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  • Woody’s instructions on creating an iso file for version 1909

    Posted on KYKaren Comment on the AskWoody Lounge

    Home Forums AskWoody support Windows Windows 10 Questions: Win10 Woody’s instructions on creating an iso file for version 1909

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      • #2266176 Reply
        KYKaren
        AskWoody Plus

        I am following the instructions of Woody at Making like a squirrel

        I have received an explanation of one of Woody’s steps (“choose a place to put the file, give it a name that you’ll be able to identify in the future — say, Win10 1909.iso or something similar — and stick the file someplace you’ll be able to find it.”) It’s from @PKCano at discussion with PKCano, but he says that I have to create a topic to continue the discussion.

        So, here goes:
        I am going to save the iso file to the Desktop with a specific name, as he suggests. He also says “If it asks, tell it ‘not for this PC’ and it will create a generic installer that you can use anywhere.”

        So, in let me follow up with another question: I have two laptops, both running Windows 10/Pro, version 1909, build 18363.778. What factors determine whether a) I create a generic installer or b) I create one specific to the laptop? In other words, is it better to create a generic installer? Or is it better to go to the other laptop and create another iso file that is specific to it?

        If the answer is a), then I assume that when I copy it to a USB flash drive, the iso file can be used with both laptops?
        If the answer is b), then I assume that I will need to go to the other laptop, go through the whole process of creating an iso file there, and then copy the iso file to a 2nd USB flash drive?

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      • #2266195 Reply
        PKCano
        Da Boss

        You only need one ISO.

        If you create the bootable install media from the ISO (DVD or bootable USB), you can use the same media to install Win v1909 on either/both machines
        It works the same as having a DVD to install Office (for example), you can install Office on any computer.

        Your other possibility is to copy/paste the ISO to the two machines, mount the ISO as a disk on each machine, and install from the mounted ISO on each machine.

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      • #2266212 Reply
        KYKaren
        AskWoody Plus

        I like your 2nd suggestion, which seems a lot simpler to me, but it presumes that the machine works so that you can copy the iso file to it or if it is on the machine already, you can access it. So, in the cirucumstance where the machine is not working, it seems like you would need a bootable version.

        It sounds like the iso file is not bootable itself, but instead, you have to create a bootable version from the iso file you have created with the MCT (i.e., the iso file that you have saved to the desktop and/or copied/pasted to a USB flash drive or a USB harddrive). So, how do you get a bootable version from that iso file, in the event I would need one that is bootable?

        Can you mount an ISO as a disk on one machine and then install it on another machine?

        I should add that I would like to be able to use the iso file as the source in a DISM command, too, such as DISM /Online /Cleanup-Image /RestoreHealth /Source:X:sources\install.wim or DISM /Get-WimInfo /WimFile:x:\sources\install.esd /index:1 ). If the iso is bootable, will these DISM commands work?

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      • #2266235 Reply
        PKCano
        Da Boss

        Here is what the ISO looks like COPIED to my 128GB flash drive – ONE BIG file.
        I copied/pasted it to my desktop – it shows up as if it were a DVD disk.

        1

        Right click on the ISO, choose “Open with” and Windows Explorer

        2

        When Explorer opens, you see the contents of the ISO. It is mounted as if it were a DVD drive with a drive letter F:
        If you want to do an in-place install of Windows, you double click on setup.exe – but you see the ISO is the container for the files and folders of the installer.

        3

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        • #2266292 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          Your screenshots have been incredibly helpful – visually down to the nuts and bolts.

          So, doing A or B depends on whether the problematic machine is alive/responding or not?

          A.  if the problematic laptop is still alive (i.e, it is responding), accessing the iso file is the route to go?  (as you illustrate in #2266235).

          When doing this in-place install, does everything look the same as before – (i.e., all the programs that have been installed are there, all the updated drivers are present, all the Windows settings are intact, etc, etc.)?

          B. And if the problematic laptop is not responding, then there needs to be a burned DVD or a “burned flash drive” available? ( as you illustrate in your second note at #2266241).

          I say “burned flash drive” because my machine does not have a built-in CD/DVD drive.  And to get this in the MCT tool, I would choose “USB flash drive” at the Choose which Media to use screen?

          At this point, as you can see, I need to back up a bit: What is the purpose of doing A or B or both?  Is the reason to be able to get the machine working again if something goes wrong when installing a Tuesday Patch CU?  (In other words, access the iso file, if it is responding or use the bootable media, if it is not responding)?

          Or are there other reasons, such as making an iso file so that you can use the DISM command with a source argument, if something needs to be fixed because some system files have been corrupted. Or other reasons?  (I am assuming that the source argument in the DISM command is always in an iso file, but maybe I am wrong about that).

          In other words, now that I understand the difference between making an iso file and making bootable media, why would one want/need to do A or B?

          P.S.  I hope I can get a good grounding in all of this.  I’ve been very complacent through XP, Vista, and Win7, always assuming that nothing is going to go wrong.  But now I am aware that Windows 10 is always an experiment of sorts.

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      • #2266241 Reply
        PKCano
        Da Boss

        On the other hand, if you want to create install media, you burn the ISO to a DVD or make a bootable USB. I use CD Burner XP Pro for burning DVDs. So this time I put a DVD in the burner and I chose “Open with” CDBurner XP.

        4

        It will burn the CONTENTS (not the single ISO file) onto the DVD. The results – if you look at the contents of the DVD drive, you will see the same contents as above in the 3rd screenshot. To install Windows you click on setup.exe

        5

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        • #2266421 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          How long will this post (and others) remain on the server? Is there a limit to the shelflife of these posts?

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        • #2266454 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          I noticed that the iso file on the Desktop has the name that you gave to it (image #1), but the DVD drive (F:) and its contents has no indication of the name of the iso file (image #2).

          It looks to me that if you don’t write on the DVD the name of the iso file used to create it, you will never know what iso file was used to create it. (The same probably goes for a bootable USB flash drive.)

          Or is there some information somewhere inside those DVD folders/files that tells you the name of the iso file that was used to create them?

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          • #2266470 Reply
            PKCano
            Da Boss

            Go back and read through this thread. It explains how to find what is in the ISO, and my explanation of what you see (and what you don’t). You will find a great deal of misunderstanding it the thread.
            But, yes, you need to label the install media (the ISO file has an appropriate name you gave it) according to the time it was created and what Build it contains.

            IMG_0367

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            • #2266535 Reply
              KYKaren
              AskWoody Plus

              Yes, I read all of that yesterday, even before my first post. I especially noted the post from Woody that provided the DISM command to get the information about version/build and I also read your posts that it is really 18363.592, even though the DISM results say 18362.592.

              On the other hand, my concern is that when I used the MCT to create the ISO file, I checked the box to make the iso file specific to my machine. And when I saved the iso file to my Desktop, the model of the machine is in the filename. But, the iso filename I gave it is not in the DISM results. So, I think that there is no way to tell which machine the bootable DVD or bootable USB flash drive is specific to, unless this information is actually written on the bootable media.

              I want to confirm that.

              Or perhaps the filename of the iso file that was used to created bootable device is somewhere in the bootable device folders and I don’t know where to look?

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      • #2266296 Reply
        PKCano
        Da Boss

        When doing this in-place install, does everything look the same as before – (i.e., all the programs that have been installed are there, all the updated drivers are present, all the Windows settings are intact, etc, etc.)?

        If you choose to keep your programs and data, it just re-installs Windows OS .
        The other options are to keep JUST your data (installed programs will be lost), OR to keep nothing in which case it does a clean install (wipes everything).

        If the OS (software) is inoperable and the hardware is healthy, then you boot from the install media (instead of the hard drive) and you can do a clean install. You need to make a bootable USB drive from the ISO instead of a DVD. Search the site for Rufus (the name of the program to help you create the bootable USB). It works the same as the DVD.

        The reason for making an ISO now is to keep 1909 available. Otherwise, once 2004 comes out, the ISO that the MCT makes is 2004 not 1909. So you won’t have an easy way to reinstall  1909.

        .And you most certainly need to make a full system image and a separate data backup before you start all the updating

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        • #2266315 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          You need to make a bootable USB drive from the ISO instead of a DVD. Search the site for Rufus (the name of the program to help you create the bootable USB). It works the same as the DVD.

          Are you saying that choosing  “USB flash drive” at the MCT’s Choose which Media to use screen (instead of choosing “iso file”) would not give me the bootable USB flash drive that I would otherwise use Rufus to make?

          Choose-which-media-to-use-1

           

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          • #2266326 Reply
            Paul T
            AskWoody MVP

            Save it as ISO because, a: it’s simple to store, b: it mounts in Windows for ease of use,  c: you can use it to create a bootable USB with Rufus if you need it.

            cheers, Paul

        • #2266566 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          When doing this in-place install,

          OK. Since the iso file is up through build 592 (released on Patch Tuesday Jan, 2020), then when the O/S is installed-in place, will Windows Update then come into play to do the subsequent Patch Tuesday CUs (Group Policy Editor>Computer Configuration>Administrative Templates>Windows Components>Windows Update>Configure Automatic Updates = 2 Notify download/install )?

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          • #2266573 Reply
            PKCano
            Da Boss

            If you do an in-place-upgrade and choose to keep your programs and data, your settings will remain the same.
            If you do a clean install you start all over from scratch.

            • #2266587 Reply
              KYKaren
              AskWoody Plus

              Are the WUs system files? or data files?

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              • #2266597 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                WUs??

                If you put them on your computer – they are data. Are they in Documents?

      • #2266352 Reply
        Alex5723
        AskWoody Plus

        You need to make a bootable USB drive from the ISO instead of a DVD. Search the site for Rufus (the name of the program to help you create the bootable USB). It works the same as the DVD.

        Are you saying that choosing  “USB flash drive” at the MCT’s Choose which Media to use screen (instead of choosing “iso file”) would not give me the bootable USB flash drive that I would otherwise use Rufus to make?

        Choose-which-media-to-use-1

         

        It will just create a ISO file, not a bootable USB.

        Use Ventoy a much better bootable USB app.

        • #2266392 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          So, you are saying that the choice “USB flash drive” puts an iso file on a it?   If so, “iso file” will do that, too, because the next screen asks for the location for the iso file to be saved, in which case you could specific a USB flash drive.

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          • #2266423 Reply
            Tex265
            AskWoody Plus

            If you look at my post back on the original Woody topic, I used MCT to create the non-iso bootable USB flash drive option.  Then several posts further down, I posted a screen shot of what version is on that USB drive.

            If memory serves me right, at a previous time someone here (PKCano?) mentioned that you can also install from the USB without having to boot from it if you have a running computer.

            Each to their own but I prefer the easy peasy route – make the USB and put it in a safe place – done!

            Windows 10 Pro x64 v1909 and Windows 7 Pro SP1 x64 (RIP)
            • #2266430 Reply
              KYKaren
              AskWoody Plus

              Yes, part of the reason I was asking, in addition to the post from someone who said he used an USB hard drive (and not a flash drive) and everything that had been on it was deleted!

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              • #2266446 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                If you make the install media on it, yes, it formats and creates bootable media.

                But that does NOT happen it you copy/paste the ISO (single large file) that was created elsewhere to the flash drive. As shown in the screenshot where the ISO is on my 128GB flash drive (assigned drive letter E: in the first screenshot)

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              • #2266455 Reply
                Tex265
                AskWoody Plus

                If you make the install media on it, yes, it formats and creates bootable media.

                Yes, the Install Media USB is what I was referring to and it does first wipe anything on the USB stick/drive.  It also clearly warns you that it is going to do it – read the screens.

                Windows 10 Pro x64 v1909 and Windows 7 Pro SP1 x64 (RIP)
        • #2266409 Reply
          woody
          Da Boss

          I believe KYKaren is correct. Choosing “USB flash drive” at this point reformats the USB drive, and installs a bootable copy of the Win10 1909 installer.

          But you’re also absolutely right, Ventoy (and Rufus) is much better than having the Creation Tool make a bootable drive – and the ISO file is smaller, and can be moved easily. The bootable USB drive is just that.

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      • #2266367 Reply
        mn–
        AskWoody Lounger

        What factors determine whether a) I create a generic installer or b) I create one specific to the laptop? In other words, is it better to create a generic installer? Or is it better to go to the other laptop and create another iso file that is specific to it?

        Well, actually,…

        You only need one ISO.

        … most of the time but not in quite all cases.

        I am certain that there still are weird devices out there that need hardware model specific custom drivers in the install phase. These tend to be (but may not be limited to) either servers with fancy storage devices (“RAID drivers”…) – or ultraportables of some kind.

        Server types, well, you might get by with a “driver disk” instead.

        And I’m certain they’re out there… not certain that they’re still sold new, but at a minimum were sold recently enough that at least some of the servers would still be under warranty.

        All laptop models with this kind of thing that I’ve personally seen should be out of warranty today, though I definitely haven’t seen everything that’s out there…

        • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by mn--. Reason: grammar
        • #2266482 Reply
          CAS
          AskWoody Plus

          I recall that somewhere on this site there is the statement that there are no stupid questions. With that in mind, and after reading through the discussions in this post, I deleted the saved ISO I created using MCT and Win 10 1909 ISO which I copied to a USB drive. I have downloaded Ventoy and in the process of downloading a 5GB version of 1909 from wccftech.com. I have absolutely no idea what to do after the ISO is finally downloaded. (It’s taking forever to complete the ISO download so if there’s a better site for the download, I’m open to suggestions.)

          Once the ISO is finally downloaded how do I transfer the ISO, using Ventoy, to a bootable USB drive so that I have it for the future use. It was easy to do it incorrectly and wind up with something that was useless. This time, I want to do everything correctly.

          Help, please. Thanks in advance.

          CAS

          • #2266599 Reply
            Elly
            AskWoody MVP

            Right! There are no stupid questions!

            Just want to clarify some things. You are not the only person confusing tools and data and process.

            MCT is a tool/program that you download to your computer, that will allow you to either directly upgrade the machine, or create installation media. It is Microsoft’s delivery service. You can choose whether it delivers operating system files specific to your hardware and current operating system, or a generalized set useful to multiple configurations… but it only delivers the current version of W10.

            The ISO is the collection of files, programs, and executables that constitute W10. You may have ISOs for different operating systems, or games… but an ISO is designed to be ‘mounted’ to run. It contains the files that used to come on an original installation disk, back in the day when you had to load your operating system onto your new computer, your self. For a while manufacturers included an installation disk, even if they preloaded the OS, so you had a recovery option. Then they stopped making a separate disk and told you to make your own when first activating and using your computer.

            Rufus or Ventoy allow you to ‘mount’ the ISO for W10 (or ISO of any other operating systems) so you can use it for recovery/repair, updating, or clean install.

            You don’t need to download another ISO of W10, from anyone. Save yourself some time. Retrieve the previous ISO. why throw it out, and then download the same thing, again? Not.

            You can simply store the ISO, as is, in a folder on your hard drive. That is all that Woody is saying, when he alerted people that now is the time to save a copy. You might find it useful in the future… you might never run it. I have ISO of XP, Windows 7, and every version of W10… because they might be useful (and have been useful). They are inexpensive insurance, easy to store, and easy to back up through your regular back up routine. Its just that after Microsoft issues 2004, 2004 will be what is available through MCT. If you have difficulties with 2004, and cannot rollback to the previous version, it may be important to have a copy of previous version, that did work. It is cheap insurance.

            It is easier to have all the copies available as ISO, for all types of hardware, in a folder, that are properly backed up, than make only one bootable copy that isn’t backed up, on a USB device that might fail, or DVD that will degrade, and/or break.

            If and when you need to use a clean copy of a particular operating system, you can easily retrieve the ISO.

            That brings us to what is it you are trying to do right now. Are you simply wanting a copy of 1909 for possible future use? Put the ISO in a folder on your hard drive. That’s all.

            Are you wanting to learn more, and experiment? Use the ISO

            Making a bootable copy is nice, but not necessary- if your system crashes, you can repair/reinstall from that, rather than retrieving from your back up and creating an external installer then. Consider how many versions of W10 you may be backing up in the future. Are you going to buy and create a bootable USB drive for each one? Are you only dealing with your computer, or have a family, and multiple computers that you want to be prepared to troubleshoot and fix if updating fails?

            Consider- If your only ‘back up’ of 1909 is external, bootable media, then how you are going to back that up? DVDs and USB drives break, fail, and get lost, and you will have defeated your purpose of storing a copy for possible future use. Some people like to fiddle with operating systems, or have a need to troubleshoot, or restore multiple computers. They find a bootable external hard drive handy to have, already set up and ready to go. Most people would be better suited to keep a regular back up schedule, and investing in external drives for data storage. Face it- your data is far more valuable to you than a particular version of a particular operating system.

            Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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      • #2266377 Reply
        Paul T
        AskWoody MVP

        I am certain that there still are weird devices out there that need hardware model specific custom drivers in the install phase

        Which is why you test booting from your USB stick…

        cheers, Paul

        • #2266408 Reply
          mn–
          AskWoody Lounger

          And not only booting – not very useful if it boots but doesn’t see your essential devices correctly, or can’t run without crashing long enough to finish install.

          The former was seen with the server hardware, the latter with a touchscreen ultraportable.

      • #2266491 Reply
        Alex5723
        AskWoody Plus

        Once the ISO is finally downloaded how do I transfer the ISO, using Ventoy, to a bootable USB drive so that I have it for the future use.

        https://www.ventoy.net/en/doc_start.html

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        CAS
        • #2266555 Reply
          KYKaren
          AskWoody Plus

          Once the ISO is finally downloaded how do I transfer the ISO, using Ventoy, to a bootable USB drive so that I have it for the future use.

          https://www.ventoy.net/en/doc_start.html

          Could we start a new topic about Ventoy? I have some questions about it too. I am afraid that talking about it here will take “making an iso file” off topic.

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          • #2266571 Reply
            CAS
            AskWoody Plus

            I’m going to use Rufus to create the bootable ISO. I did a number of searches on how to create one using Ventoy and came up with nothing. Check out the following link for using Rufus to burn the ISO to a USB drive:

            https://www.lifewire.com/how-to-burn-an-iso-file-to-a-usb-drive-2619270

            • #2266574 Reply
              PKCano
              Da Boss

              You will be creating bootable install media from the ISO.

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              CAS
              • #2266586 Reply
                CAS
                AskWoody Plus

                PK, how do I use Rufus to accomplish the sought after objective discussed in this post? I’m truly at a loss.

                 

                CAS

              • #2266596 Reply
                PKCano
                Da Boss

                https://rufus.ie/

                Search for Rufus on this site. There are plenty of instructions. Try the Tools Forum.

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                CAS
        • #2266595 Reply
          CAS
          AskWoody Plus

          Alex, I read that entry but I lack the knowledge to either understand or implement it. That’s why I’m going to use Rufus as soon as PK let’s me know how to accomplish the sought after objective discussed in this post.

          There are times when I read posts and replies that are incomprehensible to me because of my lack of sophistication when it comes to computers. This site has helped me but only to the extent that I can understand what people are talking about. For me, life is hit or miss depending upon my knowledge base of the subject matter.

          Computers would be completely out of my reach without the help I get here. Thanks for your kindness as well as the kindness of others who have assisted me here.

          CAS

      • #2266625 Reply
        CAS
        AskWoody Plus

        Elly, I just read your response in all it’s elegant simplicity. It supplied me with all the information I need.

        If ever there was an instance where Occam’s razor applied, this is it. In a nutshell, in most cases the simplest answer is generally the best one. I’m saving the downloaded image in my documents file. Easy peasy.

        Thank you.

        CAS

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