Replies

Thanks, everyone. I’ll take it from here.

Bundaburra, I’ve emailed you instructions on how we can do this.

I don’t use System Restore Points, I make an image backup to an external USB disk and restore that if something goes wrong. It also protects against disk / hardware failure.

For my 2¢, System Restore is a source of betrayed confidence. There are so many posts in the various threads in these forums (and other forums, as well) of disappearing Restore Points, System Restore unable to complete, lots of Restore Points showing as available, but none will work, etc.

I disable System Restore (why waste the drive space?) and rely on my backup regimen to save my bacon.

Even if you don’t use/trust System Restore (and I can understand why you might not), I’d still encourage you to have System Protection enabled on the partition that contains your data, as this enables Restore Previous Versions for individual files. I find that Restore Previous Versions is the fastest way to restore a file, bar none. If you want a better interface than what Windows provides, use the free Shadow Explorer utility, which allows you to browse the Shadow Copy images that are the basis for both Restore Previous Versions and System Restore.

As for saving drive space, that’s only a concern on old systems with small HDDs and single-disk SSD-based systems. I’d hope that, in all other cases, you’ve got a 1TB or larger HDD for your data. Unless you’re a professional video producer, you should have plenty of space to have System Protection enabled and maintaining at least two week’s worth of Shadow Copy images. Again, this is about quick and easy data recovery, not about restoring your system software (which is another discussion entirely).

Some of us use both. System Restore is typically quicker as a recovery tool although not as extensive as an image restore. It also has the advantage of requiring no user actions. System Restore points are created automatically. I definitely recommend making image backups on a regular basis but see no reason not to use System Restore as well.

If anyone’s interested, I downloaded a couple VBS scripts from a great tech [here or somewhere] and another EXE [from somewhere] System Restore maker. I have used these items – they are aok. I have not been able to successfully get these working well when placed into Task Scheduler, or, into Windows Setup. Seemed to interfere w/smooth OPs.
Are we allowed to attach here? — for those who don’t mind clicking once a day?

BTW, Shadow Copy images are just that–partition-level image files. They’re called “shadow” images because Windows hides them. They are very accurate, and just as good as any image created by a third-party utility. The real problems are the unreliability of the Task Scheduler task that acts as their creation trigger (they don’t always get created automatically, as we’ve discussed in this thread–but there are ways around that, like calling The Windows Club’s free Quick Restore Maker utility in the daily system restore point task instead of the default action) and the limited options for image restore (due to System Restore’s limitations) and image management (which you’d have to learn how to do manually–not everyone’s cup of tea).

As for myself, I find that I can do quite well without using a third-party imaging tool (but I also would prefer to drive a car with a manual transmission and shift for myself :^_^:).

there never appears to be sufficient info anywhere for steps 3 &4 above.

this is too common as to almost seem deliberate.
an example from another website:

where do you see proper explanatition of the “actions” tab here? and as ever how can ANYONE complete the settings at all?:::

http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/169523-system-restore-task-change-automatic-restore-point-schedule.html

why never any lists of examples of the “details” of the “actions” that will occur that we can copy/paste, or have enough info to do so ourselves?

it’s like this is still a deep dark hidden secret only the holy few are allowed to know,yet it is a vital part of OUR LIVES which is being ruthlessly exploited by malware,viruses,and computer specialists/experts/maintenence people alike.
and therefore should be a perfect topic for a website forum like this one.
or am i breaking some unholy taboo?

Sorry for not seeing your question sooner.

It’s quite simple, really–this particular Task Scheduler task is a default in Win7 (and apparently in Win8). I didn’t describe the contents of the fields because they’re the same on every Windows 7 or 8 installation in existence unless you’ve previously modified the field contents yourself. So if you just follow my instructions and copy/paste what you find there in the Run box (per steps 5 &6), you should be able to complete your test of of your system’s ability to automatically create restore points in the default configuration. That’s all my procedure was designed to do–help you conduct a test, not fix the problem (if it exists).

If none of that makes sense to you, you’re probably in over your head, and need someone with more technical expertise to run this test for you (and that’s no deep, dark secret, just a fact).

Too bad that Michael doesn’t know about Gibson Research’s SpinRite HDD maintenance and data recovery utility. If he’d be using it for regular maintenance, he’d have never have had the problem get so far. If he’d used it as soon as he noticed a problem, there’s a very good chance that he would have gotten all of his data back without spending $499.

And yes, I read what he quoted from the Seagate and DriveSavers sites about DIY solutions. Given the hundreds of cases I’m aware of where SpinRite has successfully recovered all data from a “dead” drive (even non-booting and invisible-to-Windows drives), their contention that you should never use a DIY solution instead of their services is a mite suspect, IMO.

Bethel,

I realize that but you also state
The Transfer Wizard will only move setting for MS programs. If you want all your settings to move you need to use the method I described. Your choice. HTH :cheers:

Actually, the MS Office settings are my biggest concern (and an image restore does too much–my current Win7 install is old and a bit wonky). So will Windows Easy Transfer work drive-to-drive, if that turns out to be my only option?

Bethel,

I’d suggest using an Imaging program like Macrium Reflect or EaseUs ToDo Backup.

Thanks for taking all that time to respond, but please re-read my post–I don’t want to use my existing Win7 install, nor do I intend to remove the existing HDD. My project is somewhat different than what you’ve described.

Also, I don’t know if this information is relevant, but I’m using a PCI wifi module in the back of the machine.

I’m with Tinto Tech in thinking that you may have a wifi connection issue. Rather than fooling around with borrowing/buying, swapping out and configuring another router, though, why not just move your PC close enough to the router to connect it via ethernet cable? If your internet experience immediately normalizes, then you know that the problem is with your wifi connection.

The next step would be to disconnect the ethernet, then retest via wifi while still in close proximity to the router. If the problem returns, then you may just have a bad router. If the connection is still normal, then there’s either something in between your router and your PC’s normal location that’s causing interference with the wifi signal, or else your router just doesn’t have the range needed to reach that location.

In either case, you might want to look into connecting via a HomePlug setup instead of wifi or getting a wifi extender (I’d recommend the HomePlug setup, but that’s your call).

I believe there are many network shared devices that may fail if the UPnP feature of the router is turned off. Which makes one wonder, why are these “suspect” features being placed on network components, when such features can be used to enable private networs to be compromised?

I have disabled UPnP on my router, and everything is still working as expected, but then I have no devices or dependencies on the router UPnP feature. However, the Connected Data kickstart project may be in jeoporady if UPnP is not available (though they can use NAT-PMP, that capability may have the same issues as UPnP).

On a recent episode (#387, 1/16/13) of TWiT’s “Security Now” podcast, Leo Laporte and Steve Gibson discussed the following idea from a listener on how to safely use UPnP on a LAN:

[INDENT]He could get a second router and enable UPnP on that, daisy chain it to the first one, then place it in the first router’s DMZ. This way he could have only the PS3 connected to the second router, which has UPnP capabilities, and keep the rest of his machines safe under the current network. He’d also be protected from any hypothetical attacks exploiting vulnerabilities in the PS3 since it would be also isolated from the rest of the network.[/INDENT]

You can read the full discussion in the episode transcript on the grc.com site: http://www.grc.com/sn/sn-387.htm

Search for keyword “PS3” to jump straight to the beginning of the discussion.

I suspect that this scheme would keep even one of the faulty routers safely isolated from the internet.

I have just a final question out of curiosity: I had minimized the hardware and connected them after the successful installment one by one (see advice # 70 ). Every time I made restore points. Than finally I connected the hdd (sata) which I use for storing the back-up images. Suddenly all previous restore-points had gone. For a moment it looked like the same old problem again. Luckily not, I could make a new restore-point (and the back-up functions still also). I wonder what happened. Did windows delete the restore points? and if so why? (It is not for lack of space, there was 5 GB reserved for RP, that is enough for 25 of them). I could have needed them just then, if I had to remove the hdd and wanted to return to the previous situation.

I’m guessing that you’re basing your assumption about the maximum number of restore points on how XP implemented restore points (a database of information on changes to the system files, along with a chronological hierarchy of backup copies of any system files that had been changed). In Win7, restore points are based on a full image of the protected drive (by default, only the boot drive is protected; it’s possible to enable system protection for other drives). In this scheme, each of these images (called a shadow copy) contains all the info for a restore point, but because all of the drive is imaged, each shadow copy (and, hence, each restore point) takes up much more space than it did in XP. Obviously the size of a single shadow copy will depend on the used space on your boot drive. On my system, I have 35 GB dedicated to system protection on my boot drive (C:, with 62 GB used for Win7 and apps–all my data is on other drives), which currently allows for 33 shadow copies (and, hence, 33 restore points).

In your case, allowing only 5 GB for system protection (I’m assuming you used the “System Protection” tab of the “System Properties” control panel to set this) might leave you with enough room for only 3-6 restore points, depending on the size of the used space on your boot drive. Normally (based on that assumption), and depending on how many times you created a new restore point during your process, your system may have started throwing away older restore points to make room for the new one.

So why might you have lost all restore points? My only guess is that, unlike me, you keep all of your data on the boot drive. If that’s so, then your data is included in the shadow copies, greatly reducing the number of restore points you can save. I guess it’s possible that, in this scenario, you may have reached a point where a single shadow copy was so big with respect to the available system protection space that Windows just barfed, deleted all of the old shadow copies (and restore points), and failed to create a new one. Then when you tried again, the whole system protection space was available, so the shadow copy / restore point successfully created. I would hope that Windows would have handled the situation better than that, but I’ve never run my system with such a small system protection space (your 5 GB).

Bottom line: I’d highly recommend that you greatly increase the size of system protection space. 5 GB sounds like it’s an unstable configuration.

FYI, the shadow copies are also the basis for the “Restore previous versions” feature (for all files on a protected drive). This is a convenient way of restoring any single protected file (not just system files) to a given point in time (corresponding to the times when restore points were created). I’ve enabled system protection on my data drives to take advantage of this. In fact, it’s proved so useful that I no longer keep a local file-by-file backup for my data on any internal HDD (though I do sync all data files to an external HDD that’s periodically rotated offsite). As a further FYI, you can also browse the shadow copies using a utility called ShadowExplorer–it’s a pretty cool way of doing file recovery for a small number of files.

And another question, I have put an image of the new C on that second hdd, do I have to image also that little new partition of 100MB? is that of any use?

I wouldn’t worry about it–that’s the “system” or “system recovery” partition. As previously mentioned, it’s used by Bitlocker and by the system recovery console. As long as you’ve made yourself a recovery CD or DVD and don’t use Bitlocker, you don’t need the system recovery partition. I deleted mine right after buying my Win7 system, and have never missed it. There’s also an option during the Win7 install to not create it in the first place.

The answer is twice : NO, BECAUSE IT DOES NOT START – SEE MY PROBLEM DESCRIPTION

I think that what we’re having here is a failure to communicate…

For context, here were my two questions:

[*] Are you using Windows Backup to make a file-by-file backup or an image backup?
[*] What backup storage location did you specify in your backup settings?

I did read your problem description. Unless I’m completely misunderstanding what you’ve written, you have set up a backup job in Windows Backup (by clicking on “Change settings” in the Backup and Restore Center control panel), then tried to run that job (by clicking on in the Backup and Restore Center control panel). Note that both of my questions are with regard to how you specified the job parameters in Windows Backup before trying to run the backup job.

Question #1 doesn’t have a yes/no answer–you were either trying to make a file-by-file backup of specific folders or an image backup of a drive. Which was it? This may matter in our being able to understand your problem properly.

Question #2 also doesn’t have a yes/no answer–before running a backup job, you must specify where the backup is to be stored. What did you choose as the storage location?

If none of what I just said makes any sense to you, then please give us a detailed, step-by-step description of what you originally did to make a backup, as you must be using a completely different process from what I’m used to (unless, of course, you’ve just given up on Windows Backup, and don’t care to try any further).

I am am using Firefox 10.0.2. The latest version is 17.0.1. I have consistently refused to update to anything after 10.0.2 becuase of what is reported as an unresolved issue relating to Windows (I am runnng Windows 7), and I quote:

“The use of Microsoft System Restore functionality shortly after updating Firefox my prevent future updates. (730285)”

Is this issue ever going to be resolved, and whose problem is it: Window’s or Mozilla’s?

Or should I just switch to another browser?

I think that you’re overreacting to that message–all it’s telling you is that if you update FF, then run a Windows system restore before a new, post-installation restore point has been created (which would, of course, revert your system to the previous FF version), you may end up with erroneous information in the files that FF uses to track its version and automatically offer updates.

At worst, you may have to do the next update manually (which I’d recommend, anyway–I never jump right on a FF update until it’s been out for a week or two, just in case the update introduces some new problems that I don’t want to have to deal with).

If you immediately create a new restore point after updating FF, then any future system restore to that point won’t affect your FF installation at all. Even if you forget to manually create a restore point, the downside is very minimal.

As others have pointed out, this is hardly a good reason for continuing to use an old (and insecure) version of FF.

Problem 2 — I can not make any back-up using the windows back-up-program. This program starts looking for a back-up medium and keeps doing so for hours. (there is a back-up hard drive intern, that is recognized by bios and by explorer).

Some questions:

[*]Are you using Windows Backup to make a file-by-file backup or an image backup?
[*]What backup storage location did you specify in your backup settings?

While it may not exactly sound like your issue with restore points, I’d strongly recommend that you read the Lounge thread “Daily Restore Points — NOT” which provides a thorough treatment of how restore points are created, and common problems with that working correctly.

FYI, you may not be able to get Window’s System Restore task to cooperate–there seems to be a bug in the command-line program it uses. I recommend using The Windows Club’s Quick Restore Point Maker utility, instead–just set it up in a Task Scheduler job.

I’ve not heard of Windows Backup refusing to make a backup like that–I’ll have to give that one some more thought.

Lucky PackGy…good for you. Finally it worked. Very good.

For me, even chkdsk does not work. Internal HD is Toshiba.

In what sense did chkdsk “not work”? What switches did you use? What were the original symptoms?

Along with a good backup regimen I would also recommend keeping an eye on your hard drives…[followed by a lot of useful stuff!]

Clint’s recommendations for minding your HDD’s health are all good. But what do you do when you can’t read all or part of your HDD, running chkdsk hasn’t solved the problem, and you have inaccessible data that you didn’t back up and that’s just too valuable to walk away from?

Before paying hundreds of dollars to a data recovery service, do yourself a favor and try Gibson Research’s SpinRite disk repair utility–over the past 20+ years it’s proven itself capable of restoring HDDs (and even SSDs, in some instances) to full health when nothing else will, allowing you access to your data so that you can back up (and then decide if you’re going to continue to trust that HDD).

While cheaper than a data recovery service, if you have your data backed up, SpinRite is still more expensive than a new 1 TB HDD (on sale), so if your only issue is a balky HDD, replacement is still the best option.

And, as always, the most important thing is to back up your data to a different physical device! If you do this, you’ll save yourself all sorts of time and money when (not if) you finally have a problem with your primary storage (whether HDD or SSD).