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  • Woody’s Windows Watch: Sticking with Windows 7? You aren’t alone.

    Home Forums AskWoody blog Woody’s Windows Watch: Sticking with Windows 7? You aren’t alone.

    This topic contains 23 replies, has 13 voices, and was last updated by

     Canadian Tech 4 days, 19 hours ago.

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    • #1595508 Reply

      woody
      Da Boss

      If you plan on keeping Windows 7 beyond its expiry date, January of next year, you aren’t alone. Hundreds of millions of PCs will continue to use Win7
      [See the full post at: Woody’s Windows Watch: Sticking with Windows 7? You aren’t alone.]

      6 users thanked author for this post.
    • #1596708 Reply

      Tregonsee
      AskWoody Lounger

      I have been holding off moving to WIN10 on my small office machine because I use some very specialized software which gets broken with each update in WIN10, requiring considerable manual repair time.  A rare case where there is absolutely no alternative.  Right now, I have the switch penciled in for early 2020 after the holidays.  Perhaps MS will extend WIN7 as they did XP, and perhaps the software issues will get fixed.  It will be nice to have all my machines on the same Windows version for the first time in literally decades.  🙂

      • #1596993 Reply

        woody
        Da Boss

        Hate to say it, but the chances of MS extending Win7 patches is nonexistent. Unless you can afford the considerable sum to get a volume license, you’re outta luck. And the Win10 patching frequency isn’t going to slow down either.

        Your most stable solution? Find a way to do what you’re doing on the web. Then it doesn’t matter what system you’re using.

      • #1598378 Reply

        anonymous

        I have been holding off moving to WIN10 on my small office machine because I use some very specialized software which gets broken with each update in WIN10, requiring considerable manual repair time.

        Many big and small office machines are holding off removing Windows 7 deploying Windows 10 because it breaks the specialize software or does not work on Windows 10. Many are still using Windows Xp since the software does not work on Windows 7.

        Find a way to do what you’re doing on the web. Then it doesn’t matter what system you’re using.

        How can you do that? Several accounting software and document management are linked to other software that were written in Cobol from 1960 or other older code that will not work the web. This is one of the reason that Windows Xp is used since Cobol works well with it. Some XP are not connected to the web and just used for internal servers that do not connect to anything.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
        • #1603155 Reply

          anonymous

          Several accounting software and document management are linked to other software that were written in Cobol from 1960 or other older code that will not work the web.

          Your luck that you have COBOL. Some are still using Fortran, COMTRAN and FLOW-MATIC. The contractors gets $4K for each hour spent working or maintenance these systems. The government and companies are saving big money since these systems can not be hacked by outside people and inside people are to clueless to do anything with it other than what was shown to them.

        • #1613410 Reply

          anonymous

          Is there a reason using Windows XP mode doesn’t work for those cases? It was a VM solution by Microsoft whieh I believe was offered to Windows 7 Pro and higher.

          It seems weird to me that Microsoft hasn’t offered something similar for those who need Windows 7. Obviously no one would use it if they had another choice, but it would be an option to get people moved to Windows 10 by having a built-in Windows VM-only license built in.

          • #1620833 Reply

            anonymous

            Some are still using Fortran, COMTRAN and FLOW-MATIC.

            Those are pre that led/founded Cobol. Some still use those but in rare cases.

            Is there a reason using Windows XP mode doesn’t work for those cases? It was a VM solution by Microsoft whieh I believe was offered to Windows 7 Pro and higher.

            Yes. It does not work well. Some instructions that need to be passed from 8″ floppy disks to the machinery equipment does not work well in VM. MS does offer Windows 7 in VM in Windows 10 but you need to be a per-approved government agency to have it be offered. I have several clients that tried that but that did not work for their needs. They will be staying with Windows 7.

      • #1613285 Reply

        anonymous

        Since it is software and not hardware, you may want to look into using a VM running Windows 7. If your software doesn’t need to go online, you can pretty much run it safely indefinitely in a VM.

        That way you can get the benefits of updating to a supported OS (whether Windows 10 or some flavor of Linux) while still keeping the backwards compatibility.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #1597247 Reply

      anonymous

      Windows-7 will remain very viable–despite MS’s attempts to get users to move to WIndows-10.  Why should users move from a reliable OS to one much less reliable?  Why should users move from an easy to use OS to an OS that is much more complicate and opaque?  Clearly, there are many good reasons.  As for Windows-10’s much touted “enhanced security,” Bu**sh**.  It has proven to be just as penetrable as that of Windows-7.  Apparently MS’s philosophy is to pander to gamers and mobility concurrently with deliberately alienating business and serious consumer users.  One size does not and never will fit all.

      1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #1599596 Reply

      HappyElderNerd
      AskWoody Plus

      I’m holding off on Windows 10 because Microsoft has not yet demonstrated to me…for Windows 7 OR Windows 10, that they actually fully test updates before releasing them.

      I’ve only been in the computer industry since the RCA 301 (yes, 1961), and watched Microsoft emerge as a trusted software company.  But, ever since Mr. Gates left, the company’s commitment to anything except THEIR profit has diminished.  Today, I can’t even trust that posting a KB####### “update” to ANY Windows system will not brick that system.  I have one of the most robust backup/restore policies in the world for just that reason. (Ask me if you wish.)

      It I’m going to be FORCED to upgrade by M$ to Windows 10, and the ever evolving methods for compromising Windows systems, they lose me as a customer…and all my clients likely with them.  I’ll move to Linux, of course, which is the only serious competitor for the small-user-base market…taking my clientele along with me.  I’m already building a database of suitable “replacement” apps for Office (there are many), Quicken (a tough world of wannabes), Acrobat, etc., to evade surprises.

      I have little faith that Microsoft will return to the days when truth and honesty were hallmarks of their professionals…I await a change in THEIR course…or I will make substantial changes in MY course!

      Microsoft is going to have to EARN my trust, by telling us WHAT it is planning to do, what RISKS those plans have in the course of adoption by qualified users, and a CLEAR AND OPEN POLICY toward admitting when they’re wrong, instead of hiding behind silence.

      –Carol Anne

      10 users thanked author for this post.
      • #1605607 Reply

        lurks about
        AskWoody Lounger

        I have ditched Windows on all Internet attached systems (they are various flavors of Linux). The only W7 install is airgapped and has not been undated in several years now. It is being kept around for some applications the wife aka boss wants to occasionally use.

        1 user thanked author for this post.
    • #1599929 Reply

      Charlie
      AskWoody Plus

      I used Win XP Pro until 2013 when I decided to go with Win 7 on a new computer.  Never had a problem with XP SP2 and so far have had no problem with Win 7 SP1.  Of course, listening to the advice given by Woody and this website had a lot to do with that.

      The most “secure operating system” available won’t do you any good if you click on and then download a piece of malware or ransomware.

      Win 7 Home Premium, x64, Intel i3-2120 3.3GHz, Groups B & L

      2 users thanked author for this post.
      • #1625655 Reply

        mn–
        AskWoody Lounger

        Well actually…

        Some operating systems have come with facilities to verify trustedness of *every* application *every* time, and also user-level auditing to check for unusual usage patterns and…

        Sure, it does carry a significant performance penalty. (With sufficient effort, you can actually install that kind of thing in, say, a laptop installation of Ubuntu, and watch it slow down to a crawl and not run very long on the battery. BTDT.)

        Also at least some of these have been unavailable to the general public without official security clearances. I remember seeing some of a hassle involving that… I understand there was server hardware with blanked disks but special-version operating system media sold as surplus from a NATO base in one of the European countries once, by mistake. A local university computer club had bought it in good faith and…

        No, I don’t know of any MS software that would’ve run on that processor architecture anyway.

    • #1608265 Reply

      OscarCP
      AskWoody Plus

      If the numbers of people still using Windows 7 after January of next year are large enough, and for as long as they stay so, that should give developers an incentive to keep updating the versions of their applications for Windows 7. In my case, the main ones I would like to see kept up to date are the browsers and probably some drivers. The rest of those I have, if they work fine now, probably will continue to work fine for quite a while yet.

      3 users thanked author for this post.
      • #1621431 Reply

        Canadian Tech
        AskWoody_MVP

        Oscar, if you will follow my advice and stop all Microsoft updating, you are highly unlikely to ever need to “update” a driver again.

        CT

    • #1619373 Reply

      Canadian Tech
      AskWoody_MVP

      CT here… UPDATE…

      I am the fellow who looks after about 130 Win7 client systems. My clients do NOT include any enterprises. Primary usage is pretty ordinary email and web browsing. Gmail mostly and Windows Live Mail

      . My client computers have not had a single Microsoft update since May 2017. That is 3120 computer months of operation.
      . There has not been a single instance of infection or hacking of any kind.
      . My support work has fallen off by at least 75%.
      . These systems run more reliably than ever.
      . We use Chrome and have uninstalled Adobe Flash, Adobe Reader and Java
      . All systems have Bitdefender Antivirus Plus and no other security software

      I have replaced hard drives and/or re-installed windows 7 on most of these systems to ensure they will be working well for as long as my clients want to use them. All systems have a system image of the system before data or dynamic applications.

      Bottom line: I expect these systems to be good for another 5 years.

      CT

      6 users thanked author for this post.
      • #1625432 Reply

        HH33
        AskWoody Lounger

        Canadian Tech, I’ve noted your Windows 7 recommendations and have rarely heard such clear common sense regarding hardening W7 to make it both essentially Internet-proof and Microsoft-proof.

        I’ve found multiple instances of links leading to a Microsoft Forum post of yours regarding instructions for setting up W7 machines (we have three) into a “final state” configuration, but no matter which of those links I click, I get a cheery welcome note from MS saying, “Access Denied.  You are not authorized to access this page.”  Hmm…..I can’t imagine why MS wouldn’t want Windows users learning how to stay with a perfectly good W7 operating system…..

        Is there another source where those instructions can be found?

        Cheers,

        HH33

         

        Group 7-L (W7, heading toward Linux)
        W7 Pro x64 SP1
        Linux Mint 18.3 Cinnamon 64-bit
        Linux Mint 17.1 Xfce 32-bit

        • #1628070 Reply

          HappyElderNerd
          AskWoody Plus

          You deadpan assertion,  “I can’t imagine why MS wouldn’t want Windows users learning how to stay with a perfectly good W7 operating system…” fairly drips with sarcasm, which I applaud.

          For those not reading between the lines, the answer is–as is the answer is for all rampant capitalism–GREED.  Microsoft once put both innovation and customer satisfaction at the top of their priority list, and it made Bill Gates (and some lesser colleagues) quite wealthy in the bargain.  Windows is still the dominant operating system in the world, insofar as I know.  It’s a shame that executive management now sees reliability, consistency, and (most of all) quality of updates as unnecessary, and irrelevant to corporate success.  The deterioration in quality as palpable, and most of us would flock to an alternative if it adhered to the standards that originally made Microsoft Great.

          I’m old enough to remember when software updates were necessary…and reliable.  I fear those days will not likely return.

          –Carol Anne

        • #1659367 Reply

          Canadian Tech
          AskWoody_MVP

          HH33, you can find that page you were referring to now at:

          https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/windows-update-for-windows-7-after-1-2020/

          The other answerers at the Microsoft answers web page just could not stand the idea that I was promoting setting Windows Update to NEVER. They lobbied the management to do that to that page. As a result my 10 years of service to that site have now been dramatically curtailed.

          Feel free to reply to this new topic I just created here at Askwoody. If you have any comments and/or questions I would be happy to reply.

          CT

          3 users thanked author for this post.
    • #1619375 Reply

      clasof56
      AskWoody Lounger

      Morning!  havent been back here in a bit…its always refreshing.
      still on win7pro and its wonderful.  i bought a new pc about a year ago and did a lot of soul-searching before i did.  i am an old fart and have been on win7 since it was new.  have ironed out all the bugs and gotten all the programs i wanted and didnt feel like a “free” change was what i wanted.  so the new pc was custom and bought on ebay from a known builder. its fast and quiet and had win7 pro….was great from the get-go and even better now.  i dont update win7…just no trust left anymore.  but i use a few things a bit differently.  i only run portable browsers and only run them off flashdrives and always sandboxed.   never a hiccup or glitch…two pcs running, wife and i, both the same and doing different things, and never a problem…8 hours a day for over a year and no problems.  end of life for win7???  dont make me laugh…nothing will change for me.  i make good use of Macrium Reflect and always do a weekly backup to an external drive…i keep three backups…so protected back for a couple weeks.  i use it enough to know if there is a problem.
      i have played with win10 enough to know there is nothing about it that i have to have…no real “upgrade” for me.  i take responsibility for my own security….nothing is perfect but i havent lived for 75 years with big brother looking at everything i do and wont start now.    best of luck to all.  Clas

      Clas

      6 users thanked author for this post.
    • #1621108 Reply

      Alex5723
      AskWoody Plus

      Microsoft is going to have to EARN my trust

      Joe Wilcox : Microsoft’s core platform isn’t software, it’s trust

      …Microsoft embraces something broader—design ethics that harken back to the company’s founding objectives and others that share similar purpose as the robotic laws. On the latter point, Nadella repeatedly spoke about “trust” and “collective responsibility”. These are fundamental principles of design, particularly as Artificial Intelligence usage expands and more corporate developers depend on cloud computing platforms like Azure.

      “To us, really thinking about the trust in everything that we build, in the technology we build, is so core—and as engineers, we need to truly incorporate this in the core design process, in the tooling around how we build things”, Nadella said today…

      https://betanews.com/2019/05/06/microsofts-core-platform-isnt-software-its-trust/

      I don’t believe a word coming from Microsoft.

      4 users thanked author for this post.
      • #1621352 Reply

        Canadian Tech
        AskWoody_MVP

        Useless jibberish, irrelevant. I agree completely I do not trust a word from Microsoft. Further and more importantly, I will not buy a product with a Microsoft name on it. I have gone through quite a transition. I was a Microsoft advocate since the 80’s. I have recommended them to countless thousands. Today, I will not recommend any product or service from Microsoft.

        CT

        2 users thanked author for this post.
    • #1624898 Reply

      Elly
      AskWoody MVP

      I have been using Windows 7, updated along @Canadian Tech’s guidelines, since I got a new hard drive last year. It does what I want it to, stable, and no malware, day in and day out…

      But to have Nadella speaking about Microsoft’s core platform being trust, not software? After the W10 years that have repeatedly violated the trust of customers, in how it was implemented, updated, and turned into something that vacuums data, rather than preserves it…

      All I can say, in high pitched, Valley-girl speak, “Gag me with a spoon!”

      Win 7 Home, 64 bit, Group B

      5 users thanked author for this post.
    • #1628897 Reply

      HappyElderNerd
      AskWoody Plus

      Well, will wonders never cease:  This message just popped up on my desktop:
      Microsoft’s First Windows XP Patch in Years Is a Very Bad Sign

      Checkout the story at https://www.wired.com/story/microsoft-windows-xp-patch-very-bad-sign/

      If they’ve got bugs THIS old in the LAST product they tried to drive out of the user community, they’ve got deeper problems!

      I’ve got clients who are still using XP for family tasks and simple browsing…and they keep finding more bugs to fix in Windows 7 and 10.  Something’s gonna have to give in Redmond!

      Edit: HTML removal – Please use the ‘Text’ tab in the post entry box when you copy/paste

    Please follow the -Lounge Rules- no personal attacks, no swearing, and politics/religion are relegated to the Rants forum.

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