Microsoft on forced Win10 1803 upgrades: “We are aware of these reports and actively investigating this issue”

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At least, that’s what Bogdan Popa says Microsoft told him. Reporting on Softpedia, Polpa says: Details aren’t yet available, but the company said it’s
[See the full post at: Microsoft on forced Win10 1803 upgrades: “We are aware of these reports and actively investigating this issue”]

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HiFlyer, WildBill

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Would any experienced troubleshooter testers be willing to volunteer to test the WUMT-Wrapper Script version 2.3.3 to see if this will  STOP  Forced Windows Updates.  The Windows Update MiniTool has been around for awhile, and the Wrapper Script includes the Windows Update Blocker program/script and more stuff. Information available:

http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/wumt_wrapper_script.html

https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/wumt-wrapper-script-controls-windows-update-service.72203/page-23

Experienced  Volunteer  “Beta ? Testers”  only = ?

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HiFlyer, jelson

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This has been discussed in this thread, and here, and in several other places on this site. Search for “WUMT Wrapper Script” in the search box on the right.

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woody

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On May 14 and again May 20 I PM’d you about a forced upgrade.  So, yes, it has happened, whether or not MickeySoft wants to admit it.

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Right, and I reported it in Computerworld.

If MS is serious about tracking down the problem, they should contact you directly!

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Elly

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M$ found religion?!
WE ARE SAVED!!!
😀 😀 😀

back to fishing for better dreams

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The way people fiddle around with the registry trying to stop updates and other stuff. Would not surprise me if someone did something that resulted in just the opposite effect of allowing upgrades to occur. Could easily be some quirk in what these users did to get the upgrade installed.

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That’s entirely possible. All the more reason why MS needs to figure it out.

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Version 1803 is now installed on over 50% of Windows 10 devices. That’s the fastest feature updating ever, for Windows 10. I’m skeptical that they did not intend this, and are using it in a study of some kind.

GreatAndPowerfulTech

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HiFlyer, Cybertooth

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This also may be an indicator of how badly users wanted off of 1709, but worried that 1703 would age out soon. Woody has also noted 1709 seems improved now a month later than would have been helpful for some peoples decision process.

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I would bet the EoL of 1607 is a large contributor as well, especially since the following “bug” made it into the very last cumulative update for 1607:

only the latest Windows 10 feature update is returned as applicable. This prevents the deployment of previously released feature updates using ConfigMgr (current branch) and Windows 10 servicing plans.

This “bug” was fixed, in the very next update, that would not install on 1607. How convenient.

So, the only way to go from current 1607, to 1709, is to manually download the 1709 ISO / install files, and use them to upgrade. Yeah…

I’ll be doing this personally, but how many other users do you think will? I’d put money on much much less than 50% ;-D

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woody

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1803 already at 50% so soon, and I just got “ok” with 1709, what is the big rush to push 1803 out so fast? Even Gunter Born is a little surprised. Are others perplexed?

https://borncity.com/win/2018/05/31/adduplex-windows-10-april-update-rollout-reaches-50/

http://reports.adduplex.com/reports/2018-05/

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woody

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I take the adDuplex reports with several grains of salt but it’s still a sobering statistic, particularly given the sorry state of 1803.

MS is definitely testing how quickly they can upgrade people.

I keep getting these mental pictures of Rick Moranis at the helm in Spaceballs.

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Ascaris, Cybertooth

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I suspect you may agree with Paul’s conclusion:

 
April 2018 Update Rolling Out Even Faster than Expected
Posted on May 30, 2018 by Paul Thurrott

 
An astonishing new report from AdDuplex shows that the Windows 10 April 2018 Update has rolled out at a historically fast rate. What game is Microsoft playing here?

“The April 2018 Update managed to reach 50 percent of Windows 10 PCs in just one month,” AdDuplex notes in its most recent report.
…
So there you go: As promised last week on Windows Weekly, we’d soon get the data to prove that Microsoft is spewing this update out at an unprecedented rate. Why they are doing so is unclear, given the many problems that users have had with this update. (Not to mention the internal issues that delayed the original release.) But there it is, even worse than I had expected. Much worse. Irresponsibly worse.

 
Read the full article here

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Cybertooth, woody

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Is speedy rollout of Windows 10 version 1803 causing quality problems?
Microsoft insists that its rollout of the latest Windows 10 feature update is going well, but some customers are skeptical. And without accurate data, it’s impossible to tell who’s right.

By Ed Bott | June 15, 2018

 
A flurry of headlines at the end of May reported that Microsoft’s latest Windows 10 feature update had been installed by half of all eligible PCs in less than a month.

That number was not even close to accurate, and the actual adoption rate was probably less than half of what that estimate claimed.

The facts were bad because they were based on questionable data from a small Windows app cross-promotion network called AdDuplex. As I noted at the time, “a closer look suggests that the data behind that report is, to put it charitably, weak.”

Today, thanks to a bit of chest-thumping from Microsoft, we have some better data. “The April 2018 Update is officially the fastest version of Windows 10 to reach 250 million devices, achieving that mark in less than half the time it took the Fall Creators Update,” officials said in a blog post yesterday.

 
Read the full article here

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Good call Woody,  AdDuplex and several grains of salt !

https://www.zdnet.com/article/has-microsoft-accelerated-its-latest-windows-10-rollout-not-so-fast/

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Yep. Ed’s quite correct:

What we have, then, is a microscopic sample, gathered over a single day, that doesn’t represent the overall population of Windows 10 PCs. Extrapolating from that data set to the 600 million Windows 10 PCs in use is simply not statistically valid.

1803 is being pushed faster than it should be. But then I’d probably say that about ANY non-zero rollout rate.

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The problem is that Microsoft has to add a new adjective to the end of “Semi-Annual.”  If current Semi-Annual responds to Semi-Annual Targeted, we need a “Semi-Annual Confirmed” to verify that we don’t want Targeted updates.

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Noel Carboni wrote:

… just something that works right and supports serious use.

Sure sounds like something we used to expect from any product right of the shelf.

Would not have predicted as
Did not predict as a younger man that we could be retrained into such lowered expectations.

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Even if 1703 goes out of support, I will hold into it until 1803 is stable enough.

Be patient everyone, 1803 have been out just a month.  dont expect it to be stable.

Just someone who don't want Windows to mess with its computer.

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Call me cynical, but I don’t believe the *forced* upgrades to 1803 happened by accident.

MS has an agenda, and that’s as we all know, is to get as many people on 1803 whether they want it, or not.

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HiFlyer

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I’ve just restored my 1709 backup (build 16229.125) and noticed something suspect when running Windows update, it’s not offering any culumative updates after I disabled the 1803 update with wushowhide. What annoyed me the most was I ran the tool first and it showed the culumative updates but didn’t show 1803, ran updates and it starts downloading 1803 which I stopped. Now with 1803 hidden in wushowhide updates shows no new updates and complains the computer is at risk. 😐

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Go to Microsoft Update Catalog and download the latest cumulative
update for 1709 – it will be a almost 1 GB download, and will
contain all previous updates to 1709!

Gordon7.

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In addition to the Cumulative update for 1709, KB4103727 (Build 16299.431) or KB4103714 (Build 16299.461), you will need the Servicing Stack KB4131372. The latter needs to be installed BEFORE whichever  Cumulative update you decide to install.

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columbia2011, woody

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Thank you  @PKCano,  concerning the  Servicing Stack Update KB4131372 dated 5/7/2018, the more information  Package Details  tab says:

This update has been replaced by the following updates:

2018-05 Update for Windows 10 Version 1709 for x64-based Systems (KB4132650) 

More information on above is  KB4132650 is dated  May 21, 2018, same as KB4103714  (Build 16299.461.    I suppose the advice to install the SSU first, then the Cumulative last still holds.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4132650/servicing-stack-update-for-windows-10-version-1709-may-21-2018

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Yes, the servicing stack needs to be installed first. If you go through Windows Update, you don’t have to worry about it, it’s done automatically. But if you are installing manually, you need to take care of the updating mechanism before you take care of the update.

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columbia2011

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No forced upgrade to v1803 seen here yet in my v1709 Win 10 VM.

Even better – somehow, after ALL my many attempts to tweak Windows (10 Pro) to be obedient, I’ve finally gotten it in a condition where it only notifies me when updates are available, and waits for me to initiate the update process via the Settings panel (i.e., what everyone really wants). This has been good because over the past month I have been doing some product testing that required my Win 10 setup to be both available on demand and unchanged while I complete the testing.

Chances are I got it into this condition on purpose, possibly through a local group policy change, but at this point I don’t honestly know which one! No doubt it will be reverted when v1803 is installed.

Figures that right when I get v1709 under control, it will already be obsolete. But hey, I’m not complaining; v1709 actually reached a state in which it is relatively usable.

-Noel

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More info:

Copied my VM then changed the one Advanced setting from “Semi Annual” to “Semi Annual: Targeted” – isn’t it great to feel targeted? 🙂 – and on the very next manually-initated update check I got v1803.

The installation went more smoothly than any update I’ve ever gotten, taking about 45 minutes from [Check for Updates] in v1709 to being able to run WinVer and seeing 17384.81, and I find the system surprisingly usable afterward by comparison to past upgrades.

That being said, a fair number of things (e.g., services, scheduled tasks) I had Disabled have been re-enabled, and my idle desktop process count is now about 112 instead of about 88. And it’s trying a lot harder to talk online than it did before. All these things can be re-tweaked of course.

I’ve already verified it still runs my software development tools AOK, and Visual Studio updated OK on it.

Still, I don’t think it’s just because my expectations have been lowered that I am mildly impressed with this “upgrade”. Someone has done some work on the in-place upgrade process… I don’t think I just got lucky this time.

-Noel

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HiFlyer, AlexEiffel, BobbyB

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That being said, a fair number of things (e.g., services, scheduled tasks) I had Disabled have been re-enabled, and my idle desktop process count is now about 112 instead of about 88.

See! This is the exact reason, why I will not accept semi-annual anything!

Do not mess with my settings!

You do of course have a spreadsheet with your preferred settings listed, script files to run before and after updates and what not, but it’s still too arrogant for my taste the way Microsoft has chosen to disregard users settings…

Period.

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Cybertooth

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The problem is, I wouldn’t expect those things to not be changed with the SAC either. I may have to test that theory over the weekend…I’m not holding my breath though. MS flips switches at their whim, regardless of what we have set. The lone difference that I’ve seen so far is Group Policy – I would assume because they’re not yet dumb enough to mess with that, though I would imagine the time will come eventually there, too, unfortunately.

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…Though perhaps just a little less so this time around vs. prior upgrades.

I’m surprised to see a number of things that had been returning with prior upgrades not get un-tweaked this time. For example, I normally remove all the base namespaces in Explorer, so I literally only see disks under This PC. They didn’t come back!

Also, Cortana and the other things I always remove from my TaskBar didn’t come back.

I had disabled the various forms of IPv6 tunneling before; they’re still off. I was a bit surprised at that.

On the other hand Windows Search disk indexing and number of other services did get put back on.

-Noel

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Noel Carboni wrote:

I’m surprised to see a number of things that had been returning with prior upgrades not get un-tweaked this time. For example, I normally remove all the base namespaces in Explorer, so I literally only see disks under This PC. They didn’t come back! Also, Cortana and the other things I always remove from my TaskBar didn’t come back.

That might be reason for some cautious optimism, short term anyway.  We will see if this pattern persists for the next few updates.

As for deleting the namespaces so that you see only the drives: I use Old New Explorer for this.  Not only does it remove the folders, but it also restores the drive groupings (fixed disks and removable disks in separate groups), and gets rid of the Ribbon (if you want it to).

Even so, I still do the namespace deletion too, as every now and then something unknown happens and one or other of the folders shows up in This PC even though Old New Explorer is still active.

This is in Windows 8.1, but Old New Explorer worked in 10 also when I had it on my test PC, so some or all of this probably applies to 10 too, unless the same thing happened to Old New Explorer that did to Classic Shell (developer fatigue from so many changes in a short time).

“This PC” used to be called “My Computer,” but I guess that name had to change since it led people to believe it was really their computer!

Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon 6.2
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, Kubuntu 24.04
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, Kubuntu 24.04 (and Win 11)

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Elly, Noel Carboni

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@Noel Carboni-

I’m curious how your 1803 handles searches, since they are supposed to now all go to Bing and no longer be limited to the local machine?

Non-techy Win 10 Pro and Linux Mint experimenter

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Life since the forced update to Win 10, and the forced updates since seems like a we’really living in a dystopian future warned of in the 1970s. Microsoft’s draconian actions followed by insincere oops’ and intellectually insulting apologies are as frightening as they are frustrating. They are also materially damaging innlost time, and lost data. Especially in cases where Win10 was forced onto older computers.  If there isn’t already a class action lawsuit, there should be.  If there is one, please post how to join.

It’s been several years since I last played with Linux. I guess it’s time.

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wdburt1, HiFlyer, Cybertooth

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As a non-power home-user, I have been running Linux Mint 17.3 Cinnamon “peacefully” since Aug 2016, ie without being “hassled” by M$’s ‘forced’ Patch Rollups(Win 7/8.1) or forced auto-updates(Win 10).

Most power-users, gamers and office-workers are stuck to M$’s Win 7/8.1/10 because of M$’s market-monopoly since the late 1990s, ie many popular apps/programs/games are only available for Windows or over-priced Macs.

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HiFlyer, MrJimPhelps

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Mikeaskwoody,

A class action against MS would not immediately be able to proceed for anyone who had accepted the Windows 10 EULA.  The EULA specifically prohibits class actions against Microsoft, so it would depend on a judge ruling that that bit of the contract isn’t valid for reasons that the pro-lawsuit people would have to come up with.

As far as trying Linux… you might be pleasantly surprised at how it has improved.  I also like Linux Mint with the Cinnamon desktop as Anonymous does, but mine’s 18.3 at the moment.  I have my main laptop (my Core 2 duo one) and my main PC (desktop, Sandy Bridge) both set up to dual boot Windows 8.1 and Linux Mint, whereas my new laptop (the Chromebook-spec Dell) is Linux only.  Its eMMC storage is only 32GB, which is really too small for Windows alone, so Windows and Linux both is obviously not going to work.

Linux Mint is a great match for the little laptop; even though Mint Cinnamon is not regarded as a “light” distro, it fits on the tiny eMMC drive with lots of room to spare, and after having briefly used 10 on that laptop recently, I realize that Cinnamon is far faster and more responsive than 10 too on the low-end machine.  It works better than the OS that came on the laptop both in terms of leaving room on the internal drive for the user’s programs/data and in terms of responsiveness.

Really, the unit never should have been sold with Windows on it, though I am personally glad that it was.  If it was not sold with Windows, it surely would have been ChromeOS, and that has its own special UEFI that is meant to work with ChromeOS, and I much prefer the standard PC version.

 

Dell XPS 13/9310, i5-1135G7/16GB, KDE Neon 6.2
XPG Xenia 15, i7-9750H/32GB & GTX1660ti, Kubuntu 24.04
Acer Swift Go 14, i5-1335U/16GB, Kubuntu 24.04 (and Win 11)

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Elly

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I have several fellow tech folks that have had 1803 offered up and/or installed.  I can see that Microsoft representatives are asking for logs here:  https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/Windows-10-servicing/1803-Targeted/m-p/191101#M218

Susan Bradley Patch Lady/Prudent patcher

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woody, columbia2011

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The way they put it (“We are still looking for more logs if anybody has them.”), you would think they are using the Windows10 user base as the testers.

Group "L" (Linux Mint)
with Windows 10 running in a remote session on my file server

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Imagine that. What were they thinking?

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HiFlyer

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Huh? I thought Windows 10 was supposed to send all of that kind of telemetry data to Microsoft.

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Perhaps they patched something and now can’t find the data?

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HiFlyer

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Martin Brinkmann at ghacks.net has a current article about these forced updates:
https://www.ghacks.net/2018/05/31/windows-10-version-1803-updates-enforced-on-some-pcs/

His last thoughts on the subject:
You may want to try third-party tools like Windows 10 Update Disabler for the time being considering that the built-in update deferral options are not working.

If we do get caught in the 1803 upgrade, there is usually 10 days to roll back to previous version,  pureinfotech website has a command prompt method to increase rollback time to 60 days.
https://pureinfotech.com/extend-period-uninstall-windows-10-upgrade/

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woody

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Question:  would using the Group Policy editor on Pro versions,  or  modifying the Registry on Home versions,  still work – similar to this website instructions ? Or has this been deprecated ?

http://www.thewindowsclub.com/make-windows-10-notify-you-before-downloading-or-installing-windows-updates

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Cayennejim

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woody wrote:

I keep getting these mental pictures of Rick Moranis at the helm in Spaceballs.

I would feel more comfortable with Dark Helmet at the helm, and I’m sure I’m not the only one. 😀

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As most of the good folk who contribute here have already pointed out, Win 10 is a force-feeding ‘service’ that is designed to nibble away more and more customer choice and to disregard many previous preferences at every ‘upgrade’. No suprise then that 1803 is, in telemetery effect, exactly the same as the transition to 1703 and 1709 but with knobs on. Subtle ones.  Ok, so you may have sweated away many hours with the Group Policy Editor or the Registry to tame the ugly, uncontrolled 1709. But you shouldn’t assume that just because your particular 1803 actually fires-up without turning your monitor blue or black then things are all sweetness and light.

Apart from having to scroll through and re-adjust every setting in “Settings” (you know what I mean) and in “Services” you might also notice that The Group Policy Editor has been deliberately or inadvertanly broken. While Cortana may well remain dead (but still not buried) in 1803 Bing has done a Lazarus and remains alive and kicking in local searches. Back to the Registry to snuff it out then? I wonder what else is broken in gpedit and how much of an ‘accident’ this actually is? More to the point perhaps, how much access to the engine-room will future editions of Win 10 Home and Pro allow users to have? Even Registry use curtailed?

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Here’s a little link if you wish to evaluate your “Shot Gun Marriage” to 1803 for a while longer, before you do anything rash, In my experience “roll backs” and upgrades in place never seem to be a 100% successful, in that there always seems to be a little niggle or nuance that I don’t like and of course the perils and pitfalls of either are well documented in here. Last one I seem to recall was Win10 to Win8.1 so its been a while. The writing was on the wall then although I percivered and ran both until this day with the venerable but much loved Win7 lurking in the background. 🙂
https://winaero.com/blog/change-number-days-go-back-previous-version/

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Cybertooth

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Thank you BobbyB,  the default “rollback” time is 10 days, but it can be increased to a maximum of 60 days according to the instructions at this website:
https://pureinfotech.com/extend-period-uninstall-windows-10-upgrade/

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columbia2011

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