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  • Win10 customers — it’s time to move to Win10 version 1903

    Home Forums AskWoody blog Win10 customers — it’s time to move to Win10 version 1903

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      • #2045390 Reply
        woody
        Da Boss

        As a card-carrying member of the Ain’t-Broke-Don’t-Fix Society, I’ve been keeping my production machines on Win10 1809. It’s now time to move on – but
        [See the full post at: Win10 customers — it’s time to move to Win10 version 1903]

        3 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2045569 Reply
        Seff
        AskWoody Plus

        Thanks Woody.

        For those of us on Windows 7 who are considering upgrading to Windows 10, I believe the Media Creation Tool  automatically installs the latest version, presumably 1909, although I can’t recall which I was offered and failed on a couple of weeks or more ago. Is it critical to opt for a different version and if so is there an easy way to avoid the MCT and upgrade to that version please?

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #2045638 Reply
          warrenrumak
          AskWoody Plus

          The main problem with Windows 10 1909 is the search box in File Explorer.  They rewrote it for this release and it has several problems.

          Otherwise, 1909 has been fine.

          It seems likely that at least some of the problems will be fixed with next week’s Patch Tuesday update, and we keep our fingers crossed that no new significant problems are introduced.

          At the very least, wait a few more weeks.  Windows 7 will receive patches this month, so you’re going to be fully protected well into February no matter what.

          2 users thanked author for this post.
          • #2045831 Reply
            Bluetrix
            AskWoody MVP

            The main problem with Windows 10 1909 is the search box in File Explorer.

            I updated my HP laptop on 1/4/2020 to Win 1909 – build 18363.535

            I am having no problems with either the Search box, or the search function in File Explorer. I have read online about issues, none are affecting my upgrade.

            I disabled my 3rd party “Stop update” program and used WU to update from 1809. I was a little surprised and glad that no problems confronted me – at all.

            Privacy settings remained intact. I did have to again turn off access to files by apps, other than that, all went as un-expected!

            I do have 1809 fully backed up (2X) on externals, just in case.

            • This reply was modified 2 months, 4 weeks ago by Bluetrix.
        • #2045700 Reply
          Microfix
          AskWoody MVP

          You can d/load W10 v1903 iso using the Heidoc ISO Downloader
          Note: Timed adverts pop up on the newest version upon start..but the author of the great utility obviously gets revenue from them and does not affect functionality.

          Win7 Pro x86/x64 | Win8.1 Pro x64 | Linux Hybrids x86/x64 |
        • #2045737 Reply
          zero2dash
          AskWoody Lounger

          Just FYI for those who are upgrading from 7 to 10 – you can also run setup.exe from the ISO of your choice, after booting your Win7 machine, and upgrade to the version of your choice while still getting the free digital license for Win10. If you are upgrading from an older version like 1903, you will want to disconnect your ethernet or WiFi connection because if you don’t, you may get upgraded automatically to 1909 instead.

          2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2045806 Reply
        techweenie
        AskWoody Lounger

        I’ve noticed a recurring theme of horrible bugs in 1903.  Wouldn’t it be safer and wiser to wait until the search bug is fixed in 1909 and just move to that?  I’ve been using it on my laptop for over a month and really like it.  I don’t do much searching, so that hasn’t affected me.

        • #2045942 Reply
          zero2dash
          AskWoody Lounger

          I’m curious as to what bugs you’re referring to.
          I’ve had 0 issues with 1903, same as 1809, 1803, 1709, and 1703 before it.

          • #2046129 Reply
            techweenie
            AskWoody Lounger

            If you follow this website you should be well aware of the bugs. Woody has them well documented.  I haven’t seen any major issues with 1809 or 1909 (search bug aside).

            • #2046265 Reply
              zero2dash
              AskWoody Lounger

              “Reported on” does not mean common or “horrible”.
              If bugs are “horrible”, surely we’d hear more complaints from end users, especially when MS claims >1,000,000,000 devices are running Win10 now.
              Just saying…

      • #2046063 Reply
        anonymous
        Guest

        And if you’re on Enterprise, stay on 1809 until 1909 is stable due to the extra 12 months of support to May 2021. As soon as 1909 is stable, test with it and then move to it though (as it’s good til May 2022). In terms of AutoPilot support and all of the shiny new features for Enterprise deployment, it seems like 1909 will be the stable build to baseline any agency on.

        • #2047782 Reply
          anonymous
          Guest

          What he said. That’s not great enterprise advice (just my 2 cents) for this reason. You move all to 1903 then you will be rushing to 1909 before the end of the year or risk losing support.

      • #2046120 Reply
        bbearren
        AskWoody MVP

        I’ve been running 1909 on my machines since it was RTM by Microsoft.  To date I have found one (1) inconsequential bug.  In order to paste into the Search box in File Explorer I have to use Ctrl + V instead of mouse right-click Paste.

        I have Indexing disabled, so a search takes a while, but search does work, after all.  On the other hand, I don’t really use search; I know where my files are via a partitioning/folder hierarchy I’ve developed over the years.

        Definitely not a game changer for me; YMMV.

        Create a fresh drive image before making system changes/Windows updates, in case you need to start over!
        "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns
        "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware

        2 users thanked author for this post.
        • #2046187 Reply
          Bluetrix
          AskWoody MVP

          Right click – paste is working on my build, as does Ctl+V. So far I am not having issues with 1909.

          But this thread is about 1903. My bad.

           

      • #2046351 Reply
        b
        AskWoody Plus

        Right click – paste is working on my build, as does Ctl+V. So far I am not having issues with 1909.

        Into the File Explorer search box on 1909? I thought that was broken for everyone.

        And Woody called that bug ubiquitous.

        Windows 10 Pro Version 2004: Group ASAP (chump/pioneer)

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #2047102 Reply
          Susan Bradley
          AskWoody MVP

          Not seeing it here either.

          Susan Bradley Patch Lady

        • #2047788 Reply
          Bluetrix
          AskWoody MVP

          @b

          I sit corrected, Search Box on desk top works with both.

          Only Ctl+V works in File Explorer, right click-paste does not.

          2 users thanked author for this post.
          b, woody
      • #2046548 Reply
        jhvance
        AskWoody Lounger

        I’ve successfully moved one Win10 laptop (which has lots of HDD space) to 1909, but a 32 Gb eMMC laptop remains at 1809 — and it was a real PITA to achieve that from 1803, as it required a complete reload of the original 1511 image followed by initial decrapification and then loading 1809 from the ISO created on a thumb drive with the Microsoft tool.  After repeated attempts at moving to 1903 which have failed because of the lack of available space onboard, it’s unlikely that 1909 can be achieved on that machine without a comparable approach, and with the change in MS specifications which indicate even that approach will fail because of the 32 Gb limitation I’m thinking that space-constrained laptop has reached EOL for OS upgrades (unless it’s a move to some form of Linux).

      • #2046552 Reply
        b
        AskWoody Plus

        Odd, considering that Microsoft stated unequivocally in February that it wouldn’t be using the term “Semi-Annual Channel” anymore.

        Microsoft did not state that, even equivocally.

        You said, “… Microsoft will no longer use the “Semi-Annual Channel Targeted” …”

        Because Microsoft explained, “… two Semi-Annual Channel (SAC) releases each year …” in the retirement of SAC-T

        The Semi-Annual Channel receives feature updates twice per year.

        The Semi-Annual Channel is the default servicing channel for all Windows 10 devices except those with the LTSB edition installed.

        Windows 10 Pro Version 2004: Group ASAP (chump/pioneer)

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2047325 Reply
        CADesertRat
        AskWoody Plus

        I used the MCT for 1903 when it was first posted to get a copy which makes my USB creation as 18362.356. So if I run that USB (the setup.exe) on any of my computers, it will give me that version and after hooking the internet back up, it’s probably going to want to update to 1909.

        From what I’m reading here, 1909 is “ok” to install now????

        Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
        4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

        • #2047369 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          I thought Woody said v1903, that 1909 is not ready yet.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2047708 Reply
            CADesertRat
            AskWoody Plus

            My problem is going to be that 1903 will want to update to 1909 when it updates from the early 1903 MCT USB that I created. Can I stop 1909 by setting Grp Policy to stop “Feature” updates as I have been doing to stay on 1809? OR is 1909 not considered as a “Feature” update but as a cum. update for 1903?

            Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
            4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

        • #2047402 Reply
          cyberSAR
          AskWoody Plus

          After installing 1903 set your deferral dates to prevent 1909 before connecting to internet. I have the right-click paste bug on mine but 1909 fixed some other minor bugs 1903 had on my systems – mainly giving an accurate size of folders when checking via right-click properties

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2047753 Reply
            CADesertRat
            AskWoody Plus

            After installing 1903 set your deferral dates to prevent 1909 before connecting to internet.

            As I stated before, 1903 will need to get WU (after reconnecting to the internet) to get to a build that isn’t as buggy as the early version I have on my USB. If I immediately set deferrals it won’t update at all.

            Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
            4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

            • #2047852 Reply
              PKCano
              Da Boss

              Deferrals are different from Pause. Pause will stop Quality updates for the Pause period. With the Pro version you can use Deferrals.

              If you set Feature Update Deferrals to 365 in 1903 before you connect to the Internet, it will prevent 1909. If you set Quality Update Deferrals to 0, you will get 1903 Cumulative Updates to bring you up to date.

              You can go back and lower the Feature deferral when you want to upgrade to 1909.

              1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2048003 Reply
                CADesertRat
                AskWoody Plus

                If you set Feature Update Deferrals to 365 in 1903 before you connect to the Internet, it will prevent 1909. If you set Quality Update Deferrals to 0, you will get 1903 Cumulative Updates to bring you up to date.

                Ahh, that’s what I was trying to find out. So if I understand you correctly, 1909 is considered a “Feature” update that I can still defer for 365 days just like I have been doing on previous Feature updates in Grp. Policy until I’m ready for them. Cool 🙂

                Thanks PK

                Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
                4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2052754 Reply
                woody
                Da Boss

                In every instance I’ve seen, if you get to 1903 you’re going to stay there – unless you click on the link to “Download and install now”. I don’t think it’s physically possible to get from 1903 to 1909 any other way (short of a manual install).

                I’d be very interested in hearing of any other experiences.

              • #2052926 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                Win10 Pro 1903 Build 18362.535:
                I had Feature Deferral set to 365 days.
                I lowered it to 50 days and ran wushowhide.
                1-Screen-Shot-2020-01-10-at-9.59.05-AM

                I checked for updates – never saw the section that said “Download and installed now”.
                2-Screen-Shot-2020-01-10-at-9.59.41-AM

                Welcome to 1909 – like it or not.
                3-Screen-Shot-2020-01-10-at-10.00.33-AM

                Attachments:
                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2053358 Reply
                woody
                Da Boss

                Yikes.

                So wushowhide doesn’t show the 1909 upgrade as a “hide”able update.

                This feature-upgrade-as-a-cumulative-update approach has some real downsides….

              • #2053497 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                That IS the HIDE screen in #1 – if you check it I suppose you can hide it. I wasn’t trying that. I was trying to get it w/o the “Download and installed now”which you said was the only to get it.

              • #2054434 Reply
                abbodi86
                AskWoody_MVP

                “Download and installed now” = OptionalInstallation

                whenever you set any deferral days, 1909 switch from optional update to a regular update

                @woody
                that has nothing to do with 1909 being a cumulative update for 1903 🙂
                the same behavior will occur when version 2004 is public

                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2060263 Reply
                woody
                Da Boss

                Yep, and my reply above is completely erroneous.

                What’s the effect of “Pause updates”? If you set to Pause, will you get 1909 after the time limit’s up — even though your don’t click (or don’t even see) “Download and install now”?

                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2060462 Reply
                geekdom
                AskWoody Plus

                Which operation does what and under what circumstances and order for each Windows 10 update type?

                • regular plain-vanilla update
                • upgrade from old Windows 10 version to new Widows 10 version
                • Windows Defender
                G{ot backup} TestBeta
                offline▸ Win7Pro SP1 x64 InUse
                online▸ Win10Pro 1909.18363.752 x64 i5-9400 RAM8GB HDD Firefox75.0 Windows{Image/Defender/Firewall}
              • #2072911 Reply
                CADesertRat
                AskWoody Plus

                “Download and installed now” = OptionalInstallation whenever you set any deferral days, 1909 switch from optional update to a regular update @woody that has nothing to do with 1909 being a cumulative update for 1903

                @Abbodi

                I’m once again confused then, LOL. My plan was to use the USB with 1903, 18362.356 and insert it with windows running and no internet connected and run setup.exe. I was going to use grp policy to defer Feature Updates to 365 days (which it is already but will check to make sure it stays or possibly reset it) and Quality updates to 0 before connecting the internet.

                If I understand your post correctly, that won’t save me from getting the 1909 as an update then?

                Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
                4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

              • #2074148 Reply
                abbodi86
                AskWoody_MVP

                It will defer 1909 for 365 days

                but if you decided to change or remove deferral days before it ends, then 1909 will be offered as regular update (per new defer days), and not through optional “Download and installed now”

                2 users thanked author for this post.
              • #2074609 Reply
                CADesertRat
                AskWoody Plus

                It will defer 1909 for 365 days but if you decided to change or remove deferral days before it ends, then 1909 will be offered as regular update (per new defer days), and not through optional “Download and installed now”

                So in other words, it will defer 1909 for the 365 days that I set but when I am ready to get 1909 I can just change the grp policy setting to 0 and I will get 1909 as an update, is that correct?

                Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
                4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

              • #2084215 Reply
                CADesertRat
                AskWoody Plus

                Just installed 1903 18362.356 on my HP ProBook G2 laptop. It saved the grp policy deferral settings and I set the quality updates to 0 before connecting the wireless connection but it just says that I am missing important security & quality fixes and hasn’t checked for updates. Do I dare click on check for updates?? Tomorrow is patch Tuesday so if it checks then, it will get the new Jan. updates.

                Another question, I have an old router that I have been using for years and on every boot, I get a notification that it is insecure. Is there anyway to stop that notification other than spending money on a new router?

                Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
                4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

              • #2084255 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                Run wushowhide and see what’s pending. If it’s 1903, you can check for updates and get it. You have till noon (server time) tomorrow before the Jan updates show up.

                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2084271 Reply
                CADesertRat
                AskWoody Plus

                Thanks PK,

                I took a shot at check for updates and 1st it downloaded KB 4533002 .NET, then I checked again and it is now in the process of installing KB 4530684 Dec Cum update and it also installed KB 4524569 SSU.

                I don’t have WUSHOWHIDE so it all worked ok. Evidently the grp policy settings kept 1909 at bay for now. My next step will be to set quality updates to 30 days.

                Don't take yourself so seriously, no one else does 🙂
                4 Win 10 Pro at 1909 (3 Desktops, 1 Laptop).

              • #2084722 Reply
                Cijan
                AskWoody Plus

                I just upgraded from 1809 home to 1903 home (x64). I installed from bootable USB (without internet connection). I got the same build as you. I did all the recommended things (as per PKs notes) before reconnecting, including using the (new to me) pause for updates 1903 Home has.
                BTW – I can actually get 35 days, not the max 21 days others have reported. I also kept metered connection on before reconnecting to internet.
                I had the same weird notification about my internet connection not being secured, and needing update. I just rechecked the properties and connected again, and it was ok for long enough to download and install the latest (nov) SSU and (dec) CU (as per Sue’s patch list).
                After that restart, I got the same wifi connection warning again, but I’d had enough, so shut down.
                This morning, no warnings, all good except for poor performance due to the search index running. I rechecked network/wifi connections and security settings and there are no warnings, so I think it’s a temporary issue with something getting out of sync.

                1 user thanked author for this post.
              • #2110090 Reply
                KYKaren
                AskWoody Plus

                You can go back and lower the Feature deferral when you want to upgrade to 1909.

                After you lower the Feature deferral, when the deferral expires, will it offer you a “Download and install now” link? Or will it automatically start downloading and installing?

                Offline: Win7Pro ∙ SP1 ∙ x64
                Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-6500U ∙ RAM 12GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender
                Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-8565U ∙ RAM 16GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender

              • #2110099 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                Look at the GUI settings here, and the Group Policy setting here. Semi-Annual channel no longer is available. The “2” notify download/install setting in GP will keep it from automatically downloading and should be the ONLY setting related to WU in Group Policy. The other settings in the GUI should control the rest.

      • #2047542 Reply
        geekdom
        AskWoody Plus

        I’m just getting the hang of Windows 10 operations. I’m now at 1909 from 1903 — and not too greatly concerned about the upgrade.

        G{ot backup} TestBeta
        offline▸ Win7Pro SP1 x64 InUse
        online▸ Win10Pro 1909.18363.752 x64 i5-9400 RAM8GB HDD Firefox75.0 Windows{Image/Defender/Firewall}
      • #2049655 Reply
        EspressoWillie
        AskWoody Plus

        So I have a Win10 Pro I want to go from 1809 to 1909.  Your previous article said to set the feature deferral to 10 (back in November).  So should I now specify 70?  I don’t want 2004 accidentally getting on this workstation.

        Cheers!!
        Willie McClure
        www.datarim.com
        Talk's cheap, takes money to buy whiskey.
        • #2051138 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          If you currently have 1809:
          2004 won’t get on your computer unless you aare in the Insider Rings.
          If you leave the Feature deferral at 10 days, it should offer you 1909.
          If you leave the Feature deferral at 120 days, it should offer you 1903.

          3 users thanked author for this post.
      • #2050455 Reply
        Alex5723
        AskWoody Plus

        OR is 1909 not considered as a “Feature” update

        If you haven’t set any deferrals you will get an option to upgrade to 1909 whenever you choose to, in both Home and Pro.
        In Pro you can defer Feature updates up to 365 days and Quality updates up to 30 days.
        In Home you can pause up to 35 days.

      • #2050500 Reply
        Alex5723
        AskWoody Plus

        So I have a Win10 Pro I want to go from 1809 to 1909

        Just download the ISO file with Media Creation Tool. You will get 1909.

        2 users thanked author for this post.
        • #2053306 Reply
          EspressoWillie
          AskWoody Plus

          I thought about it (and I did it last time) but I felt lazy this time and wanted it to see if it would download the right version.

          Cheers!!
          Willie McClure
          www.datarim.com
          Talk's cheap, takes money to buy whiskey.
      • #2051069 Reply
        anonymous
        Guest

        I’ve got x3 machines on 1909. Only had to reload the HP Printer Drivers: so far.
        Unsupported/Obsolescent Software does leave a ‘shed load’ of remnants.
        W10 appears to be in MS favour; certainly, not the user.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2052498 Reply
        mikebursack
        AskWoody Lounger

        Running fine with 1909 but here is how I got there.

        When I was running 1809 and 1903  back in Oct 2019 I got the issues with the Start menu and Windows Search in the taskbar for some PC’s not working.  Here is what I did to get buy it and now all MS updates moving forward have not reproduced the problem.  I am however using WSUS to control what updates my PC’s get but you can block certain updates in Win10 manually as well.

        On Win10 1809 KB4511553 Breaks it. If you don’t see this KB uninstall your newest one so it goes back and shows it then you can uninstall it as well.
        On Win10 1903 KB4517389 and KB4515384 breaks the search. Simply removing them gets it working again.

        Then like I said I blocked them and moved forward with MS updates.  I have now upgraded most all my 30 computers to Win10 1909 with out issues and I do have a very mix3ed environment.

         

        Hope this helps?

      • #2052585 Reply
        chaloots
        AskWoody Plus

        Am currently on 1903 Pro, 64 bit, Build 18362.535 with every intention of remaining until hearing otherwise from Ask Woody. There hasn’t been, or I hadn’t noticed, any recommendations to pause updates in the past couple of weeks.

        This morning revealed that a restart was required to complete a Cumulative Update for .NET Framework 3.5 and 4.8 for my version (KB533002). Since I remembered Susan’s suggestion to postpone/disregard any such updates I first tried to remember what I missed to let this update occur. After rebooting I uninstalled it, though I find it’s still listed in Update history as well as six locations in C:\Windows\System32\CatRoot

        What I’d like to know is what I might have missed as far as avoiding this .NET Framework update from installing itself. Could it have been prevented by an optional pausing of updates, and should I concern myself that although technically uninstalled it still lives in C:\Windows\System32\CatRoot?

        The duration of a minute depends on which side of the bathroom door you're on.

        • #2052698 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          Take a look ath the settings here and settings here. The Group Policy setting of 2 will keep updates from downloading until you say so. (Semi-Annual Channel no longer exists)

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2054205 Reply
            chaloots
            AskWoody Plus

            Thanks for the pointers, PKCano. As I’m thoroughly unfamiliar with finding, much less tweaking the network metered connection, the configuration path I chose was gpedit.

            A couple of further questions: the KB4533002 .NET Framework update that I’d uninstalled is no longer on the Control Panel uninstall lists but is still listed in Quality Updates history. What are the chances of it remaining there, or does it even matter?

            Also, despite the fact that KB4533002 appears to have been successfully uninstalled via Control Panel, six existing packages for it are still in C:\Windows\System32\CatRoot. Should they be left alone or could they be deleted safely?

            Once again, grazie.

            The duration of a minute depends on which side of the bathroom door you're on.

          • #2054929 Reply
            chaloots
            AskWoody Plus

            I hate to be a nudge, but having followed the gpedit steps illustrated in the second link provided (Configure Automatic Updates/Enabled/Notify for Download and auto install – https://www.askwoody.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Screen-Shot-2019-12-07-at-11.55.09-AM.png) coincidentally resulted in both Security Intelligence Update for Windows Defender Antivirus – KB2267602 (Version 1.307.2129.0) and (once again, but I’m ignoring it) 2019-12 Cumulative Update for .NET Framework 3.5 and 4.8 for Windows 10 Version 1903 for x64 (KB4533002) being listed as “pending download”.

            I choose not to install the .NET Framework update but am puzzled as to why Windows Defender hasn’t 1) already automatically updated, and 2) reads the status of pending, when prior to the gpedit tweak Windows Defender updates were silent, automatic, background affairs. To my naive eye it appears as if clicking on “Download” will work for the two of them, which is definitely not what I want.

            What further settings change(s) would it take to revert Windows Defender updates to occur automatically and further pause/ignore .NET Framework?

            The duration of a minute depends on which side of the bathroom door you're on.

            • #2055178 Reply
              PKCano
              Da Boss

              Use wushowhide to hide the patche(s) you do not want to install.
              Defender will update anyway – look again in a while and the update will no longer be pending.

      • #2054746 Reply
        JimmyJames
        AskWoody Lounger

        I’m concerned about USB external drives problems in 1903, it seems a common problem.

        Among the list of problems that I have had using Windows 10, since 1607, the worst are with multiple external drives, to the extent that it has lost me data due to sudden un-mounts and FS structure damage, that CHKDSK fixes but not permanently. 1809 seems to be the worst offender of all the versions I’ve run so anticipating 1903’s USB issues makes me shudder. SMART specs are fine, drives run fine, no noises or temperature issues. I tried driver updates and re-installs too but my circa 2014 laptop has no recent Windows 10 hardware updates. All the (untested) re-codes in Windows 10 are bound to break things more and more, so a 5 year old computer is worth nothing.

        It’s all moot now, but over 8 years of running or assisting others running Windows 7 I had no OS/driver related problems with external drives/enclosures, using many different drives in many enclosures from 1 to 4 bay and different USB2 and USB3 hubs. And that’s on some XP/Vista age machines too. Zero problems.

        All the people I help who were still running Windows 7 are on Windows 10 now despite my repeated advice that they skip it in for Woody’s suggestion, ChromeOS. I told them about Ask Woody so they’re on their own. I’m off to Linux full time on the 2014 laptop. I can have fun with esoteric file and drive issues over there, and it will still be far less exhausting than Windows 10 has been.

        I’m not renewing my Ask Woody subscription. But a hearty thanks to Woody et al for guiding me (and those I help) through the biggest, stinkiest field of cow patties this side of Texas.

      • #2055319 Reply
        anonymous
        Guest

        I’m still running 1803 (PRO with 365 days deferral). Got the December quality updates so I feel safe for now, but I’m starting to wonder…

        What will happen if I just wait?

        Will Microsoft force a feature upgrade on me at some point?

        When? And which version?

        Should I make a choice now, before Ms makes it for me later???

      • #2055868 Reply
        DriftyDonN
        AskWoody Plus

        quad-core Core i5-8250U, GeForce MX150 discrete GPU, 8GB of RAM and a 256GB SSD

        win10 Pro ver 1903 build 18362.356

        Upgraded 33 days ago w/ ISO from ver 1809 to ver 1903. Set pause updates to max expire date 13 Jan. According to Belarc, I am missing 2 updates, I believe one is SSU and other is “offer to upgrade to ver 1909”belarc-win10-missing-patches

        I have set to metered, windows update service stopped,also set group policy windows update to “2” as suggested by PKCano.

        So I am unsure what to expect. Notification that updates are available? In which case, in order to avoid ver 1909 being installed, use wushide?

        If I get to where these are dl’d and only have offer for win1909, then go thru wushide check and clear( as PKCano describes) but do I then want to “Pause” for max time again?

        Have macrium images so hopefully I’m prepared but all these changes from msft are confusing. Also have a newer Acer but it is Home version with max pause , metered etc. Since pro and home have the same options for putting off updates, cant see the point in upgrading to Pro.

        Thank You

        Don

        PS. I have not had any issues w/ search function in file explorer…copy/past, ctrl-V both work ok…

        • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by DriftyDonN.
        • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by DriftyDonN. Reason: FYI re: file explorer search issue
        Attachments:
      • #2060442 Reply
        PaulG
        AskWoody Lounger

        Just a heads up.  I decided to upgrade from 1809 Pro to 1903 Pro using an ISO file I’d squirreled away.  I checked the install.esm in the iso with dism to make sure it really was 1903.

        So I attached the iso, ran setup, said “NO” to updates but it looks like MS have changed the rules as it started downloading updates and bingo I ended up with 1909! Looks like I should have done a pushed upgrade with 180 days.

        Well now I’m here it appears to work so there’s no point going backwards 🙂

        • #2060533 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          You could also have disconnected from the Internet before you started the upgrade. If it can’t get to MS, it can’t download updates/upgrades.
          Next time…..  🙂

        • #2061600 Reply
          wavy
          AskWoody Plus

          It was not just you. I believe the same happened to me. But no problems w/ 1909.

          🍻

          Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.
      • #2062513 Reply
        anonymous
        Guest

        I have never done a full system image backup before. It will have to be stored on an external USB/drive as I cannot burn a DVD from my laptop. Does this backup just do the OS or does it include all my files/photos etc.? Do I have a choice between these options? I always backup my data, so I would not necessarily need to duplicate it.  Finally, how do I know how many GB this will take?

        Thanks in advance.

        • #2066113 Reply
          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          Backups should always be on USB HDD IMO.

          An image backup is of the entire hard disk, so it will include all your data as well as Windows.

          Always start with an external disk that is at least the same size as the disk you are imaging. The larger the external disk the more backups you can fit on it.
          The backup is generally 20-30% smaller than the data on disk, e.g. my 60GB of Windows and data becomes a 42GB backup file.

          cheers, Paul

      • #2066528 Reply
        anonymous
        Guest

        After my latest upgrade, I noticed a C:\Windows.old 32GB.
        Unless the folder is overwritten, each upgrade. It won’t take long to fill up my 128GB SSD.
        Put the ‘W’ in (), (W). Give it a few days, and then delete.

      • #2067141 Reply
        Alex5723
        AskWoody Plus

        After my latest upgrade, I noticed a C:\Windows.old 32GB

        Windows OS will delete the file after 10 days in which you can roll back to previous version.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2084093 Reply
        DriftyDonN
        AskWoody Plus

        How do I set feature update to 365 days? I have

        Acer quad-core Core i5-8250U, GeForce MX150 discrete GPU, 8GB of RAM and a 256GB SSD

        win10 Home ver 1903 build 18362.535 updated 13 Jan 2020.

        Paused updates 35 days,

        Will this stop ver 1909 install? I did get the ver 1909 ready to download and install message on Home ver but not on Pro version.

        Thnx

        DonN

        • #2084109 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          Home version doesn’t support Feature deferrals. You have to have Pro Edition.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2084148 Reply
        NurhanB
        AskWoody Plus

        I have tried to install Version 1903 but when I try to install I get the message that I have 1809 and I have the latest version and does not allow me to go to 1903. W

        What am I doing wrong?

        HELP!Windows-update

         

        Attachments:
        • #2084166 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          Before we can venture a guess, we need to know what Edition of Win10 1809 you are running – Home or Pro?

      • #2084443 Reply
        Lars220
        AskWoody Lounger

        If you leave the Feature deferral at 120 days, it should offer you 1903.

        Thank you PKCano, and Woody, I have Win 10 Pro that was on 1809.914 and I had the Feature deferral set at 180 days. As an experiment I decided to slowly lower the deferral from 180 to 120 in steps, I moved it to 150 days and hesitantly clicked ‘Check for Updates’ and was given the 1903 Feature Update with NO ‘Download and Install’ option. I did have, and still have the Group Policy set at #2 Notify before Download and Install, but that did not work this time, it has in the past. Anyway, I am now on 1903.535 and do not see any problems yet.
        Thank you for all your help, Greatly Appreciated 🙂

        GP-WU-1903

         

        Attachments:
        • #2085237 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          The “notify download/install” setting doesn’t work when YOU “check for updates.” You should use wushowhide every time to verify that what you want is pending before you click “check for updates.” Then you KNOW what you are getting is what you want, or you don’t click “check for updates.”

          If you let the SYSTEM check for updates on it’s own, then the “notify download/install” setting works, and you can see what to expect. Then if you DO NOT click “check for updates,” the updates will just sit there without downloading.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2085787 Reply
            Lars220
            AskWoody Lounger

            Thank you PKCano,  you are the Greatest !  A most magnificent educator,  Professor PKCano ! The following attached picture is in your Honor,  no disrespect intended at all.  Hope it will bring a smile to you.  Sincerely, your student,  Lars220.

            Attachments:
      • #2085226 Reply
        TonyC
        AskWoody Lounger

        I’ve followed the links and read Woody’s article in Computerworld dated the 25 November 2019 on how to control Windows 10 feature upgrades. Please forgive me if this question has been answered elsewhere – just point me in the right direction.

        I am currently planning to install Windows 10 on a new PC. If I am starting from a completely empty PC, how do I ensure that the feature level and monthly update level of my Windows 10 system are those that are currently recommended (i.e. feature level 1903 and monthly update level December 2019, I believe).

        FYI, I have not yet chosen my Windows 10 edition, but I am leaning towards Pro rather than Home.

        • #2085240 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          If you choose Home Edition, you can control updates with the use of wushowhide, Metered Internet connections, and “Pause” in 7-day increments to a max of 35 days. You will be offered “download and install now” link in a separate section of WU for optional updates including Feature Updates.

          If you choose the Pro Edition, you have the same controls as Home Edition, PLUS the use of Feature and Quality deferrals and the use of Group Policy

        • #2085245 Reply
          anonymous
          Guest

          TonyC – it is possible to do what you ask, but I advise you not to go to the effort.  When initially setting up a new PC (I assume you mean a home-built desktop, as otherwise a PC will almost always come with an operating system), you will need drivers for your printer and other parts of your computer, and if you install any Microsoft software like Office 2010 thru 2019 you will need updates for it.  Starting from an empty PC means you are doing a clean install.  Many users will never do another clean install, or will not do one for years.  To give your new PC the most drivers with the least effort, and to extend the time you can stay on your initial clean feature update I would install 1909 on it (which gets 6 months longer life), and let it get all updates and drivers unrestricted until it is fully patched (including the January patches).  Once all updates and drivers are installed, then you can lock it down in the recommended way and not get future patches unless recommended here.  Or, if you get pro, you can take a “shortcut” – after all are installed, set security or quality update defer to either 21 or 30 days.  Almost all bad patches are fixed by the time they are 3 weeks old.  If you let it do them automatically after 21 day delay I think you will be happy with the results as far as lack of viruses and lack of patch side effects.

          The reason I suggest this now is that 1909 is a good version – it adds little to 1903 so it is basically 1903 service pack 1 – and the January patch is one that most will be telling you to get – with the exception of this site, so in this special case of setting up a new PC I would go for it.

          Doing the above means you will end up with Microsoft / WHQL version of most drivers, instead of the manufacturer’s version.  I believe the WHQL versions are simpler, better tested, and less buggy.  However, the manufacturer version of printer, graphics, sound drivers and others often have a flashier option panel with more options.  If you are a gamer, you will likely want the manufacturer graphics driver.  This site tends to recommend getting some manufacturer drivers, especially for something like a Dell or other branded laptop.  If you are building a desktop yourself, you probably have your own opinion about which drivers you want.  If you want total control over which patches you install also, disregard the above and follow the recommendations that others may offer.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2085287 Reply
            TonyC
            AskWoody Lounger

            @anonymous, thank you. Certainly something to think about.

            Actually, I am not building my own PC. I am buying one from my favourite hardware supplier who can supply a PC with or without an operating system installed. For a number of reasons, I prefer to install the operating system myself. (For example, I prefer the operating system and all application code to occupy the C: partition and my personal data to occupy a D: partition. I don’t store any personal data in the C: partition, and I’ve never seen any “off the shelf” PC system come with a C: partition and a D: partition.)

            I suspect that you are right – that many users will not do a clean install for years. I’ve not done one since 2013 when I installed Windows 7 on my current PC. But, prior to that, during my working life (I’m retired now), I’ve installed Windows NT, Windows 2000 and Windows XP, so I’m not apprehensive about installing Windows 10.

            • This reply was modified 2 months, 3 weeks ago by TonyC.
          • #2100084 Reply
            CBA
            AskWoody Plus

            The reason I suggest this now is that 1909 is a good version – it adds little to 1903 so it is basically 1903 service pack 1…

            @anonymous: Any chance that you posted here: https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/why-upgrade-from-1809-to-1903-now/#post-2089014

      • #2085580 Reply
        Twindle
        AskWoody Plus

        Hi, I’ve read the “Askwoodyplus Issue 17.11 – 2020-01 Alert MS Defcon 5” and understand it is now time to move to version 1903, but the only available version to download that is showing on my computer is Windows 10 version 1909. If I start the download, will I be offered the version 1903 or is this version 1909 being forced upon me? My current Windows 10 Pro is version 1809. Any help you might be able to offer is appreciated.

        • #2085665 Reply
          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          There are two ways to get it.
          Heidoc. You download the required ISO, mount it and run Setup.exe as admin.
          AveYo. You run the batch file on your PC and it will ask you what version you want, then install it for you.

          cheers, Paul

        • #2085687 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          Under Windows Update settings, click on “Advanced Settings.
          Set the Feature Update deferral to 130 days, Quality Update deferral to o.
          Reboot the computer
          Use wushowhide to verify 1903 is being orrered. If 1909 is offered, HIDE it and run wushowhide again.
          If 1903 is now offered, you can update to 1903

      • #2085581 Reply
        KYKaren
        AskWoody Plus

        Since June, 2019 I have been running Windows 10, version 1903, x64 on two laptops, one about 3 years older than the other.

        • On Nov 12, 2019 the Windows Update screen on both of the laptops offered version 1909 with a “Download and Install” link, but I never clicked on it b/c I have been waiting for MS-DEFCON to change to a 3 or higher.
        • On Dec 11, 2019 the December patches for version 1903, x64 installed without a problem (KB4530684 and KB4533002) and the Windows Update screen continued to offer version 1909, but still I did not click on the “Download and Install” link for version 1909.
        • On Jan 14, 2020 the January patches for 1903, x64 installed (KB4528760 and KB4532938).  I find no problems on the two laptops, other than the fact that the Windows Update screen no longer offers version 1909 with a “Download and Install” link.
        • Is this because I never clicked on it after it was offered?  Or could it be that a compatability issue has now been found and a safeguard hold is now in place?

        Offline: Win7Pro ∙ SP1 ∙ x64
        Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-6500U ∙ RAM 12GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender
        Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-8565U ∙ RAM 16GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #2085666 Reply
          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          Guess: Maybe the 1909 update is on hold for machines running the latest patches?

          Give it a few days / week and let us know if the update reappears.

          cheers, Paul

        • #2086770 Reply
          Sailor
          AskWoody Lounger

          I have the same.

          1 user thanked author for this post.
          • #2086784 Reply
            KYKaren
            AskWoody Plus

            I have the same.

            I am still waiting for the Download and Install” button for version 1909 to return.  I’ll give it a few more days.

            Offline: Win7Pro ∙ SP1 ∙ x64
            Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-6500U ∙ RAM 12GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender
            Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-8565U ∙ RAM 16GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender

      • #2085903 Reply
        agegagh
        AskWoody Plus

        Defender will update anyway – look again in a while and the update will no longer be pending.

        Mine has been saying “Updates are ready to download for Security Intelligence Update for Windows Defender Antivirus – KB2267602 (Version 1.307.2384.0)” for about 24 hours now.

         

        • #2087016 Reply
          Paul T
          AskWoody MVP

          I always install the Windows Defender updates – it’s the first line of defence.
          Not had any issues.

          cheers, Paul

      • #2088210 Reply
        Cijan
        AskWoody Plus

        I have win 10 1903 HOME version (updated from 1809 early January and manually installed the Dec patches).
        I used the (new to me in 1903) ‘pause’ to pause updates until Feb 17.
        I also followed all the usual recommendations for previous versions of Win 10 Home (i.e. metered connection, hide updates with Wushowhide).

        Question 1- does the ‘Pause’ prevent Wushowhide from showing any and all updates?

        I expected to see the January Service Stack/Cum Updates in wushowhide, but I keep checking Wushowhide and there is nothing showing up to hide. I didn’t expect the ‘pause’ to prevent wushowhide from doing it’s job.

        Question 2 – is it possible I need a newer downloaded version of wushowhide? Mine is a couple of years old.

        • #2088222 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          Yes, wushowhide shows patches that are being offered to you machine. When you use Pause, the patches are not offered for the Pause period. Wushowhide cannot make them offered if they are not offered by WU.

          In Win10, the SSU is bundled with the CU, but doesn’t show up in the pending updates. I believe it presents itself with the same KB as the CU. On some occasions, you will see what is apparently the CU showing up and being offered for installation a second time. It shows up like that in the Update History too, but when you look in the installed updates, there are two different patches and the SSU has a different KB number. The CU isn’t listed twice.

          To my knowledge there is no “newer version” of wushowhide, only one.

          • #2088227 Reply
            Cijan
            AskWoody Plus

            Thanks PK, for answering both questions.
            I just hope that I don’t get 1909 shoved at me when I un-pause the January patches or the pause period ends!
            I always relied on wushowhide with previous versions, and it worked well most of the time.

            Just to confirm what you’re saying about CU and SSU:
            Separate KBs for the SSU and CU always showed up for me in wushowhide. Because I installed them manually both would always show up in Control Panel/Programs/View Installed updates AND in Settings/Windows Update/View Update History. The only times the SSU didn’t show up separately is if I let Windows Update automatically.

            • #2088229 Reply
              PKCano
              Da Boss

              Set Metered connections before you end the Pause or it ends itself. Metered connections should give you time to use wushowhide effectively.

              • #2111223 Reply
                Cijan
                AskWoody Plus

                Just an update… here’s what happens when you resume the pause on Win Home 1903, which I’ve decided to do since Woody is recommending we go ahead with the January patches:

                I left my connection set to metered, and hit the resume. Thank goodness it didn’t offer me the V 1903 Feature Update!

                While it was doing that I checked wushowhide and it now shows the same 3 updates (CU, .NET, Win Malware Tool). So, it runs concurrently and there is no way to hide them (which sort of makes sense if wushowhide and Windows Update are using the same process behind the scenes. The good news is that the metered connection does seem prevent them from being installed.

                What is curious, though is that Windows Update went ahead and downloaded the .NET
                Windows Update (pending install until not on metered connection) but the CU and Malware updates are pending download(see attached). Is it related to the size of the download when on a metered connection? See attached.

                Since there is no feature update involved, I’m going to go ahead and choose to download and install.

                Attachments:
              • #2111236 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                Yes, it has to do with the size of the CU.

                1 user thanked author for this post.
      • #2088350 Reply
        KYKaren
        AskWoody Plus

        Guess: Maybe the 1909 update is on hold for machines running the latest patches?

        Give it a few days / week and let us know if the update reappears.

        cheers, Paul

        OK, it appeared just now … a week after it disappeared.

        Offline: Win7Pro ∙ SP1 ∙ x64
        Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-6500U ∙ RAM 12GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender
        Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-8565U ∙ RAM 16GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender

      • #2110123 Reply
        KYKaren
        AskWoody Plus

        Look at the GUI settings here, and the Group Policy setting

        My Group Policy Editor  (Windows 10 Pro, version 1909) looks nothing at all like the screenshots in the references you provide.  See what mine looks like.

        group-policy-editor

         

        Offline: Win7Pro ∙ SP1 ∙ x64
        Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-6500U ∙ RAM 12GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender
        Online: Win10Pro ∙ 1909.18363 ∙ x64 ∙ i7-8565U ∙ RAM 16GB ∙ SSD ∙ Firefox ∙ McAfee Internet Security ∙ Windows Defender

        Attachments:
        • #2110129 Reply
          b
          AskWoody Plus

          Open (by single-clicking arrow, or double-clicking section titles):

          (Computer Configuration),
          Administrative Templates, Windows Components, Windows Updates,
          then Configure Automatic Updates (on right).

          Windows 10 Pro Version 2004: Group ASAP (chump/pioneer)

        • #2110201 Reply
          PKCano
          Da Boss

          It is a tree structure, like File Explorer. Each of those catagories, like Administrative Templets, Expand into sub aategories.

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