Lessons Learned: System build

Topic

New Reply

Lessons Learned

Well no promises on that…

This will be a learning experience for me as I have not done a system build in 6 years and things change so rapidly these days (yeah and memory fades

I just received all the pieces of my new PC build this past week. The mother board was a z87 chipset board and the CPU(4790K Haswell refresh!) list had said supported after Bios version 9. Ok Nooo problem: make bootable flash drive and flash to version 9 if my new board had an earlier version. But while waiting for their arrival I continued to do a bit of research, maybe I might have a problem w/ that. Ok make sure to test it out before the Setup Weekend. Still confident I kept reading and realized that eSata (one of the reasons I wanted THIS m/b was for my imaging routine, thanks Loungers for getting me back on track) was actually SLOWER than USB 3. Ok, no harm there.

Come Wednesday night, open boxes, set up P/S, place motherboard next to same, get spare keyboard from bedroom. Open CPU retention plate, little plastic thingy pops off, drop in CPU, relatch plate. Attach stock cooler. Insert DDR stick. Open case to use front panel On/Off button to turn every thing on. I know I need to plug in connectors : CPU fan and ATX power. Check M/B manual, oops another power connector is listed: EPS 4+4 on a different quadrant of the board entirely, mmm. Check (modular: cable detachable) P/S manual to see what cable to use for that. Must be that split one that is labeled 2×4, Oh wait they are keyed but only one matches the socket. Call EVGA on their 24/7 customer service line. I actually get an answer: The connector will fit, make sure the clip is on the same side as the other half when inserted. Turn on power supply, there is a button on the M/B that is lit. Hit manual again: this is a power on button!! Don’t need case button! Press it, supply powers up, fans spin, fans stop spinning. Little light on M/B goes off and one just like it goes on, fans spin, fans stop, repeats… Well looks like an exchange for X97 M/B @ same price.

Other notes:
The CPU has pads and the socket has little pins to match. This must be cheaper or something.
The little plastic thingy previously mentioned goes on top of the latch plate when repacking M/B.
The little lights represent which of two ‘Bioses’ are being used for boot attempt. Cool!

[/SIZE]

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

Replies

Hmm, a 120GB SSD for swapfile on a 16GB RAM system feels like overkill (like using a big ole Excel program when Notepad would have been faster ).

Reply | Quote

Hmm, a 120GB SSD for swapfile on a 16GB RAM system feels like overkill (like using a big ole Excel program when Notepad would have been faster )

The 120 GB SSD is spent money and not yet in use. Opinion differs on the utility of such a setup, it was kinda a whim as I was coming in underbudget. This system will be a relative bottle rocket compared any previous system I have built. I wonder where the 486 w/ a SCSI drive would fall, relative to 1994 of course.

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

The use of extra internal drives would be much faster than either external USB or eSATA.
Prices should be coming down on 2 or even 3TB drives. (for storage-not primary)

Reply | Quote

The use of extra internal drives would be much faster than either external USB or eSATA.
Prices should be coming down on 2 or even 3TB drives. (for storage-not primary)

Yup and I have TB still in package with 3 years of dust on it for that purpose.

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

New board installed and running 64bit W7 H Premium. To keep it simple with onboard graphics.
I may have a problem ….

I feel it is a good idea to give a marginal system a chance to fail early in the process rather than later so I downloaded some burnin and monitoring programs.

I tried to run SisSandra core cpu temps seem to skyrocket. Reboot..

PassMark BurnInTest reboots as well.

Prime95 FFT does complete a pass but when Real Temp (a temp monitoring program) tries to run a sensor test using Prime95 it reboots immediately.

Intel® Processor Diagnostic Tool completes but temps reach ~94 C.

Just to be sure I flash newest Bios and make sure all Chipset files are current. Windows security and nondriver (and non .Net ) updated as well even though I can’t imagine why that should make a difference.

Same kind of results.

Maybe the thermal strip that came with the cpu needs to be replaced after its tryout on the first board.
I have broken out my 7 year old tube of Antec Reference thermal compound, it does not look much different than my memory of it. If that does not work I’ll have to hit the overclockers forums to see what is normal, I find it hard to believe 94C can be acceptable but maybe I am missing something.

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

…I find it hard to believe 94C can be acceptable…

94C is way too high. I regularly have to deal with customer’s PCs with overheating CPU; if CPU temp goes higher than 70C under full load (e.g. run “HeavyLoad” from http://www.jam-software.de/heavyload/ & “SpeedFan” from http://www.almico.com/speedfan.php) then consider replacing the CPU cooler with a high-efficiency cooler (prefer “Thermaltake” or “Coolermaster” coolers personally).

A liquid-based cooler might be a good idea if you intend to over-clock. I have found that the air-based coolers that have a 120mm or larger fan are more than adequate. However, it is essential that the cooler is properly seated on the CPU using suitable thermal paste.

Reply | Quote

94C under load is still hot imo…

What kind of a case and fan layout do you have?
Have you considered a closed unit water cooler for the CPU?

Reply | Quote

37919-boxr

94C under load is still hot imo…

What kind of a case and fan layout do you have?

Yeah sounds HOT to me to. I am having trouble so far finding specs for that cpu (i7 4790k) w/stock cooler. I am still under budget so I may order an after market cooler. Not sure if it will be water or not. I keep reading that the k models are unlocked and over clockable so maybe water is the way to go. I just have to try not think about a Sandy or Katrina inside my box.

The case is a Rosewill CHALLENGER-U3 w/ 2 big fans so far, front bottom/in & back top/out. The case is totally open with PS inlet air through bottom but no GPU card. The final fan configuration will wait on a bit of research on noise levels. I have made the assumption (yeah I know what they say) that the open case is not a detriment to CPU cooling.
37918-20140906_12545537919-boxr37920-boxr

this is making me dizzy….

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

I am still under budget so I may order an after market cooler.

Yes, definitely an aftermarket cooler is needed. From the photos you’ve posted it looks like a simple stock cooler.

Those temps you mentioned make me want to suggest that you FIRST reseat the heatsink assembly by thoroughly
cleaning the surfaces and reapplying specification thermal grease (Arctic Silver or some other reputable brand) in the appropriate amount (rice grain sized dab). Then re-test. Use NEW thermal grease, I wouldn’t trust it after 7 years on a shelf.
[Make certain you have the heatsink positioned correctly, it may make all the difference too].

As for aftermarket CPU coolers:
I recommend something like one of these.

If your willing to spend a little more on a closed water cooler system, I recommend this (mine).
They’re not just for overclocking, and aside from cleaning the grill now and then, it’s been trouble free going on 3 years now.

37925-zz1
Mine slightly above idle (while writing this)
You should take an “over-all” approach to cooling as it’s much more than simply cooling the CPU area.
The entire case should be considered.

I am having trouble so far finding specs for that cpu (i7 4790k) w/stock cooler.

You should at least, typically, expect to see CPU throttling when up in the 90sC, if not
outright reboots or shut downs.

Desktop 4th Gen Intel® Core™ Processors Datasheet, Vol. 1
Desktop 4th Gen Intel® Core™ Processor Family: Thermal Guide
(Look for/under: Thermal Solution Specification PCG 2013D)

From your make & model of case, it looks like you could have up to five fans; two on the side panel, one in front, rear, and one 140mm fan on top.
I would make the rear and top exhaust fans, and the front and maybe a side fan as intake.
[It should be under 50C inside your case, considering the processor is cooled by a heatsink and fan located inside your case.
If you have a hard time achieving that, the 140mm fan on the top can be made to intake air to cool the area].

The PSU fan should not have any play here. Since it’s located in the bottom of the case, leave the PSU fan facing down.
(upside right from the power switch point of view)

Reply | Quote

Just had a thought. :o:

Where would I put the radiator if I go with water cooled??

Forcing the hottest ?? air straight up might be less annoying in the summer.

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

Just had a thought. :o:

Where would I put the radiator if I go with water cooled??

Forcing the hottest ?? air straight up might be less annoying in the summer.

At the rear fan area, there should be enough room for a two fan push/pull configuration
on the radiator.

Reply | Quote

As for aftermarket CPU coolers:

CLiNT
I am very glad you said that. These 2 are the very coolers that I have been considering. I was looking at the Hydro Series H90 w/ 140 mm fan as that is the size the case will accept but use on a L1150 board has given some problems and Corsair does not easily admit to its existance on it’s website. The liquid part of liquid does give me pause, however the mass of the air coolers also gives pause. Thanks again for the recommendations and the cleaning link. I will look at the later later as it gave the computer I am on at present a bit of a problem loading.

I would make the rear and top exhaust fans, and the front and maybe a side fan as intake.

That was what I was planning but with an extra intake and all intake with filters. The case has a hole lotta vent holes: the card slot blanks are perforated as is the front. With more exhaut power than intake power it would make the inside a dust collector.

This weekend I should be able to reseat the cooler with new ‘old’ paste. When I order a cooler I will look into some new paste.

Thanks again

Coochin

94C is way too high.

Thanks for that confirmation. As I said above I will be reseating and eventually buying another cooler
And thanks again to you too!

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

…When I order a cooler I will look into some new paste…

All the Thermaltake and Coolermaster coolers I have fitted to customers’ PCs have come with a small tube of thermal paste.

Reply | Quote

I reseated and seems to be worse. I will try again when gravy making operation in kitchen subsides, supposedly in 10 minutes:huh:

I am rethinking the H80i as it does not have 5 star reviews and does seem to have its problems.

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote

I still have not got the new cooler installed but I have learned the temps I was getting on the burnin apps I was using are not unusual for the 4790k chip being essentially an overclocked 4790 chip w/ same stock cooler.

Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

Reply | Quote