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Hello,

I attempted to go ahead and update computer with the April rollup KB4093118 and excluded 1/18 and 2/18 quality rollups that included Framework 3.5.1 etc…) that was among the 15 total updates, with 9 optional.
Ok, after I installed the April rollup and the security KB’s (updates) that, by the way, I followed another guy’s thread on here (or from this site) that seemed to be alright with the same security updates that he installed, etc…at any rate, after it concluded it came up with the alert that some updates failed to install. I rolled back the computer to an earlier time because of the sluggish behavior of machine and couldn’t log onto the internet and so, at this point, i think i shall wait until a later date or time to update unless anyone (or Woody) has any suggestions or ideas from my describing thus far my issue, etc…?

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leis

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This is actual my thread or topic & I saved it as anonymous in error…and another error–i thanked myself.

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Elly

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@leis, well your accidental action brought your topic to my attention, so maybe that’s a good thing. I’ll see if my style is helpful. You have not said how familiar with AskWoody the site, its jargon, and its peculiar approach to monthly patching you were before posting.

I’ve looked at your other topic, and PKCano’s reply. It is unfortunate you could not come current to April before the May release. You do not say how the directions from Woody that PKCano linked failed you, or what error may have shown. I have a suspicion, but it can wait to the end.

First, some assumptions I’m making from your brief description, based on details and how you wrote them. Please, it may turn out important if I have made a mistake here, correct any and all bad presumptions. You are running Windows7sp1 on a stand alone computer, connected to a home network that might include other peer devices, but this machine does not rely on any other computer to connect to the internet, just a router/modem that may also serve those other devices. Please reply with corrections to my reading.

Next, I am not clear on what you meant here…

anonymous wrote:

… I rolled back the computer to an earlier time because of the sluggish behavior of machine and couldn’t log onto the internet and so, at this point, i think i shall wait until a later date …

As you have posted twice, either connecting to the internet has been repaired by a method not described, or you are using another device. Please explain. Also in that quoted line, “an earlier time” is vague. That may not matter, but going forward please be descriptive with dates or events and actions taken.

To get things back in line, read Woody’s original post at the top of AKB2000004: How to Apply the Win7 and 8.1 Monthly Rollups, and do Steps A1 and A2. I have chosen to point you to the GroupA directions, because you already stated interest in the full monthly rollup. If I have misunderstood your preference, please correct me. Normally, these GroupA directions stand on their own. Your unusual condition demands some interpretation.

Before continuing to step A3, I would like to insert an additional task for you here. If you are looking at the list of updates available, hit [ESC] to return to the main display of the Windows Update interface.

From the lefthand sidebar, select ‘Restore hidden updates’. Under the section headed ‘Windows 7’, tick each box to select every line item, and click on [Restore], and give the administrator approval for changes. This will trigger another ‘Checking for updates’ cycle, let it run. With the settings in place from Step A1, Windows Update will behave itself.

When the new ‘Checking for updates’ is complete, Windows Update should return an AMBER shield message, with an offer of some number of updates available. That is the good result. We do not expect a GREEN shield message, because you have reported not being current. You may see a RED shield message, and an error code. Make a note of any code number given. In any of these cases close the Windows Update interface window. Set aside thoughts of GroupA, because there is another task to look into.

Now read through Noel Carboni’s original post at the top of AKB1000001: Using the System File Checker. And when you are familiar with where the directions may go, begin the process Noel describes. Whenever you have gotten to where the Command Prompt returns the message “Windows Resource Protection did not find any integrity violations.” then you are done. If you are not able to get this message. Come back and ask for more help.

Now return to AKB2000004, and read from the top again, to make sure all is as you expect it to be; and continue with step A3. In addition to KB3150513 listed in Woody’s directions, uncheck KB971033 and KB2952664 if they appear in the Important list. Now that May’s 2ndTuesday has passed, also uncheck KB890830(MAY2018 MSRT), KB4099633(2018-05 .NET Rollup), KB4103718(2018-05 SMQR), and KB4093113(2018-04 Preview). Hide every line item on the Important page that is now displayed as not checked.

When set to ‘Never…’ all Recommended updates should appear on the separate page with the other Optional items, and all of these will be unchecked as well. As always do not check anything that is not preselected. Hiding on this page is not required. Click [OK] to return to the main display of Windows Update. But do not install yet.

Instead, from the left-hand sidebar, select ‘Check for updates’ again. When complete, review the offered Important list again. If any of those same 7items above reappear, uncheck them again. You should be left with KB4093118(2018-04 SMQR) and any other appropriate April update offered as checked Important. Because you have also done some rollback of previous Rollup cumulative updates, there may be more updates listed that date back quite some time. I had nine of them offered. It is expected. Let Windows Update take care of this duplicate work for you. Hide every line item on the Important page that is now displayed as not checked.

Click [OK] to return to the main display of Windows Update. And this time, continue with Steps A4 and A5. If additional repeats are called for use the possible list of 7important items above in step A3.

When the GREEN shield message comes where only optional updates are left on offer, then you can decide what, if any, are appropriate for you. Also remember that you have hidden the MAY2018 rollups. They will need to be Restored when the MSDefcon rating raises to 3 or above. Ask more questions if needed.
—
Edit to add: the suspected explanation. There may have been a patch that you passed over, if you only selected the rollup. Hopefully this time you kept all the ‘old’ patches as checked important, and allowed Windows Update to sort it all out for you. Please report back if this has failed a second time.

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DriveBee, cesmart4125, Elly

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Thanks a lot for your response to my question and I must say right off, it isn’t with full clarity that I worded or lodged the question or topic that you found (and glad you did) and REALLY thank you a lot for answering and providing all the details and recommendations that I will certainly follow, despite my vague kind of not-too-detailed way of putting my topic into the Q and A’s on Windows 7 forum.

I am going to follow from the start of your provided….reading Woody’s (orig.) post atop or before AK2000004 and it will take maybe even to the weekend for the time in working through and understanding the details but I am anxious and again, Thank You A Lot!

In answering your question, yes, this is stand-alone PC, there are no additional devices I use, or connect other than (only) my Windows Lumia 640 cell phone to transfer pictures to PC and that’s really it.
This is a Dell Optiplex 980 I purchased new (in a bit of a hurry after other desktop/PC was lost in a minor rain leakage where I live, etc…). I bought it from a friend’s shop in Van Nuys (Calif.) where he is ‘Microsoft Certified’ PC tech, and has a SSD in place of Hard Drive. To describe:
Intel Core i5CPU  650 at 3.20 GHz, 3.19Hz          4 GB Mem.         (3.80 avail or usable)  64-bit OS,   and as you mentioned (yes) SP1     (it says 2009 Microsoft)    Win 7     Pro.
(Not necessarily info. needed but just to sort of mention) from the initial selection of buying computer, they really recommended i keep the Win. 10 OS but I really insisted as a customer buying computer, I’d be better suited with Win. 7 and that was more or less based on or from looking back at the initial Win 10’s over zealous push-on of telemetry issues and it seemed (or in my own way as I say) like, Win. 7 was being mistreated or downgraded in order to promote this Win. 10, etc..yada . Though they disagreed with me on those issues and how I came about or where was this coming from (?) ….I still got the Win 7. 🙂
That probably couldn’t have happen or turn out in my favor at a normal retailer, i mean, to disengage with-already Win. 10 to Win. 7 OS.
I connect-or my ISP is Time Warner aka …  Spectrum Charter, which ev…and purchased own modem, Surfboard SB61241 (modem only, no router or wifi).

So, more to the reason for my question/your response and ….Yes, I’d say you seem to be just about spot-on or absolute when you seemed to maybe pick up on my following or trying to compare my updating April’s rollup from Group A, etc…that must have been the PkCamano’s topic and that was just my own ‘guess’ or knowing that that’s a shot in the dark but from a few things included or comparing what kind of looked like maybe i had about the same kind of updates (to date) from reading that topic, and the long story–i just had hoped to install the April-lot (or updates from the rollup) and and hope they fell right into place without issues or from the many topics of the presiding months and happenings that I dreaded trying to get into, it seemed and the patch-work that that’s a good description ‘work’ is what it looked like and a lot of….!  Also having Intel chip, i feared the Spectre mess or from the onset of news about that that still yet, I’m not real clear on that and no need to mention further…

So, just a recap of what I tried describing…after the April updates I attempted that came back with some of the updates failed to install-alert, and where the computer seemed sluggish and instant warning from Firefox that there was no internet access…I kind of got excited and opted for the rollback to earlier time method and chose the first or only date and i can’t remember that date, but ‘critical update’ or at that update-moment i quickly hit the go-ahead-OK and it rolled back to earlier time line and is fine or from that, I haven’t updated anything to this night when BTW, i discovered your response!

As for following this site and understanding the jargon, etc…I’m not an amateur but am not part of the Group A getting A’s in the head of the class (neither) but I do enjoy and have gained a lot from this site, believe it or not and am glad it’s on my favorites and either way, am learning as I go and there’s a lot of intelligence or other people that also have input to share their own experiences, etc…that to the point or bottom line, I’m glad this site is here!!

I would like to follow back up or apprise of my results, maybe, from following your (again) fine outline that you freely have given and again, that’s pretty special too and before going too far out or over-doing that maybe, I will just say, I will be glad to contribute and donate, etc…and show my own gratitude and Thank ya A Lot!

 

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Cascadian, Elly

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Presuming anonymous is @leis, I am glad you returned. Please, if posting without signing in, either greet at top or close at bottom with your handle, to reduce possible confusion.

I see now that fixing this computer is a task to fit into time you do not have every day. That sounds like most people, and is understandable. You have been very helpful with information. I agree it can be hard to know what the important information is. That’s OK, too. You’ve helped with what you have shared.

My long post was intended to be helpful all the way through, in a general way, in case you did not respond. It still holds true with what you have added. But I must acknowledge that I made an error in when I described how Windows Update will display recommended updates later in the directions.

Before looking at those directions again, I want to point out a Real World solution. I will not be offering to remote connect to your computer to perform any task. I would not trust most sources who tried. But following troubleshooting advice can be tedious. If this is a recent purchase that has failed to update the very first attempt, you may want to pursue a solution through your friendly Van Nuys local technician. I have no reason to think that shop would not honor a good customer relationship. Hands on beats online every time. If time has passed or changes have been made that makes this not repairable through the retailer’s own warranty policy, then these directions may be helpful.

So to recap:
GroupA describes one of two methods that were created in response to changes Microsoft made a couple years ago. It more closely matches your habits, and so I linked to that set of directions. GroupA relies on the Windows Update interface to sort out the complex questions of ‘does this replace that?’

The first step, A1, takes control manually, and set the presentation of offered updates in a predictable way.

Step A2, the first new ‘Check for updates’, includes a catch for machines that maybe have not updated correctly for a very long time. Usually a check for update returns results in ten minutes or less. Unusually, this may take longer. Only under very old conditions would this take hours. I think you have already passed this check. Please report back if you needed to follow Woody’s link to Canadian Tech’s solution.

Step A2 also gives Windows Update the opportunity to compare your computer against an Ideal List according to Microsoft. Then it will compare to other settings and create a list to offer updates. It will also reinterpret the hidden updates list with reference to new information, and may make changes to that list as well.

This is where I inserted the step to restore any hidden item from the Windows 7 section of the ‘Restore hidden updates’ list. This was to make sure that an obscure necessary update was not already hidden sometime in the past. With that groundwork done, or verified that nothing was necessary because all these conditions were already true, I suggest you close the Windows Update interface. Without accepting any current offers yet.

Some condition caused April to not work out correctly for you. This is a good point to let a different feature of Windows 7 to help you with a self-assessment of the operating system. That lead me to link to Noel Carboni’s topic. When that is successful with a “Windows Resource Protection did not find any integrity violations.” message, you will have a choice.

You can choose to go ahead with Windows Update, following the GroupA directions as written, beginning to end, and install the May Rollups. This is not yet recommended at AskWoody, but has been done by several household users without presenting a problem.

If you would prefer to follow the MSDefcon rating system, and pursue only updates to come current to April, then please return here to discuss more accurately what individual update numbers need to hide and how Windows Update will list the items you want to install. The directions given in my previous post will work, but may have been written poorly, allowing for misunderstanding.

Look forward to reading your result, or progress along the way.

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Cascadian,
Sorry for not logging in when i replied to your reply. (a 2nd time…duh) but I wanted to update that I followed through the directions from the start-through, including the inserted process of picking up 7 hidden items on the restoration and from this point, it’s all fine! So, I’ll keep ahead more timely and watch the future patch work, etc. (here) and I thank you a LOT for your time and knowledge in this regard!

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Cascadian

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Hello leis, I agree not signing in is such a minor detail that I actually felt a little bad at mentioning it. It really only becomes difficult when the third ‘anonymous’ voice joins a conversation. For myself, I had made a few posts on AskWoody without joining, it is a wonderful freedom here. But I did make an account after being in topic thread with two others, and found I could not tell who was whom. So the tip was meant to be preventative rather than scolding. Thanks for being so kind.

It is good to read everything worked out. Going forward should be easier, so long as Microsoft does their part first. Glad I could help.

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walker

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Hi Cascadian,
Yeh, Thanks again for this reply too. And no-that’s-your mention of logging in’s only right & I didn’t take it offensive at all. It was almost like-oh yeh, put your seat belt on or something like that, you know what I mean. But I’m glad you took the time and went through my vague kind of topic and it did get me going (again) and right on, at least from this point it’s fine and hopefully MS will stay as such.
Take care Man!

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Cascadian

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Hello I am new to this site. I have HP Elite Desktop Windows 7 Professional 64 bit Operating System. I have a small online business and depend on Windows 7 for all of my software I use to manage my website. When Windows 10 came out I had to change my update settings from automatic to “Check for updates but let me choose whether to install them” to keep Microsoft from forcing/changing my machine to Windows 10 without my knowledge. Every update that came in, I went online to check and determine if it was a hidden update to W10 or some other sneaky thing that had nothing to do with my operating system. This was time consuming, but I felt no other way to deal with Microsoft and their aggressive push to Windows 10. Last month when the updates came in, I went to the usual “check for information” on each update and found that this information was no longer there-it has disappeared and just takes me to a useless Microsoft page. Searching online, I found all of the talk about KB4103718 and KB4103712 causing problems for many people so I did not install, just made them “hidden”. Recently went online to search for more info on my missing updates and what to do, and found this website I am going to try to research each update before allowing it to download. Thank you for this site. Please forgive me, I am not as technically advanced as many of your posters seem to be. I have two questions for using this site: (1) What category of Windows 7 am I, Group A or Group B? And do you have any advice for how I can navigate this site to research all new updates before downloading? In the meantime, I will keep trying to find my way around, this site looks like exactly what I need to monitor what I feel is Microsoft forcing a computer system change on me (w-10)that would ruin my ability to manage my website.

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If you have been doing your updating through Windows Update, you are in Group A. Group B requires download and manual install of the security-only and IE11 cumulative updates.

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Lyncamille

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Running W7 HP 64 bit on Dell Desktop.  My “update” setting is “check for updates but let me choose…”  Since becoming aware of this site earlier this year, I have followed the guidelines here re which updates to install and when to do it.  This morning on startup the blue “configuring updates” appeared with no input from me, and MS has installed 98 updates, and based on the serial numbers, some of them are quite old.  Should I uninstall all of them, accept them, or ….what?  All advice appreciated!

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Check your settings again. Sometimes when you install other MS products (like Office, Silverlight, MSE, etc) or IE gets updated there is a box that pops up and asks if you want “Recommended” settings or keep your current settings. “Recommended” is the default, and if you OK it, it will reset the Windows Update settings to Automatic (Recommended, of course).

Did this perhaps happen to you?

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Slowpoke47

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Hello @Slowpoke47-

Sometimes, when you look at Windows Updates, and choose not to install them, they remain checked by default… if you don’t uncheck them, then click on apply, they assume you want to install all the checked ones if you restart your machine. If they are sitting there unchecked, but you don’t hit apply, and you close Windows Update… well, they recheck themselves by default… and if you restart your machine, they will install. I’ve been hit by that before, and once I figured it out, I decided to keep it on Never Check for Updates, and then run check for updates manually when I want to see what is there… and I’m there to research, decide, and apply the decision.

The easiest thing, if you are Group A, might be to specifically look for the telemetry baddies, and uninstall them. You say you are following the guidelines here, but they are different for Group A and B… so knowing which ones would help people help you (you could put it in your signature- which you can edit in your profile, so you don’t have to repeat it each time you have a question).

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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Slowpoke47

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Elly wrote:

Hello @Slowpoke47- Sometimes, when you look at Windows Updates, and choose not to install them, they remain checked by default… if you don’t uncheck them, then click on apply, they assume you want to install all the checked ones if you restart your machine. If they are sitting there unchecked, but you don’t hit apply, and you close Windows Update… well, they recheck themselves by default… and if you restart your machine, they will install. I’ve been hit by that before, and once I figured it out, I decided to keep it on Never Check for Updates, and then run check for updates manually when I want to see what is there… and I’m there to research, decide, and apply the decision. The easiest thing, if you are Group A, might be to specifically look for the telemetry baddies, and uninstall them. You say you are following the guidelines here, but they are different for Group A and B… so knowing which ones would help people help you (you could put it in your signature- which you can edit in your profile, so you don’t have to repeat it each time you have a question).

Thank you, I’m not at all sure what happened.  But I’ll follow your advice.  What’s the difference, Group A or B?

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Elly

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You mean Group A, Group B, and Group W, What’s the Difference? (AskWoody Knowledge Base Article 2000011).

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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PKCano wrote:

Check your settings again. Sometimes when you install other MS products (like Office, Silverlight, MSE, etc) or IE gets updated there is a box that pops up and asks if you want “Recommended” settings or keep your current settings. “Recommended” is the default, and if you OK it, it will reset the Windows Update settings to Automatic (Recommended, of course). Did this perhaps happen to you?

Just checked again, still set to the “check…but let me choose” option.  But I do see what may amount to a disclaimer at the bottom of the screen, “Windows may update automatically when checking for other updates.”  In other words, we’ll do what we want, regardless.

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I’m  Group A,  Win 7×64.  Same with me  check  but let me decide.  Just had that last week.  They installed 664 snoop again without my permission.  I just  keep deleting it.  I do not down load previews

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…“Windows may update automatically when checking for other updates.”…

This simply means that Windows Update may update its own files or inner workings (update itself) when checking for other updates. I have the same wording at the very bottom of my copy of Windows Update’s settings box:

“Note: Windows might update itself automatically first when checking for other updates.  Read our privacy statement online.”

I hope this clarifies things for everyone. I added the italics emphasis to the statement immediately above this sentence.

So, time to remove any tinfoil hats anyone may have donned…for now.

After all, nothing says that Microsoft won’t start treating Windows 7 users like they treat Windows 10 users and begin ramming poor quality updates (both security and non security) down our throats whether we like it or not by having Windows Update completely ignore our update settings! I hope @Slowpoke47 isn’t one of the first unpaid beta testers for this concept but (this is where I put on my own tinfoil hat) it sure sounds like he is, from what’s been described by him, @Elly and @PKCano in the posts just above this one.

@Slowpoke47 , th edifference between groups A, B, and W in a nutshell is:

Group A takes the monthly security and quality rollups (one big cumulative update that has security, non security and Internet Explorer fixes in it) and installs them when Woody gives us the go ahead by raising the defcon level to three or higher. The rollups may include telemetry which some folks don’t want at all.

Group B doesn’t install the monthly rollups but, instead, installs the monthly security-only updates. These are a smaller file that isn’t cumulative and, as its name implies, only includes the monthly security fixes for Windows and nothing else. This is accompanied by installing the monthly Internet Explorer security update, which is cumulative but isn’t included in the security-only monthly update. These are installed when Da Boss raises the defcon level to 3 or higher.

Finally, Group W is just sitting tight and mostly hasn’t installed any security updates since late 2016 or some time in 2017 (I can’t remember exactly when) because Microsoft, in changing things to the current update system, also did away with (laid off, fired) most of their quality and testing staff they had for these patches, making some of the patches cause major problems with one’s computer, and the folks in Group W don’t want to have anything to do with that concept.

@PKCano or @Elly, please feel free to correct any part of the previous paragraph that may be incorrect about Group W.

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walker, OscarCP, Elly

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anonymous wrote:

This simply means that Windows Update may update its own files or inner workings (update itself) when checking for other updates.

Thank you for clarifying that! Not sure I’m putting my tinfoil hat away, though…

Hmm… not sure about any particular dates associated with Group W, as it tends to be used by an independent bunch. Some people have always tended to get their OS just the way they want it, and not worry about potential security flaws… and restore from frequent back-ups if something happens. Was sitting on the Group W bench myself for a while this year.

@Canadian Tech updates Windows 7 in a specific way that ended up being Group W since May 2017. He detailed what he does for his clients, and reports they have few, if any problems in #183333.

I love Woody’s link regarding Group W, found at #35813. There are some people quite happy with Windows 7, who are looking at joining Group W when it hits end of life in 2020.

I believe that Woody defined the Group system just before Microsoft implemented cummulative rollup updating, clarifying what our choices were, going forward, in How to prepare for the Windows 7/8.1 ‘patchocalypse’ on October 10, 2016. Some people were choosing only security updates prior to that, and had been avoiding any telemetry… but I don’t think we had a name or identity until then. Woody has been giving updating advice based on Groups A and B since then. I, for one, am very grateful…

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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walker, HiFlyer

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Hello I need some advice. I have a HP Elite Desktop Windows 7 Professional 64 bit Operating System computer still in the box…it is a duplicate to my current computer I am still using. I would like to get it up and running to download all the updates to the system it is missing. I usually check my updates before downloading to avoid windows 10 highjacking. I am asking how I should go about this I know to avoid KB2952664 and KB4493132. Do I just download in small batches as they come in until I am caught up? Will the updates to the operating system find my machine going back to 2014?

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There are two procedures iinked here.

You will probably want to do the Group A patching. That starts from a clean install.
The Group B patching starts from a computer that has been offline like yours.
Read through them, then apply the method in the Group B update but use the Group A patches. In other words, you will start with 2014 and move forward instead of starting with a clean install.

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walker, Lyncamille

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