on ver 60.

      Capture-1

      🍻

      Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #2481035

      Typed “Themes” in the search box [and pressed ENTER] and TB opened up that URL in a browser window. Just copied the URL and pasted here.

      I’ve figured it out now. You have to press ENTER after you type ‘theme’ (‘themes’ will work, too) in the “Find more add-ons” search box — in order to get TB to give you that URL.

      Whew!

      I failed to mention that part. Assumed it was obvious… 🙂

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

    • #2481096

      this is why I am still on ver 60.

      I would be worried about all of the un-patched security vulnerabilities using TB v60.

      Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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