System Image Backup fails

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I have a strange (to me) backup problem.

1. When I try to create a backup using Windows Backup, it fails because it tells me there’s a problem with my “System E:” drive. However, my PC has only one hard drive, C:. Windows backup offers no option to create an image backup without including the D:, and E: drives, which are all partitions on the C: drive. So I can’t use Windows Backup to do a system image backup.

2. When trying to use Acronis TrueImage Home (the full version), the free Paragon System Backup and the free EaseUS ToDo backup they also fail for what amounts to the same problem.

So it looks like I can’t do a system image backup as long as the “System E:” drive is part of the backup.

Finally, I’ve tried Ocster 1-Click Backup, which also won’t do the system backup with the E: drive included, but it will allow me to deselect the E: drive, and then it does a successful image backup, with subsequent successful incremental backups.

However, I now have a question: will a system image backup of just my C: drive (which obviously contains the D: and E: drives) be sufficient to do a full system restore (from the provided CD rescue disc), considering that I’ve excluded the D: and E: drives?

Can anyone explain the ins and outs of this problem and the (apparent) solution I’ve found? Since I have an “all-in-one” desktop PC that has room for only one internal HD, I have no way of testing the Ocster 1-Click restore feature without risking losing everything if it doesn’t work.

Thank you in advance.

Frank D

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Frank,

???What are you backing up TO ???

Zig

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I’m backing up to a 500 GB external USB (WD Elements) drive, which I’ve been using with no problems for about two years.

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Hi Frank, can you post an image like this example. 32653-Make-an-Image-and-post-it

32652-RR

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RodeRunner,

Here’s the image. Drive H: is a RAM drive I use just for Firefox’s cache.

32656-Capture

Frank

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You do NOT have to Image the whole disk when you create an Image with Acronis. You can choose any or all partitions during the Image setup.

Acronis True Image 2013: (just check mark the partition you wish to Image)

32654-ChoosePartitionToImage

I also have both Acronis TIH 2010 and 2011 and both give a similar screen when you start the Image.

You can also boot from the Acronis Rescue Disk (you did burn an Acronis Rescue Disk didn’t you) and create your Image from there thusly eliminating Windows from the equation. This is how I always create my Images.

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Medico,

Thanks for that info. Yes, I burned the rescue CD for Acronis TIH as well as the one for Ocster. Please note that I have no trouble with using the restore CD — I just can’t do the full system image backup as long as the E: drive is included.

I have used Acronis before this latest happening, and can revert to it as you suggest, but at this point I’m favoring using Ocster (a) because it’s so simple and does just what I want with no tweaking other than to deselect the D: and E: drives, and (b) because of the following: (http://www.ocster.com/ocster-1-click-backup/en#details) It uses “reverse incremental storage (block level), a special kind of incremental storage that avoids the drawbacks of normal incremental or differential backup algorithms.”

With this feature, instead of the first full backup being the big one and each subsequent incremental being a smaller summary of only the current time period’s changes, with Ocster the last incremental backup is the big one and has all the latest disk changes incorporated into it, so that the last one is the only one you really need for a full restore, and restoring is certain and quick (at least that’s what they promise, so it yet remains to be seen). And if you want to revert to an earlier backup you can do that by choosing from a list sorted by date. You can also restore individual files from the image backup by having the program mount the image as a separate disk.

It’s a choice I’m making at the moment, hoping it’s a good one in the long run.

Frank

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If the imaging application is wanting to include another partition, it usually means that some components of the boot process reside there.
Open an elevated command prompt and type “BCDedit” to see where bootmgr resides.

32657-bootmgr

I recommend that you include the system “E” drive in the backup if bootmgr is there.

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CLiNT,

Here is the data from the BCDedit command:

32658-Clipboard01

It appears that everything is on the C: drive.

Does that give us what we need to know? Thanks!

Frank

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Hi Frank, Unplug all connected drives unless your using one of them to make your back-up image.
If you have Acronis installed, do a ‘One Click’ back-up from within Windows.
–
Copied from Acronis User Guide:-

To be better prepared for a disaster, you need to make a full backup of your system disk (or at the
very least the partition containing Windows and your applications). To make this task easier, Acronis
has provided the One-Click Backup feature that allows you to back up the system partition and MBR
during the first start of the newly installed program.

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Roderunner,

I did a repair install of Acronis (just to be sure it was in good working order) and tried to do a One-Click backup to my G: (external USB) drive. Acronis refused to recognize my USB drive and insisted that I use my DVD drive, which of course I would not do. The “used space” on my C:, D:, and E: drives (the total amount to be backed up) is 160 GB and the free space on my 500 GB USB drive is 175 GB. So technically there’s enough space, but Acronis doesn’t think so. The used space on my USB drive is 280 GB, which is the aggregate size of the current backups of my two PCs, and I’m not about to delete them just to run a test of Acronis One-Click backup. So, for me Acronis at the present time is a No-Go.

Frank

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If your boot manager (bootmgr) is located on the “C” drive there should be no reason for any imaging application to not exclude drive “E”,
unless some other component of the OS is reliant on that drive to function.
[The top of your command box detailing bootmgr is not visible]

What is in the “E” and “H” drives?
If “H” is a USB drive unplug it.

Can you effectively remove them and recover their respective spaces for the “C” drive without messing up your ability to do a factory restore via the “D” drive?

I agree with Roderunner, you should at least have the entire disk imaged too in the event of an issue.

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CLiNT,

Sorry about the command box. Here it is again, showing all the data:

It looks like the boot manager is on the E: drive.

The E: drive contains the following:

The H: drive is a RAM drive that I use to hold the contents of the Firefox cache. It doesn’t figure in any backup.

At this point it looks like I have no choice but to delete my current C: drive backups from the external USB drive (G) to free up space and try the One-Click Acronis backup again.

Frank

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Frank, this is my method of working.
My 2 pc’s have rather small hdd’s (1 in each), My C: Drive’s are 45gb each with nothing I can’t replace put in them. I have 4 large external hdd’s where I store everything (drag & drop or copy & paste) I don’t want to lose. I also have some copies on D: Drive (Partition) for quick access to them.

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Frank, this is my method of working.
My 2 pc’s have rather small hdd’s (1 in each), My C: Drive’s are 45gb each with nothing I can’t replace put in them. I have 4 large external hdd’s where I store everything (drag & drop or copy & paste) I don’t want to lose. I also have some copies on D: Drive (Partition) for quick access to them.
P.S. Do you know what size your back-up will be?

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Frank, this is my method of working.
My 2 pc’s have rather small hdd’s (1 in each), My C: Drive’s are 45gb each with nothing I can’t replace put in them. I have 4 large external hdd’s where I store everything (drag & drop or copy & paste) I don’t want to lose. I also have some copies on D: Drive (Partition) for quick access to them.
P.S. Do you know what size your back-up will be?

Roderunner,

You are knowledgeable with PCs and have your ways of working with them. On the other hand, I am just a lackadaisical PC user that accepts the way the manufacturer has set up my machine, and I want the simplest, most “brain-dead” way of doing everything and keeping everything in shape. All I want to do at this time is to create an image backup of my entire PC with automatic incrementals, with the ability to restore the complete, working PC from the image and to restore individual files and folders from it as well. Acronis was doing that very well up to a short time ago, but for some unknown reason now balks at my E: (system boot) drive, which leaves me at wit’s end as to what to do to get back to that simple time and conditions.

I have completely deleted all the previous backups from my external USB drive and am giving Acronis another shot. Its One-Click option still won’t choose the USB drive although there’s over 400 GB now free. I can’t figure out what logic it’s using, but it seems stupid regardless of how you look at it. So I’m now running Acronis in the full system/disk image backup mode, with all three (C, D, and E) drives included — and drive G: is now accepted as the backup storage medium (go figure). It’s at 87% and still running, so maybe I have a good shot at it. I’ll report back.

Thanks for your advice.

Frank

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Everyone,

Acronis just successfully completed a full system image backup of drives C, D, and E! The backup is on the external USB (G) drive and is 108 GB in size.

I have no idea why it succeeded (and why the One-Click option wouldn’t start), when all previous recent attempts to do this failed.

Thanks to all for your time, your helpful advice, and for sticking with me.

Frank D

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Frank,

There is nothing wrong with using Acronis that way (that’s how I use it) and it’s not hard to do it, either :). Hope the backup completes and you can feel at ease knowing your stuff is properly backed up.

P.S.: Just noticed it completed. Well done.

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Ruirib,

Thanks for your comments!

At last I can breathe easily again, knowing I’ve got full system backup coverage in the event of a serious PC problem.

Frank

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Frank, as all my files are stored individually in 2 or 3 external hdd’s I can access them at any time. With almost nothing put on C:drive, 45GB, it takes under 8 minutes to make a back-up (4-5GB in size) restores are even faster if needed.
Glad you got it working.

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Frank,

One thing I do each time I create an Image, restore the Image right after creating it. This is conclusive proof that the Image will work when you really need it. It can be kind of scary the first couple times you do this because when you Restore an Image, it first formats the partition, then restores it.

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Frank,

One thing I do each time I create an Image, restore the Image right after creating it. This is conclusive proof that the Image will work when you really need it. It can be kind of scary the first couple times you do this because when you Restore an Image, it first formats the partition, then restores it.

Medico,

Since I have only one hard drive in my PC, that would be asking for trouble. What would I do if the Image didn’t work, after a defective Restore operation deleted my hard drive’s contents? It would be great if I had a second, internal, identical hard drive that I could test it on, but with only one, as in my case, I don’t see it as viable. These all-in-one PCs are great for saving space, but room for only one HD is a limitation in this regard.

Frank

P.S. There is a validate function in Acronis and I’m running it right now. It looks as if that’s as close as I can get to certainty that a backup image will work when and if it’s needed. Now if I had one of the pricier versions of Windows 7 I could actually test the backup without running it. Here’s the pertinent info, from the Acronis Help file:

“Booting from tib images containing Windows 7 – Users of the Windows 7 Enterprise and Windows 7 Ultimate can boot from a tib image containing a backup of their system partition. This will allow testing the bootability of the backed up system without actual recovery. If the operating system boots from the tib file, then it will definitely boot after recovery from that tib file.”

How’s that for “missing the boat” on my part, since I have only the lowly Windows 7 Home Premium and a single HD PC.

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Frank,

I understand Medico’s suggestion, but I also understand your objection and you do express a valid concern. Not only with this, but also in other circumstances where you need to test backup restores (SQL Server databases, for example), when possible, I prefer to test the restore on a different system. You cannot be sure if everything works until you fully test it, but with an image backup, validating it and mounting it as an additional drive and checking that you can, indeed, browse through your files without issues, can be the next best thing. At least, you check whether your data is there and accessible, which can ensure you won’t lose the data in case a problem occurs. That’s the very least you can hope for, so if you can do it, I’d say it provides a sufficient, even if not optimal, solution.

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Thanks, Ruirib,

You’ve summed up my situation.

By the way, the Acronis validation of the full system image that I just did ended without a notice or an error message, so I must assume that everything checked out OK. The validation took just about as long as the original backup (about 2 hours) and occupied a lot of system resources, which intruded on other things I was doing, so I won’t be doing that too often. But it was worth doing once.

Why don’t system builders at least offer the option of additional internal drives on all-in-one machines? Or externally-mounted bootable drives? I guess that would be a niche audience and wouldn’t be cost-effective to manufacture. So, I unknowingly opted for a limited system when I bought this PC. Oh well, the price was right. If there’s another PC in my future it will still be a desktop, but it won’t be an all-in-one.

Frank

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Yeah, you have found one of the big cons of all-in-ones – they are cost effective, but do have some limitations, and expansibility is one of them.

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Frank, the only back-up apps I have used are Norton Ghost 9 & Acronis. They have never failed me in doing a restore. As stated earlier I only do ‘One-Click’ backups to a different folder each time, and they don’t get moved nor do I defrag the drive their on as it could damage the back-up files making them unusable.

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Frank, I also understand the concerns. That is why I said it’s scary the first couple of times. After that, no problem because as RR said, I have NEVER had Acronis fail me.

In my case, even if I have an Image fail, my next older Image is only one month old at most.

If you have another drive to use, by all means use it. The problem might be that the Imaging app might see the second drive as a new drive and will not restore to it without some additional steps. With Acronis, you would need the Plus Pack add-on to accomplish this. I am not sure about other apps. Also the drivers for the second disk might not work properly with the Image from the first disk.

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If you have another drive to use, by all means use it. The problem might be that the Imaging app might see the second drive as a new drive and will not restore to it without some additional steps. With Acronis, you would need the Plus Pack add-on to accomplish this. I am not sure about other apps. Also the drivers for the second disk might not work properly with the Image from the first disk.

Ted,
Acronis will always restore to another the disk. What may happen is that you may not be able to boot from that restore, especially if located in another computer and that is where the pack add-on could help (if it worked – the only time I tried to use it, it failed miserably and I never upgraded it since). Again, it is not the same as actually booting from the disk, but checking this restore to see if you can randomly access your files, can be sufficient assurance that your data is safe.

The reasoning that Acronis has never failed you (and it has never failed me either) can be used to spare you from actually having to restore every image you create. I actually never restore. Image verification and mounting is what I use and I do rely on the fact that on the few occasions Acronis was needed, it worked flawlessly. It’s a pretty good assurance for me.

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Ruirib,

As you say,

I actually never restore. Image verification and mounting is what I use and I do rely on the fact that on the few occasions Acronis was needed, it worked flawlessly. It’s a pretty good assurance for me.

After I verified my new Acronis full system image backup I mounted it and verified that I can copy and paste files I selected from it. So I feel secure.

Frank

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Medico,

No, I have no other drive I can use, because you can only boot from an internal drive, and there’s only room for one in an all-in-one PC. If I had a regular PC, with room for another drive, there would be no problem, since all I would have to do is switch the cables on the drives. As I said, I’m only interested in standard setups and least-difficult options. In my case, that would be to use a reliable backup program (like Acronis) and do a full system image backup with incrementals.

Frank

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Whichever method works for you to assure yourself the Image will work when truly needed.

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