Secure messaging on Windows with Signal

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ISSUE 21.11 • 2024-03-18 PRIVACY By Mary Branscombe Signal is a smartphone secure-messaging app that also works in Windows. Here’s why you want it, an
[See the full post at: Secure messaging on Windows with Signal]

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cybercho, lmacri, windbg, Norio, rbailin, DLivesInTexas, fisher75

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From everything I’ve read, Signal is a great app, and the ability to use it on Windows is a key feature. That said, don’t both users have to be using Signal for encryption to work? Kinda negates the “one off” use cases you mention if your neighbor, friend, etc. is not willing to download, sign up, and configure a new app for you. I installed Signal a few years ago and if I remember correctly it told you which of your contacts used it. Grand total out of a couple hundred? Zero.

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Save_Us_from_MS, Norio, rbailin, Alex5723

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That was my question.  Wondering if both parties have to be using the app.  Sounds like a great app, but not sure how practical it would be, depending on the answer to this question.

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yes, both people have to be using Signal because otherwise the encryption wouldn’t be truly end to end, and you wouldn’t be certain all the revealing metadata wasn’t being monitored: interconnections between two platforms are an opportunity for keys to be compromised unless the platforms have done the interoperability work and while Meta has announced (since I finished writing this piece) that they will support interoperability with other platforms that also use the Open Whisper protocol that Signal created, it would be down to Signal deciding to support the interconnection – and given that Meta keeps lots of metadata about conversations and Signal is so vehement about not keeping any, I’d be surprised if they decided to support it.

 

Hopefully, now that you no longer have to give out your phone number to contacts, Signal is now easy enough to set up that more people will be comfortable picking it up.

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Norio, cyclical01

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Why is Signal available on iPads, but not Android tablets?

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It is on Anroid and Linux too
one can make connection through a QR code , so one doesnt need your phonenr

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Yes, I have the signal app on my android phone, but the app is not available for Android tablets.

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Signal isn’t supported on Android tablets and I think it’s a combination of getting the user interface right on a larger screen and avoiding potential issues with users accidentally deregistering Signal on their main mobile number and reregistering it on the number of their Android tablet and then losing all their chat history – in the same way that you can’t link another phone to your Signal account – or letting an attacker too easily register a secondary device on your account to get access.

The iPad client is a desktop client and even if the iPad has a SIM the Signal client doesn’t try to use it to register the device, so users can’t get confused about whether it’s a primary or secondary device and end up switching number accidentally.

That said, if you want to run Signal on an Android tablet it’s technically possible: you may even see it in the Play store and you can definitely install the APK if you know how to do that (and I’ll have instructions for installing Signal on something that isn’t a smartphone next week) – but it’s going to show up as a new account, not linked to your existing account.

The workaround is to use Molly, a fork of Signal that adds some extra security features but also supports Android tablets: you don’t need to use Molly everywhere unless you want to, just on your Android tablet, and you should be able to link that as a secondary device. As with all forks, you may find more bugs and incompatibilities than with the main project and I haven’t tested Molly myself – but there are a lot of satisfied users, so it’s definitely worth checking out if Android tablet support is key for you.

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Thanks, but I don’t see Molly in the Google Play Store.

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no, you have to get Molly from either GitHub or the Fdroid repo – links here

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None of my contacts use Signal.

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Mary Branscombe wrote:

Signal isn’t supported on Android tablets

sorry, this is not correct,
at this moment this message is written on a Android tablet
Signal works fine

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Fred wrote:

Signal works fine

I didn’t say it didn’t work, I said it’s not supported. From the Signal help page, “Confirm that your phone is running Android 5.0 or later. Note: Android tablets are not supported.”

For the other members, it might be helpful to share how you installed – did it show in the Play store on your device (it does for some but not for others) or did you have to use the APK? Is it your primary Signal device or did you manage to link it to an existing device? Maybe you can help Glen get going!

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Hi Mary,

I appreciate your article on Signal.  When it comes to end-to-end encryption, I use Telegram for text, images and videos with others.  Could you review it?

Thanks,

John

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Thanks for the article and ensuing discussions.  There appear to be two similar secure applications: Signal (that you described) and Telegram.  I am sure your readers (particularly myself) would benefit from a comparison of the two applications.  I would be interested in their vulnerabilities and difficulty of breaking any particular message.  These could be life-threatening in some non-US circumstances.  Thanks.

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Jamie Chapman wrote:

and Telegram

Telegram is the home for Human trafficking, drug dealers, terrorists, arm dealers…

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Alex5723 wrote:

Jamie Chapman wrote:

and Telegram

Telegram is the home for Human trafficking, drug dealers, terrorists, arm dealers…

and above all, monitored by the FBI EU AUS NZ

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Any end-to-end encrypted system including Signal can be used by drug dealers, arms dealers, etc., including Telegram.  But what proof is there of “and above all, monitored by the FBI EU AUS NZ”?

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I’m not sure if I’m going to be writing in any detail on Telegram, but my take on it is:

• the Telegram mtproto protocol hasn’t had an independent security audit
• cryptographers I respect have been less than complementary about the protocol
• one of the features may allow your location to be triangulated a lot more precisely than the Telegram app suggests https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2021/01/telegram-feature-exposes-your-precise-address-to-hackers/
• the number of times Telegram messages have been used in Russian courts makes it seem probable that the developer has been pressured by local authorities, but it’s also possible that there are just major flaws in the protocol https://www.wired.com/story/the-kremlin-has-entered-the-chat/

In other words, I wouldn’t recommend Telegram myself.

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What if you hate smartphones with passion? Any ideas why can’t we just install this service on desktop alone?

For now I’ll stick with Element

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Morty

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Wait for next week’s newsletter?

Mary Branscombe wrote:

There are some other clever things you can do with Signal on Windows, from desktop-specific features to a way of using Signal even if you don’t have a smartphone (or don’t want to put Signal on that phone). Plus, you can set up a username so you don’t have to give out your phone number just to chat with people.

I’ll show you how to do that next week.

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Morty, Mary Branscombe

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JCH wrote:

What if you hate smartphones with passion?

then next week’s article is just for you!

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Morty, JCH

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Thanks for this article. I really respect Moxie Marlinspike and his Signal, and immediately installed it on my Linux (Ubuntu) laptop. Works great.

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Mary Branscombe

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Excellent article Mary!  I’ll be referring to it when I get requests from missionaries who work in hostile environments.  Before this article, I was wondering how secure Signal was and dreaded doing the research, now I know!  Woo hoo!

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Mary Branscombe

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cyclical01 wrote:

From everything I’ve read, Signal is a great app, and the ability to use it on Windows is a key feature. That said, don’t both users have to be using Signal for encryption to work? Kinda negates the “one off” use cases you mention if your neighbor, friend, etc. is not willing to download, sign up, and configure a new app for you. I installed Signal a few years ago and if I remember correctly it told you which of your contacts used it. Grand total out of a couple hundred? Zero.

Yep It’s great and all but unfortunately no one uses it and people are extremely stubborn in changing their apps.

 

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this week’s piece is about usernames in Signal replacing handing out your phone number and I think that’s going to increase adoption!

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unbob

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“… unfortunately no one uses it …”

Not even close …

“In January 2022, the BBC reported that Signal was used by over 40 million people.

Wouldn’t be surprised if that number has doubled by now.

Update: actually, according to this website, Signal downloads exceeded 100m as of March 2023.

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Mary Branscombe

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For those interested, highly recommend reading this Wikipedia page re Signal …

Signal (messaging app)

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Mary Branscombe wrote:

I wouldn’t recommend Telegram myself.

Telegram is host for the scam of the earth.
Drug dealers, arm dealers, human trafficking, racists, terrorist…

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most of all, it’s controlled by RU oriented people, an many channels are monitored by lawenforcement

and most people are hooked and addicted to Zuckerbergs dataslurping Whatsapp

Signal users can be found by setting different preferents; standard you phonenr is hidden quite good

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unbob wrote:

Signal downloads exceeded 100m as of March 2023.

To fine 1 Signal user out of 100M is like finding a needle in a haystack.

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and most people are hooked and addicted to Zuckerbergs dataslurping Whatsapp

Signal users can be found by setting different preferents; standard you phonenr is hidden quite good….
you can let people find you by a program-self-generated QRcode without giving your phonenumber

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