W10 changes to metered connection policy?

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W10 Creators Update metered connection policy change!

Have a read here: Creators Update Metered connection

This doesn’t look too good if you want to avoid patches in future.

Windows - commercial by definition and now function...

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rc primak

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Look here:

https://www.askwoody.com/forums/topic/good-news-the-windows-10-creators-update-is-on-its-way-want-to-be-one-of-the-first-to-get-it/#post-101707

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rc primak

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Thanks for finding where my post really belongs here. I had a hard time classifying the topic.

There does indeed appear to be a change in wording, but not likely a change in the underlying behaviors of metered connections. Here in The Lounge, we have seen users post about getting updates even over metered connections and even when using wushowhhide. I had previously thought this only happens if wushowhide is run after the connection becomes “unmetered”. But reading here:

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/17452/windows-metered-internet-connections-faq

I see the policy really has not changed by all indications. Microsoft has always allowed itself the option of pushing really, really important updates through over even metered connections.

The question has always been, What is so really, really important that it needs to be pushed through over connections where data charges may apply? Judging from posts here, this may depend on user behavior (when the connection is opened up vs. when wushowhide is run) as well as the occasional strong push by MS Update to get out a critical security patch as quickly as possible.

-- rc primak

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I don’t know if this is true…

Microsoft Makes Windows 10’s Worst Feature Worse

https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2017/03/16/microsoft-windows-10-automatic-updates-unstoppable

Does anybody know what is the actual origin of this report? And the alleged screen shot?

But if it is true… 

I will start disabling all Windows Updates Services in Windows 10 after the Creators Update is installed. If this is impossible, only my tablet (which does not run Linux) will still be running Windows — with frequent third-party System Image Backups — if these don’t get “banned” by Microsoft. Wushowhide had d***ed well better still work, or I won’t even keep the tablet!

I cannot believe for one minute that the ability to refuse updates over a metered connection will be infringed upon to the tune of even one update in any average month, let alone driver updates. Elsewhere, online reports have allegedly shown in the Creators Update the ability to tell Windows NEVER to update drivers through Windows Updates. But as I can attest, this setting currently is frequently outright ignored in both the Pro and Home Editions.

The best solution until now has been to set the connection to Metered, and use wushowhide to hide inappropriate driver updates and/or the newest updates until more is known about their side-effects.

There has also been the ability to go into Services and disable all Windows Updates services. But this has unintended consequences on some systems, and stops updating anything until these services are enabled again — including Windows Defender security definitions updates.

If both of these workarounds ever fail to be usable, I am done with Windows.

And so will be most businesses — at least done with updating Windows, and done with Windows 10 forever. So the act of forcing updates will actually increase the number of unpatched and outdated systems in business — exactly the opposite of what would serve Windows security the best. 

The rumors surrounding the Creators Update have lately gotten so out of hand that in any non -tech publication, I will not believe anything I see posted until I see it happen on one of my own (protected) PCs. If true, this extreme forcing of unwanted updates is the end of Windows as a usable operating system, and I will outright remove and replace Windows wherever I can.

I cannot imagine any business ever using Windows 10 again after even one forced update. 

Additionally, the announcement that Windows Updates will not work on newer chipsets by any major manufacturer with any Windows version older than Windows 10 (if this is indeed going to be true) has already elicited the response:

“NEVER AGAIN! So much for Windows as a desktop operating system. Goodbye, Microsoft.” That’s going to be the universal reaction of businesses to forced updates of any kind.

But of course, businesses have options not included in the Home and Pro editions of Windows 10 which must be updated through Microsoft Updates, and these options are not said to be going away.

There is also the recent appearance of stories (not fully confirmed) that most major chipset manufacturers’ newest chipsets can only be updated in the Creators Update of Windows 10. That Microsoft Update will not run on older Windows versions.

Businesses are very likely to completely reject Windows (all versions) if they can’t run anything other than Windows 10 on the newer processors, due again to Microsoft unilaterally refusing to offer any updates to any older Windows versions on any newer chipset. Period.

Worse, many businesses may feel compelled to run older Windows versions with no official patching from Microsoft. How this scenario ends well for anyone, I cannot imagine.  

So don’t believe what you see, even with screenshots, until the actual Creators Update gets installed and updated a few times on real Windows PCs in real business and consumer environments.

But by that time, it may be too late — the nails may already be in Microsoft’s coffin.

Any clarifications or responses will be greatly appreciated. 

Edited for content. Please follow the Lounge Rules

-- rc primak

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BobbyB

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rc primak wrote:

Edited for content. Please follow the Lounge Rules

Oops! I didn’t realize that even mild cursing is not permitted here! Better to err on the side of civility than to allow the Lounge to become uncivilized.

Thanks to Kirsty for the edit and repost of my explanatory post (now #102207). The link to the original post is helpful.  (And I once again curse — within Lounge Rules — my dyslexic typing!)

@kirsty — do you ever sleep? It’s the middle of the night where I live.

-- rc primak

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Its a disturbing developement, if true, but as its an “insider build” hopefully it isnt “written in stone” yet. It could be me but it seems when M$ comes out with stuff like this they seem to wait for the “howls of disapproval or nods of aquiessence” before adopting or discarding. I am guessing that this is probably a “Home” Ver. to which this applies but as a lot of us travel with our laptops the last thing we want to embark on is a prolonged update session where ever we may be with all the perils and pitfalls that entails. There are some parts of the world that have speeds remeniscent of 2 cocoa tins and a piece of string and horrendous pricing to match. Does that mean I now have to carry a pocket full of USB sticks to fix Win10 after another “duff” update? Do I have to “grow old gracefully” waiting for Win10 to complete its update machinations? On the above ahem…sedate connection speeds. Mercifully foregn assignments are no more than a months duration these days which you can “muddle” your way through with out carrying a Win10 “first aid kit” and it does help if you have Win7 & 8.1×64 lurking on the same machine. Really wasnt this supposed to be the OS to end all OS’s from the folk at Redmond? Hmmm the Jury’s still out on that one.
I get a real kick out of seeing the M$ (in)crowds fly all over the globe pushing various M$ initiatives in remote parts of the planet and you would think that this would have occured to them in all that travelling. One last point in these fraught times of Airline and Customs paranoia travelling with a Win10 “first aid kit” aka a pocket full of USB sticks lengthens the amount of time you spend in customs while they go though all the stuff you have and some really inane questions. Made even worse by the fact I dont travel with a cell phone due to unreal/phenomenal roaming charges and un-necessary delving by various immigration authorities.
So I guess you could be excused a little bit of, Ahem… profanity. Got a trip comming up next month so I will have to think long and hard as to what I take or whether or not to upgrade although I guessing it wont apply to Pro or Edu vers of Win10 in which case GPEDIT will take care of the worst (hopefully)

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rc primak wrote:

I will start disabling all Windows Updates Services in Windows 10 after the Creators Update is installed. If this is impossible…

There are other workarounds. You can, for example, adopt a 3rd party firewall that disallows all communications that have not been explicitly whitelisted. It can’t update the system if it can’t contact the update servers! Microsoft can’t get around something outside their realm that requires reconfiguration to achieve checking for and getting updates.

Let’s say Microsoft reads what we write here and is thinking about making their system just fail to work if it can’t contact the mothership… Imagine the headache businesses would have trying to use Windows without a free and clear connection. Do you think the DoD will allow such a system in their house?

That being said, I caught an application (TurboTax) recently starting up the Windows Update service even though the service is marked Disabled. My firewall protected the system from any potential damage.

Practically speaking I have a number of security layers (you might call them workarounds) in place to prevent unwanted Microsoft mothership communications, except for when I feel it’s a good time and reconfigure to allow updates. So far, every version of Windows up through Windows 10 build 14393 has been willing to live with these limitations. I suspect that we geeks will continue to be able to block updates in the Creator release via similar means.

-Noel

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> for example, adopt a 3rd party firewall that disallows all communications that have not been explicitly whitelisted.

Any suggestions? Preferably free.

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I use the Sphinx-soft Windows 10 Firewall Control.  The free edition allows all Windows system applications (you can’t change) access to the net by default, but for everything else it’s a user whitelist only.  The paid versions start at $14.95, so it’s not that hard to upgrade.

With the free version, if you know what system applications you want to block, you can manually create MS Windows Firewall outbound rules to block them.  The W10FC runs in tandem with the built-in Windows firewall, so it’s possible to have rules in both 

http://sphinx-soft.com/Vista/order.html

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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My post below was moved to this thread. Correct move, but some context is in order.

Updated rant — see my post below this one): (I had not seen the other posts in this thread when I posted my reference and reactions as a New Topic. This turned out not to be an entirely new topic when I was posting.)

It does indeed appear that the Windows Update wording has changed, but the policy to allow certain “priority updates” even over a metered connection has always been there. If so, only the wording has changed, not the policy or the behaviors.

This would mean that the non-tech press (who never read the official, let alone the unofficial Microsoft Policy explanations) has once again seized upon a wording difference to infer (falsely) that the policy has changed. All of this based on screenshots only, not on hands-on beta testing of the latest Creators Update builds.

As I indicated in my posting (before launching into my rant(s)) the reference from Forbes might or might not contain reliable information. I stated that I was skeptical about whether this was indeed only a wording change, or an actual policy change in the behavior of the Metered Connection setting(s) (and related Group Policies in the Pro Edition).

My rants remain effectively my current opinion of the state of customer relations between Microsoft and those of us who do not have access to Enterprise grade updates controls but who want to retain some degree of control over the updates timing (and block particularly dodgy updates). It isn’t a state of war (yet) but if the Forbes folks were anywhere near correct in their conclusions (which apparently they were not) then all of my rants would go into effect, and there would be in my view, such a state of outright war.

I do not need to be fighting against forced updates every time I use Windows. As an already most of the time Linux user, this state of war (were it to occur) would definitely push me over the edge, and I would never look back to Windows for anything. Not even Miracast, though Wireless HDMI screencasting is much more of a pain to use. (Linux does not support Miracast or WiDi.) That is the one thing I would miss about Windows. Small loss, if saving this feature means risking having an unusable device every time M$ deigns to force an update through MS Updates without testing it enough. And with drivers, how can they test updates enough to avoid munging someone’s PC? (A one in a million chance? Still not my idea of acceptable risk!) And we here all can cite MS Driver Updates which have been far more likely than this to munge certain PC configurations.

-- rc primak

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Found this article.  Sounds ominous for those Win 10 users that use “metered connection” to defer updates.  According to this, MS will be able to prioritize selected updates to bypass this setting.  Even worse if you actually pay by the bit!

https://www.engadget.com/2017/03/19/windows-10-to-push-key-updates-on-limited-data-plans/

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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More info here:  http://winsupersite.com/windows-10/metered-connections-windows-10-creators-update-will-not-block-all-windows-update-download

 

Windows 10 Pro 22H2

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http://winsupersite.com/windows-10/metered-connections-windows-10-creators-update-will-not-block-all-windows-update-download

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