MR errors 23 and 6 – better options than restoring C to another part of SSD

Topic

[PKCano]

• Windows 10 Pro 22H2 19045.5131 64bit
• Standard NVM Express Controller [SCSI]
• Samsung SSD 980 PRO 500GB with SysRes, MSR, C: [120GB] and F: [50GB] with plenty of free space – 3 years old
• 2 x WD HDD with numerous other partitions
• Macrium Reflect 8.1 Build 7544

Pre running Windows Update I did my usual Macrium Reflect image backup of SysRes+MSR+C: but not my normal incremental but a full image. C: is 120GB on an SSD.

About 60% through I get error:
Backup aborted! – Unable to read from disk – Error Code 23 – Data error (cyclic redundancy check).

I repeated and got the same error about 50% through. I then ran C: /f /r /x but missed the final report.

I looked at System Event Viewer for a recent wininit but the most recent was a scan of N: on a HDD, not C:.   I did see under Windows Logs / System x6 Error disk reports about the time of  the backup:

The device, \Device\Harddisk2\DR2, has a bad block.

No idea if DR2 is the SSD. I filtered the log for other disk errors and found the same error back in 2nd August 2024 – 30 of them over a 6 second period. [the log goes back to 30 June 20234]

I ran MR again only to get:
MFT corrupt – Error code = 6. Please run ‘chkdsk C: /r’
I ran CrystalDiskInfo. There are no Critical errors but these errors:

0E 0000000000A9 Media and Data Integrity Errors
0F 0000000000A9 Number of Error Information Log Entries

Options:

I’m considering restoring C: from the last incremental on 9th Dec to spare space on the SSD marked green and marking the existing C: marked red as bad – see the attached image

Seems to me this should overcome any SSD storage bit errors but would not overcome any errors in the read/write circuitry.

However, given the errors in August and possibly earlier, perhaps I should write off the SSD and buy another.

Are there better options?

Thanks for reading.

Alan

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• This topic was modified 4 months, 2 weeks ago by PKCano.
• This topic was modified 4 months, 2 weeks ago by PKCano.
• This topic was modified 4 months, 2 weeks ago by PKCano.
• This topic was modified 4 months, 2 weeks ago by PKCano.

Replies

You can’t tell an SSD where to put stuff, it decides what cells to use (wear levelling) and when/if to reuse them.

If you are getting any bad blocks reported to Windows then you have a serious disk / sub-system error. Modern disks are self testing and correcting and never pass errors on unless they have failed catastrophically.
Your errors may be memory or controller issues, but they are hardware of some sort.

Make a data (file) backup of your stuff it you don’t already have one.
Get the Samsung disk test program and test your disk.
Use a different backup program and see if that will read the data.

cheers, Paul

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Alan_uk

Thanks Paul.

Your errors may be memory or controller issues, but they are hardware of some sort.

See my reply to Alex. Cannot run SM but it says it is healthy. So maybe the NVM Express Controller on the MSI MAG B550M MORTAR Motherboard or the Crucial Ballistix 16GB (2x 8GB) 3600MHz DDR4 RAM. Maybe I should remove and reinsert the RAM and the SSD to make sure they are seated properly? Or have you another suggestion?

Alan

Have you installed Samsung Magician software ?
The software can test your SSD and also update firmware if needed.

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Alan_uk

Thanks Alex for replying. I have now installed Samsung Magician 8.2.0.880 and ran it.

The status is Good and there are no error counts (see attached)

I ran the Diagnostic Scan but it says the drive is not supported. SM help says some systems need the Samsung driver but the SM Install Manual says the Samsung driver only required for 970 and is not required for 980:

NVMe Driver is not required from later released models. (980, 980 PRO Series,

I went to device manager and found the SSD driver was very old: 10.0.19041.4597 from 21/06/2006 so I clicked update but it says best driver already installed. I clicked search for drivers on Windows Update. But that takes me to the standard WU which is paused pending a backup. I’m pretty sure I never been offered any driver updates.

What do you suggest please.

Alan

My Samsung drivers for both SSD drive are also from 21/06/2006.

Have you checked for firmware updates ?

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Alan_uk

Just to eliminate some things, consider opening windows control panel / device manager and see if any devices are indicating an error.

For some POM, you could test your RAM.

Press the Windows key + R to open the Run command.
Type in “mdsched.exe” and hit Enter. Select the “Restart now and check for problems”.

Desktop Asus TUF X299 Mark 1, CPU: Intel Core i7-7820X Skylake-X 8-Core 3.6 GHz, RAM: 32GB, GPU: Nvidia GTX 1050 Ti 4GB. Display: Four 27" 1080p screens 2 over 2 quad.

Thanks TechTango for your suggestions.

Re device manager: No devices are indicating an error (yellow flags) and I checked a few entries such as Disk Drives / Samsung SSD 980 Pro, Computer ACPI x64-based PC, and Storage Controllers / Standard NVM Express Controller  and they report “This device is working properly.”

I ran mdsched.exe with “Restart now and check for problems”. There were no problems at 97%. I missed the end and contrary to the screen message did not get any report on restarting.

I looked at Event Viewer and lots of errors in the last hour – see attached file

Other:

On loging in as Admin Samsung Magician said that there was a firmware update so updated from 2B2QGXA7 to 5B2QGXA7.

I attempted to image drive F: also on the SSD with MR and got Error 23 again.

The Samsung 980 Pro has a 5 year warranty so I’ve emailed the retailer but I expect they will refer me to Samsung. They will no doubt want the SSD back and will take weeks and only offer a partial refund or a refurb it.

Might have to bite the bullet and buy a new one but would like to be sure it is the SSD.

Also would need to decide just how far back to go to restore the C: drive. I have various backups throughout 2024.

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TechTango

Alan_uk wrote:

Also would need to decide just how far back to go to restore the C: drive. I have various backups throughout 2024.

FYI, I’m also a Macrium user.

Before you buy a replacement 970 Pro M2 drive, you could do some testing as outlined below.

I’m thinking,

1. backup all user files to an external drive now, then
2. make an up to the moment full image Macrium image backup that includes all partitions. You could then safely restore prior images starting with the most recent you mentioned above as Dec. 9th. Test for the error issue. If it’s error free, then the user file backup could fill in the missing blanks.

If the error is present in the Dec 9th image, you try another done prior to Dec 9th, etc. If nothing solves the issue it would suggest it is a faulty drive your warranty would remedy.

Others may make suggestions as well.

If the drive is faulty and because you are making images, not clones you might be able to restore the full image you made before all this testing to a new replacement drive.  If other AW folks commented about this it could be helpful also.

Granted, this whole approach is a lot of work, but so is setting up a new drive from scratch.

Desktop Asus TUF X299 Mark 1, CPU: Intel Core i7-7820X Skylake-X 8-Core 3.6 GHz, RAM: 32GB, GPU: Nvidia GTX 1050 Ti 4GB. Display: Four 27" 1080p screens 2 over 2 quad.

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Alan_uk

Alan_uk wrote:

Also would need to decide just how far back to go to restore the C: drive. I have various backups throughout 2024.

If the SSD is faulty restoring won’t solve the errors.

Try backup test with free backup software like : https://www.easeus.com/backup-software/tb-free.html

Macrium Reflect MFT Corrupt Error in Windows 10/11? [Fixed]

Many users receive the “MFT corrupt – Error code = 6. Please run ‘chkdsk C: /r’” message when using Macrium Reflect. What causes the Macrium Reflect MFT corrupt error? How to fix it?..

Alan_uk wrote:

Standard NVM Express Controller [SCSI]

As I recall doesn’t the controller need to be set to ACHI or RAID in the BIOS/UEFI?
I know all of my systems are and I’m using Samsung NVMe’s.

Maybe there is something I missed along the way, or that’s what your MB requires, but that’s would be what I would try. But I’m sure that would erase your NVMe drive!

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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TechTango

Changing mode won’t erase the drive, but Windows won’t be able to read it and you would need to re-partition and restore. (I’m sure this is what RG meant.)

cheers, Paul

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TechTango

RetiredGeek wrote:

As I recall doesn’t the controller need to be set to ACHI or RAID in the BIOS/UEFI?

SCSI ? Really ? Samsung’s SSD run Pablo controller

* Samsung hasn’t updated SSD drivers in 18 years (according to driver data)

* External Samsung 4TB SSD connected via USB-C.

Alex,

What does an EXTERNAL SSD (T7) have to do with this thread?
We’re talking about INTERNAL (990 Pro) MVMe drives.

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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satrow

Thanks guys for chipping in with ideas.

Alex5723 wrote:

If the SSD is faulty restoring won’t solve the errors.

I’m talking about restoring to a new SSD or to a HDD (see below) not to the faulty SSD.

TechTango wrote:

Before you buy a replacement 970 Pro M2 drive, you could do some testing as outlined below.

I did think of restoring to the faulty drive but that might completely kill the PC if the restore fails. All my backups are individual partition images. At the moment the PC is running. I do have a spare PC (my wife’s) but it means removing her HDDs and installing mine. It’s an option.

Alex5723 wrote:

Try backup test with free backup software like : https://www.easeus.com/backup-software/tb-free.html

I will try that but will it be a quality (viable) backup?

FYI

All my user data is secure as I have that in separate partitions E: and H: on HDDs [been like that since Windows 3.11 and still have a similar project file structure]. I have even moved my Desktop to H:. I also have I: for software, G: for audio/photos, D: temp, K: temp backups, V: virtual images and more. Of course all my Windows customisations are on C: which to my mind is one of Windows weakest point.

When I got the SSD I initially copied C: and F: with the intention of copying other partitions once I felt happy all was OK. In the event, the performance improvement was so great that I never felt the urgency and soon forgot to move the other partitions to the SSD.

Possible temp option

I still have the old C: and F: on HDD so I am thinking of restoring them from a recent image backup. Then I would have a stable system until the SSD is resolved. Main problem is space. Old HDD C: is 92GB but SSD C: is 120GB but only 77GB used. I could shrink lots of partitions on the HDD and shift them along until the old C: can be expanded to 120GB, unless Macrium Reflect can shrink on restore [need to check].

 

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Alex5723

Alan_uk wrote:

will it be a quality (viable) backup?

Yup! All the backup utilities work as advertised.
Having a second backup is just being careful. I’d go there first, then play.

BTW, Macrium is the only one I’ve seen give these sorts of errors, but that may just mean the other apps ignore the errors.

cheers, Paul

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TechTango

Alan_uk wrote:

All my backups are individual partition images.

That’s ok for many purposes, but for the most efficient whole drive restore/recovery option I’d recommend you image the entire drive in a single step.  All partitions together as a single Macrium image including the EFI System Partition and the Recovery Partition.

I’d also suggest enabling the Macrium verification tool as well. It’s in “Other Tasks” along the top.

Lastly, while this is not something everyone wants to do, I have two identical NVMe 870 EVO drives. I rotate them as the active C: drive. When swapping them out, I pop in the inactive duplicate drive, then boot the computer from a Macrium USB stick and image it with an up to the moment full image of the drive I just removed.

If you wanted to bite the bullet and get a duplicate boot drive you could do the same thing. It would allow you test various scenarios without concern.

 

 

Desktop Asus TUF X299 Mark 1, CPU: Intel Core i7-7820X Skylake-X 8-Core 3.6 GHz, RAM: 32GB, GPU: Nvidia GTX 1050 Ti 4GB. Display: Four 27" 1080p screens 2 over 2 quad.

TT,

I never said that! Please correct your post. I always take full drive images!

May the Forces of good computing be with you!

RG

PowerShell & VBA Rule!
Computer Specs

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TechTango

FTFY

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TechTango

Alan_uk wrote:

I’m talking about restoring to a new SSD or to a HDD (see below) not to the faulty SSD

Have you tried the solutions at :

Macrium Reflect MFT Corrupt Error in Windows 10/11? [Fixed]

Many users receive the “MFT corrupt – Error code = 6. Please run ‘chkdsk C: /r’” message when using Macrium Reflect. What causes the Macrium Reflect MFT corrupt error? How to fix it?..

RetiredGeek wrote:

I never said that! Please correct your post. I always take full drive images!

Retired Geek..  Yikes! Big apologies. You are right. I was not paying close enough attention to who said what. Thank you for bringing this to my attention! I have enjoyed your posts over the years and do know that you are big on image backups and Powershell. I’ve learned some things from you and I just learned another.  In an active thread, pay close attention before clicking “Quote”!

Desktop Asus TUF X299 Mark 1, CPU: Intel Core i7-7820X Skylake-X 8-Core 3.6 GHz, RAM: 32GB, GPU: Nvidia GTX 1050 Ti 4GB. Display: Four 27" 1080p screens 2 over 2 quad.

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RetiredGeek, PL1

TechTango wrote:

I was not paying close enough attention to who said what.

It was just a simple mis-quote.

Alan_uk wrote:

All my backups are individual partition images.

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TechTango

TechTango wrote:

That’s ok for many purposes, but for the most efficient whole drive restore/recovery option I’d recommend you image the entire drive in a single step. All partitions together as a single Macrium image including the EFI System Partition and the Recovery Partition

The reason for separate partition backups is they have different backup schedules. E.g. H: is my main data drive and gets backed up automatically twice per day. G: audio/photos say every month before I delete the photos on the camera/phone. SysRes+MSR+C: full once a year and then incremental before each Windows Update. And so on.

TechTango wrote:

I’d also suggest enabling the Macrium verification tool as well. It’s in “Other Tasks” along the top.

I’ve always had that set.

TechTango wrote:

Lastly, while this is not something everyone wants to do, I have two identical NVMe 870 EVO drives. I rotate them as the active C: drive.

Certainly an idea I will consider.

Alex5723 wrote:

Have you tried the solutions at : Macrium Reflect MFT Corrupt Error in Windows 10/11? [Fixed] Many users receive the “MFT corrupt – Error code = 6. Please run ‘chkdsk C: /r’”

I was hesitant to do this after I read on another forum a MR user had the Error 23 then ran chkdsk C: /f /r /x  then got Error 6 and then ran chkdsk C: /r and lost the whole drive! But see my next post.

Today I have recovered the drive.

First I remembered I had an experimental Linux PC I built with odds and ends including a 250GB SSD. I thought I would swap the SSDs with my main PC as a temporary measure. Unfortunately the 250GB SSD was a very short SSD and the main PC m/board did not have a mounting point.

However I did put my 500GB SSD with the problem in the Linux PC, not in an M2 slot but in a PCI adapter. I then booted with Macrium Reflect Recovery (MRR) v7.3.6391 on USB stick and tried to backup the SysRes+MSR+C: and F: drives but got the MFT corrupt error. So ran chkdsk C: /r

Stage 1 Deleting corrupt attribute record 0x80 “”
Stage 2 OK
Stage 3 OK
Stage 4 Bad clusters – discovered free space marked as allocated in MFT – corrected

Ran MRR again :

Backed up SysRes+MSR+C: to USB Stick
Bad Sectors – 3 clusters located in used sectors. Data may be lost.
Backed up F: to USB Stick
Bad Sectors – 25 clusters located in used sectors. Data may be lost.

Put Samsung 500GB back into main PC M2_1 slot.
Backed up F: to HDD but got cyclic redundancy Error code 23 – this is MR v8.1 Build 7544

Booted with Macrium Reflect Recovery (MRR) v7.3.6391 on USB stick
Backed up F: to HDD – at 99% got 29 clusters in bad sectors
Backed up SysRes+MSR+C: to HDD – at 99% got 1 cluster in bad sectors

Strange that MR v7.3 and 8.1 are giving different errors plus 8.1 aborts but 7.3 continues.

Conclusion is that the SSD is damaged despite Samsung Magician and CrystalDiskInfo saying it’s OK. But is it a SSD hardware or PC m/board or Windows fault? Windows 10 is very stable but I’m sure I’ve had the old crash.

I then recovered the C: drive to 02/06/24 and then backed up the SysRes+MSR+C: drive using MR v8.1 with no errors! I then ran Windows Update.

One downside is that on restarting the PC then lots of MR schedule jobs start running and many fail but others create fresh full backups.

I then recovered the F: Apps drive to 14/04/2024 and then backed up the F: drive using MR v8.1 with no errors! I will need to reinstall/update a few apps

So I have a clean system. Thank you to everyone that pitched in with ideas.

Going forward I will take a full image of all drives more often as it seems this is more likely to highlight errors compared to mostly running incremental backups. This does mean buying another HDD for the more numerous backups. Maybe I will at last get around to a NAS rather than USB caddies. [Actually I bought a NAS 10 years ago and it was so slow I went for USB caddies].

I am nervous with the SSD. It’s 3 years old and the PC is used for about 10 hours a day. Given how reliant life is now on the internet, I shall likely buy another SSD.  Will I buy another Samsung?

I’ve marked this as Resolved – I hope it is – time will tell.

 

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TechTango

I would re-format the SSD.
Connect it and run Explorer.
Right click on the drive and select Format.
Turn OFF “Quick format”.

Run it overnight, it won’t be fast.

Getting another Samsung is fine – you’d be very unlucky to have 2 fail.

cheers, Paul

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Alan_uk, TechTango