Plug a power strip into a UPS?

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It seems that any equipment you buy today has a big fat plug that covers up plugs on either side of the one it is plugged into. On my APC UPS, what that means is that I don’t have access to all the plugs on the unit.

Is it “OK” to plug a power strip into the UPS so that then I have access to more space so that the plugs will all fit?

I get that I shouldn’t end up have 20 items plugged in through the UPS when the physical plugs available are, say, only four. But what if I plug four devices into a strip and then plug the strip into a unit that has four plugs?

The last time we had an outage, yes my computer kept running, but the mouse and keyboard were both dead since they weren’t plugged into the UPS. It is specifically the keyboard/mouse that I am concerned with, so that at least I can shut down the system properly.

When I looked on the net, I saw no clear determination for this at all.

Regards,
Chuck Billow

Chuck Billow

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It all depends on the load you will putting on the one UPS plug. If overloaded it may just turn off as thinks there is a problem with your power.
Plus I find that most keyboards and mice are powered by the computer’s USB ports so if the computer was still working they should have also been working. Unless you have a strange arrangement.

You could see if you can get extension leads for the UPS plugs with smaller plugs at the UPS end so they fit side by side so you can plug things in a little further away from the UPS.

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Clive, as the mouse and keyboard both were/are plugged into a hub, they lost power when the power went off. What I think I’ll try first is a utility extension cord and plug the hub into that and then to the UPS. That way there won’t be any surge protection to contend with and I can still hook the USB hub to the UPS.

Chuck

Chuck Billow

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The last time we had an outage, yes my computer kept running, but the mouse and keyboard were both dead since they weren’t plugged into the UPS. It is specifically the keyboard/mouse that I am concerned with, so that at least I can shut down the system properly.

That doesn’t make any sense whatsoever[??] Doesn’t your keyboard and mouse plug directly into your computer?

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Clint, yes, the USB “dongle” can plug into my machine. But it seems that the signal then to my mouse and keyboard aren’t always even or strong enough, making the mouse jerky. So I set it over on the right side of my desk [being right-handed], plugging it into a USB powered hub. Now, the mouse works great — except when the power goes down./ So “all” I want to plug into the strip [or even a grounded extension cord] would be the mouse hub.

Chuck

Chuck Billow

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Conventional wisdom is one should not plug a surge strip into a UPS. Surge filtering meant to filter spikes and surges from a standard AC power line could interfere with UPS operation. You’ll find more here (scroll down to the section on “Surge protection and filtering”).

If the power strip is not a surge-protection type then it should be safe to use, provided you’re careful not to overload the UPS by plugging in too many devices.

If you only have one or two socket-hogging plugs, try something like a “Power Strip Liberator” or “Power Strip Liberator Plus“.

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THAT could maybe work. Thanks!

Chuck

Chuck Billow

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Conventional wisdom is one should not plug a surge strip into a UPS. Surge filtering meant to filter spikes and surges from a standard AC power line could interfere with UPS operation.

This is more likely an old wives tale. There is nothing in a surge protector that will interfere with a correctly designed UPS – a damaged surge protector should not be used anywhere.

Personally I never bother with “surge protected” power boards because the protection is useless when you really have a surge, like a lightning strike. Backup to removable media is the best surge protection.

cheers, Paul

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Surge protection is by a solid state device.

At certain peak voltage level it latches on, bleeding excess energy away (actually shorts the AC line, temporarily). It is some what like a Zener Diode.
It has energy rating. Overloading it and it’ll burn open (never shorted). Get spike hits, then energy accumulates until it reaches the limit. Most surge protectors list their energy absorption ratings. The other limit is speed, in nanoseconds (ns). Good one is 1ns-2ns or faster. If energy rating is low then speed is moot. A burn-up device is useless.

The electrical surge pulse is like a right angled triangle wave; super fast rising edge, then slowly falls, comparatively. It actually decays very very fast as well. The total energy is the area of the triangle wave. Because the surge is a very narrow pulse and fast, surge device is able to absorb the excess energy portion. It limits the pulse peak voltage. Peak voltage is the one does the real damage. The device has to be very fast, else it is not effective.

The voltage limit that triggers the device is from 400V-600V. We are talking peak voltage, not rms. In this sense, surge protector does not affect UPS.

It is not worth the extra cost to using a surge protector on UPS, before UPS or after UPS. It does no harm either.

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In our ‘server room’ we have a large UPS, and by necessity we need four 13A sockets to take the transformer power supply units for two cable modems and two routers. These transformer units have 13A plugs on them and are large, so we use two 4-gang 13A power extensions, each directly connected to the UPS, plugged as
[blank] [transformer] [blank] [transformer]
In total they will draw less than an amp from the UPS.

Summarising, I would reckon the only critical factor is how much power you are drawing from the UPS socket, and the maximum value will be in the manual!

Over here we have 8- or 10-socket extension socket units available (although these are rare) and I would try to find one or two of these rather than daisy-chaining extension socket units.

BATcher

Plethora means a lot to me.

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You could get one of these:

http://www.pccables.com/cgi-bin/orders6.cgi?id=ID16107455&action=Search&search=POWER_STRIP

They simply provide a normal size plug for any adapter, removing the actual adapter a few inches from the UPS.

They cost $2 each.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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Whether it’s a power strip (tap) or otherwise, your electrical cord should be at least 14 AWG. 12 would be better. The size is commonly marked on round cords, although you may have to hunt for it. You can find power taps that have 14 AWG cords, although you’ll have to hunt for them too. Pay the money, it’s worth it.

AWG is American Wire Gauge; the smaller the number, the bigger the wire. Common household extension cords (zip cord) are 18 or 16 AWG. This applies in the USA, I don’t know elsewhere.

PCCables’ “Heavy Duty 16 Awg Wire” is puffery. That’s a legal term.

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Whether it’s a power strip (tap) or otherwise, your electrical cord should be at least 14 AWG. 12 would be better. The size is commonly marked on round cords, although you may have to hunt for it. You can find power taps that have 14 AWG cords, although you’ll have to hunt for them too. Pay the money, it’s worth it.

AWG is American Wire Gauge; the smaller the number, the bigger the wire. Common household extension cords (zip cord) are 18 or 16 AWG. This applies in the USA, I don’t know elsewhere.

PCCables’ “Heavy Duty 16 Awg Wire” is puffery. That’s a legal term.

All the ones listed on the PC Cables page are 16 AWG. I’ve always just looked at the cord, and if it looks thick enough, I use it. Thanks for the very helpful info.

I suppose you could use a 16 AWG extension cord on a temporary basis (say 1 or 2 hours at a time), but not longer than that. I’m hoping so, because I have an unmarked extension cord in my laptop case which I occasionally use, but never for more than an hour or two at a time.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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your electrical cord should be at least 14 AWG. 12 would be better

Wire gauge is only relevant if you use lots of power, i.e. > 1000W. Then the larger wire will provide less resistance and generate less heat. For running a modern computer and peripherals you can use any old cable.

cheers, Paul

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This is the power tap I have, use, and recommend: Tripp Lite ECO-SURGE™ Series TLP76MSG
http://www.tripplite.com/en/products/model.cfm?txtModelID=4983

I use two for my machine setup. The computer is plugged into one “always on” outlet, my ink jet printer into the other always on outlet. I shut my machine down using a shutdown.exe desktop shortcut. The printer I manually turn off and on.

Peripherals are plugged into the other outlets; I can turn them all on or off with one switch, or I can turn them on or off individually.

The cord is 14AWG. The website linked to above includes a specifications tab.

I bought five and paid just short of $25 total for each, online. I’m sorry, I no longer remember from whom I bought them.

They’re jim dandy handy.

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Leslie,

Good post. If I might add just one thing that smaller numbers mean thicker cord, e.g. wire! Thus in this case smaller is better. 😆 HTH :cheers:

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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Here is how I rearrange the inconvenient and space wasteful orientation of power adapters on my UPS.

1) I use several Cube Taps to change the UPS plug orientation 90 degrees
http://www.homedepot.ca/product/cube-tap-3wire-white/905898

2) Next, I put the following triple tap outlet on each cube (for accommodating power adapters)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-15-Amp-Grounded-T-shaped-Outlet-Tap-Adapter-Orange-50281/203716851?MERCH=REC-_-product-2-_-100356841-_-203716851-_-N

3) Optionally, I add another triple tap outlet on top of the first triple tap such as the following (for single plugs)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Commercial-Electric-15-Amp-Heavy-Duty-Triplex-Outlet-Orange-LT-6/204836969

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lesle,

Amazon has them for 23.67. HTH :cheers:

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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I’m posting this from first hand experience.

UPS’ are finicky creatures. The only sure way to tell if you can plug a strip into yours is via the manufacturer.

I doubt you have enough of a power draw to ‘trip’ your UPS, but it is possible.

It should also be noted that the vast majority (>90%) of UPS do not support extension cords in any way shape or form. You will most likely lose your warranty.

I am unsure what exactly you want to attach to the strip… only a USB hub?? A USB hub uses so little power, I wouldn’t be worried about where you plug it in.

But if you have a printer, DO NOT plug it into your UPS. Especially if it is a laser printer. A laser printer will drain the batteries in the UPS, and could even trigger your protection (‘trip’ the breaker, so to speak).

Also, a large CRT could have the same effect.

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But if you have a printer, DO NOT plug it into your UPS. Especially if it is a laser printer. A laser printer will drain the batteries in the UPS, and could even trigger your protection (‘trip’ the breaker, so to speak). Also, a large CRT could have the same effect.

This is just not true unless you keep turning the mains to the UPS off. The assumption behind a UPS is that the mains is always on and you are merely preventing unexpected power outage that might otherwise corrupt data / lose service. If the mains is out for more than 5 minutes you need a standby generator to provide continual operation.

Any peripheral that “trips” your UPS is either broken or you have way too much load on your UPS and need a bigger one.

cheers, Paul

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Ben,

I currently have a power strip plugged into my APC UPC 1500. It has a 23″ LG LCD & 19″ Samsung LCD, a usb hub, a light fixture with CFL and a small 5″ fan. Works w/o problem. Of course the computer, speakers, 8 port switch are also plugged in to the same unit. With everything running except the fan APC software gives me 38 minutes! I never leave the machine for more than a couple of minutes w/o hitting the switch on the strip. This system works well for me. I would like it even more if I could easily control the Fan & Light separately and thats why I’m considering the strip posted by Lesle. :cheers:

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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I have had a perfectly good UPS (checked by manufacturer tech) trip because of a laser printer.

The point I am trying to make here is that a UPS is a highly specialized power source for computers. Nothing else whatsoever.

If you try to treat it as nothing but a huge battery, you will run into problems.

For instance, a fan should never be plugged into a UPS. It is an AC MOTOR and AC MOTORS should never be attached to any device that is supposed to ‘massage’ or otherwise ‘level’ electricity for computer components.

To word it differently….

you remember as a kid when your mother ran the vacuum cleaner and the television produced snow?

Not to sound sarcastic or rude, but I have degrees in electrical engineering and computer control systems. I do know what I’m talking about.

I also live in an area with brown-outs and generally bad power. I have a 1,500 Watt UPS that delivers upto 30A across twelve plugs. Attach a laser printer that is in use while my 800 Watt PC is powered up with my 22inch LCD and 32in T.V. and get the slightest flicker…

Then again, my laser printer is 22 years old.

And the UPS has a brand new battery in it. But now I only run my media laptop and monitors on it. I get over an hour of use on a full charge. Still, if I plug my laser into it and try to print, the UPS whines and complains, but doesn’t turn off. If I wait, and watch the juice drain, it will ‘catch up’ and stop whining.

Each plug on my UPS is rated separately and intended for a single device. The manual clearly states “Under no circumstances should a device with an AC motor be attached to the UPS.” In this regard, you should read your manual before plugging and praying.

The point about the printer is they don’t need no stinking UPS, just a standard surge strip will do.

maybe I got a bad UPS, maybe I got terrible mains into my house (yes), maybe the power company is out here every dang week to fix the pole…? want to discuss my situation, maybe make a new thread to discuss then? 🙂

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Ben,

A fan is just an inductive load and any UPS worth it’s name will handle it. A small / cheap UPS may not because they are engineered down to a price.
Agreed the printer does not need to be on the UPS, but it’s still just a load, although at 22 years old the PF is probably a long way from 1.
A 1500W UPS will never deliver 30A, unless it’s 48V. 🙂

cheers, Paul

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There is nothing at all wrong using extension cords to other devices from the output of your UPS. Wives tale in force. In addition, I always use a quality commercial grade power strip with good three way MOV devices ahead of all my UPS’s since it is much easier to replace blown MOV’s or worn out discharge devices in them than it is to go into the UPS and replace them! This is from experience. Two of my 3KW APC’s have survived direct strikes but the two strips blew apart! Strips are cheap. 3KW APC units are expensive. I have also used auto batteries to run some 48 VDC 2KW APC’s and it works quite well other than the recharge times being quite long when exhausted. You have to know if your unit will put out enough recharge current to charge the larger batteries without straining itself. Yes, the batteries were outside with 8 gauge cables in the run.

Also used on-line Viteq 5KW units with car batteries without problems. Standby or on-line makes no difference.
Older laser printers could draw 10-14 amps powering up and in some cases, printing and not a good idea to run them with a UPS, but check the current consumption of your printers – its on the label or in the manual… Also, my Tektronix Phaser printers use quite a bit of current in the heaters so they do not get their juice from the UPS either.

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